Under 18s and the Official Secrets Act
The Official Secrets Acts ( note the plural) are incorporated into U.K. legislation. "Signing " them is just an admission that you are aware of the implications, since you are ( if a U.K. citizen) subject to them in any event. Not having signed them is no defence in the event of their violation.
Whilst we are on the topic of such legislation, the "right of the press not to disclose it's sources" is another myth that has no standing in law.
Whilst we are on the topic of such legislation, the "right of the press not to disclose it's sources" is another myth that has no standing in law.
Last edited by Haraka; 12th Jun 2015 at 05:27.
There is the so-called 'public interest defence', ie whistle-blowing. That was initially considered by that rather odious harridan of a fish-wife, Bettina Jordan-Barber, the civil servant who was recently released from prison after being convicted of corruption in public office - accepting over £100,000 from News International to sell stories from the MOD. Interestingly, she wasn't charged with offences under the OSA.
She pleaded guilty but claims that her only mistake 'was to accept money'. Yes, well, having money wired to a Thomas Cook Office and picking it up whilst wearing a disguise.
Read and feel sick:
Bettina Jordan-Barber: The ex MoD strategist who went to jail after telling The Sun about military shortages - and taking money for it - Crime - UK - The Independent
PS: I'm still awaiting the apology from the Service for being falsely accused of leaking a story to the media in 2009, which was leaked by Bette. This guttersnipe stood by watching my career evaporate whilst she raked in the cash.
She pleaded guilty but claims that her only mistake 'was to accept money'. Yes, well, having money wired to a Thomas Cook Office and picking it up whilst wearing a disguise.
Read and feel sick:
Bettina Jordan-Barber: The ex MoD strategist who went to jail after telling The Sun about military shortages - and taking money for it - Crime - UK - The Independent
PS: I'm still awaiting the apology from the Service for being falsely accused of leaking a story to the media in 2009, which was leaked by Bette. This guttersnipe stood by watching my career evaporate whilst she raked in the cash.
First signed it age 15 or 16 when I joined the Royal Observer Corps (well someone had to) and we were asked to re-sign every 2 or 3 years. Subsequently re - signed on being appointed a CI in the ATC and when being commisioned in the RAFVR(T); I think I had to when I relinquished my commision too.
I certainly had to sign it on joining NATCS (now NATS) as it was part of the Board of Trade and we were civil servants.
I certainly had to sign it on joining NATCS (now NATS) as it was part of the Board of Trade and we were civil servants.
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South of the ex-North Devon flying club. North of Isca.
Age: 48
Posts: 155
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Same here Mogwi . Can't remember signing anything at the CIO, but certainly had to sign it post demob when entering another job that required my clearances above and beyond a basic check.
That being said I'm sure I completed my PV(S) paperwork at 16 when I first applied for a job in the mob.
That being said I'm sure I completed my PV(S) paperwork at 16 when I first applied for a job in the mob.
Last edited by Fluffy Bunny; 15th Jun 2015 at 10:20.
Why do these 'well to do' characters all have inbred sounding names?
I suspect that the CPS selected the corruption in public office charges rather than ones from the OSA to avoid the public interest 'defence'.
The other point, about OSA, is that it is universal in its application. No one needs to sign it for it to apply, exactly the same as for other legislation.
Since 1989 in order to obtain a conviction under the OSA it has been necessary that the unauthorised disclosure caused actual damage to Security and Intelligence, Defence, Foreign Relations etc as quite closely defined in the Act.
whenurhappy
I think you are correct. Given one of the subjects was kit shortages, I'm not sure the raft of Ministers who lied about this would care to be called as witnesses.
On the other hand, these shortages and lies were well-known, so it seems odd the Sun would pay for the information. I'd speculate they wanted to get their hooks into a source.
If she hadn't taken money, she'd have been fine. That she now profits from selling her experiences is beyond the pale. But she's in good company. A raft of Ministers.....
I suspect that the CPS selected the corruption in public office charges rather than ones from the OSA to avoid the public interest 'defence'.
I think you are correct. Given one of the subjects was kit shortages, I'm not sure the raft of Ministers who lied about this would care to be called as witnesses.
On the other hand, these shortages and lies were well-known, so it seems odd the Sun would pay for the information. I'd speculate they wanted to get their hooks into a source.
If she hadn't taken money, she'd have been fine. That she now profits from selling her experiences is beyond the pale. But she's in good company. A raft of Ministers.....
sua cuique voluptas
Just to add to the general experiences of first contact with OSA.
When you're 17, first job, away from home etc., you sign whatever you're damn well told to sign without giving it much further thought. This was in 1963 at UKAEA Harwell when going through our induction training as Scientific Assistants - the Lowest Form of Scientific Life on site. Mind you, the AEA Police at the gates did have guns, which sort of impressed us at that age.
A few months later, by the time we had spent our last week in classrooms and labs under the benevolent gaze of the GLEEP reactor, the Cockroft-Walton generator and the Megajoule capacitor Bank in Hangar 8 , this sense of awe had diminished to the point that the amount of "stores" vanishing through main gate at outmuster on the last Friday embarrassed even us when the total haul was examined back in our hostel. No wheelbarrow liberation was attempted: probably what saved us.
The goodies kept some of us busy enhancing our newly learned electronic and mechanical skills in our spare time for years, probably not what the course instructors had intended, but on balance was rather cost-effective post-course training. Even today my domestic copper pipe-work is done to experimental lab vacuum standards!
The only official advice that we were given by some of the older atomic workers was that if we ever saw smoke coming out of the BEPO reactor chimney in the middle of the site it was probably already too late to run.....
Damn, my Horlick has gone cold.
Ripline
When you're 17, first job, away from home etc., you sign whatever you're damn well told to sign without giving it much further thought. This was in 1963 at UKAEA Harwell when going through our induction training as Scientific Assistants - the Lowest Form of Scientific Life on site. Mind you, the AEA Police at the gates did have guns, which sort of impressed us at that age.
A few months later, by the time we had spent our last week in classrooms and labs under the benevolent gaze of the GLEEP reactor, the Cockroft-Walton generator and the Megajoule capacitor Bank in Hangar 8 , this sense of awe had diminished to the point that the amount of "stores" vanishing through main gate at outmuster on the last Friday embarrassed even us when the total haul was examined back in our hostel. No wheelbarrow liberation was attempted: probably what saved us.
The goodies kept some of us busy enhancing our newly learned electronic and mechanical skills in our spare time for years, probably not what the course instructors had intended, but on balance was rather cost-effective post-course training. Even today my domestic copper pipe-work is done to experimental lab vacuum standards!
The only official advice that we were given by some of the older atomic workers was that if we ever saw smoke coming out of the BEPO reactor chimney in the middle of the site it was probably already too late to run.....
Damn, my Horlick has gone cold.
Ripline
