Direct rule from Scotland?
Better together - It works both ways. History will judge Cameron & Clegg in a much better light than the present. By forming a strong coalition at a time when minority government would have been disasterous, they have given us the platform for recovery, irrespective of your politics. Sadly it heralds the collapse of Liberal support as those to the left of centre react badly to courting the enemy. Who knows whats going to happen. Can't wait for the TV debates...
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I agree thatthe Coalition has done well - but there are also a lot of right wing Tories who loathe the idea - they sank the electoral reform deal with the LibDems which came back in spades when the LibDems sank the redrawing of boundaries - thus costing the Tories about 10 seats in May..............
I see the cuts on North Sea taxes would have cost an independent Scotland approximately 10% of its taxable income. It was going to be in trouble when the price dropped below $100 /bbl; it would be heading for bankruptcy now.
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Change is horrible and expensive, and you have to find all kinds of new ways to solve your problems. But if the SNP and Labour did win, and we got a de-facto break up of the UK, with the deterrent scrapped and all kinds of Greek-style spending decisions - there would be a rebalance.
In the in/out referendum the rest of the UK did not get a say. I'm sure that in the aftermath of a Scottish highjack, devo max +++ would probably be insisted upon by the English electorate. Think of the benefits:
We could hand back all the "foreign" MPs - like Galloway.
We could let them have the 2 mahoussive carriers; originally future proofed and built large for catapult operations - now excessively large for VSTOL ops.
We could build and base all our own ships and submarines etc etc
But that would be very unfair on the majority of Scots who did NOT vote for the SNP in the referendum.
Surely such decisions are subject to a debate in the House - and an awful lot of jobs rely on the industries threatened.
In the in/out referendum the rest of the UK did not get a say. I'm sure that in the aftermath of a Scottish highjack, devo max +++ would probably be insisted upon by the English electorate. Think of the benefits:
We could hand back all the "foreign" MPs - like Galloway.
We could let them have the 2 mahoussive carriers; originally future proofed and built large for catapult operations - now excessively large for VSTOL ops.
We could build and base all our own ships and submarines etc etc
But that would be very unfair on the majority of Scots who did NOT vote for the SNP in the referendum.
Surely such decisions are subject to a debate in the House - and an awful lot of jobs rely on the industries threatened.
If the polls are correct about the SNP and they hold the balance of power, the Scottish Labour leader Jim Murphy will find himself in an intriguing position.
He and Salmond both blown out of the water in the space of 9 months then finding themselves allies in powerful positions.
He and Salmond both blown out of the water in the space of 9 months then finding themselves allies in powerful positions.
dervish,
Just how did Salmond get "blown out of the water"? He went from well behind in the original polls to within a hairs breath of winning the referendum. I can't see Jim Murphy being in a "powerful position", leader of Labour in Scotland with just a handful of westminster MPs and in opposition in the Scottish Parliament.
The people co-operating will be Salmond and Milliband if your scenario comes to pass, which I believe it will. Murphy will be an irrelevance.
Just how did Salmond get "blown out of the water"? He went from well behind in the original polls to within a hairs breath of winning the referendum. I can't see Jim Murphy being in a "powerful position", leader of Labour in Scotland with just a handful of westminster MPs and in opposition in the Scottish Parliament.
The people co-operating will be Salmond and Milliband if your scenario comes to pass, which I believe it will. Murphy will be an irrelevance.
But that would be very unfair on the majority of Scots who did NOT vote for the SNP in the referendum.
Why not go the whole way and 'Balkanise' the UK . Economics have already done that .
As a good example on one of the day time property show a decent terraced 3 bed house in NI sold for 45k , following program had some hideous Russian woman in London arguing with her Polish builder over completion dates so she could install her 50k bed. That is an awful disparity in a very small country.
So allow Scotland NI amd Wales to go their own way. Yorkshire and NE is probably another area as in the NW. Pretty easy to cut up the rest and cut London adrift , it is after all full of 'foreigners' and criminals and we in the SE can charge them massive sums for food, water, sewage, use of airspace electricity etc etc etc.
Thats alla bit tongue in cheek but sadly the one size fits all model just doesnt work for us any more. Unlike much of Europe we dont have significant third and fourth parties who balance out different coalitions over time or in the US where the Feds only control so much of day to day life and even at the Federal level there are often balances between executive ad legislative.
Can any one here really claim that first past the post with its violent 'mood swings' has really served this country well since WW2?
As a good example on one of the day time property show a decent terraced 3 bed house in NI sold for 45k , following program had some hideous Russian woman in London arguing with her Polish builder over completion dates so she could install her 50k bed. That is an awful disparity in a very small country.
So allow Scotland NI amd Wales to go their own way. Yorkshire and NE is probably another area as in the NW. Pretty easy to cut up the rest and cut London adrift , it is after all full of 'foreigners' and criminals and we in the SE can charge them massive sums for food, water, sewage, use of airspace electricity etc etc etc.
Thats alla bit tongue in cheek but sadly the one size fits all model just doesnt work for us any more. Unlike much of Europe we dont have significant third and fourth parties who balance out different coalitions over time or in the US where the Feds only control so much of day to day life and even at the Federal level there are often balances between executive ad legislative.
Can any one here really claim that first past the post with its violent 'mood swings' has really served this country well since WW2?
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"If you hold the balance, you hold the power". Alex Salmond on The Marr Show, today. Nobody can accuse Mr Salmond of not being upfront about his intentions to use every electoral opportunity to wield power.
Originally Posted by BigBux
We could hand back all the "foreign" MPs - like Galloway.
No, your sarcasm wasn't lost on me. Just raising a point. NOI.
But it's going to be OK as the Tory candidate for Bradford West may just get elected leaving that idiot Galloway nowhere else to go apart from Scotland or a couple of places in the Middle East.
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Minority governments in the UK are inherently unstable and short-lived for the rather obvious reason that they can't push through legislation.
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Fears of an SNP takeover are coming to life; yesterday one of their top people, Stewart Hosie, laid it on the line that they would block defence spending if Mr Milliband refused to scrap Trident. This could lead to unpaid salaries and delays in equipment projects. In the normal run of parliamentary process this doesn't happen even when parties have major differences. But in the SNP case they would prefer the UK didn't exist so the more mayhem the better
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Being interviewed on BBC this morning, the Scot Nat spokesman stated that they would scrap Trident and use the money to bring in maritime patrol aircraft. Now I thought that the primary function of the MPA was to protect Trident?
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SNP position.
My sketchy understanding is the SNP will expel Trident from the Faslane base as quickly as they can - no longer based there, meaning the submarine will seek a new base-Plymouth Devonport probably.
I can see Labour going this as its a headline solution-keeps the SNP on their side of the house division, and keeps us (the remainder of the UK) with a nuclear weapon system for a little bit of time. But yes of course England will have no real support facility at Devonport because that is in Scotland. USA to the rescue here, in that capacity, for a time? Beyond that general UK disintegration will somehow occur, bit by bit. Thatcherism from beyond the grave..she must be laughing. She hated the Scots, among many other things (football, railways, trades unions). No way SNP will sanction increased defence spending, I think and guess their vision is for a much more Scando style future for the nation. Its just chickens coming home to roost.
I can see Labour going this as its a headline solution-keeps the SNP on their side of the house division, and keeps us (the remainder of the UK) with a nuclear weapon system for a little bit of time. But yes of course England will have no real support facility at Devonport because that is in Scotland. USA to the rescue here, in that capacity, for a time? Beyond that general UK disintegration will somehow occur, bit by bit. Thatcherism from beyond the grave..she must be laughing. She hated the Scots, among many other things (football, railways, trades unions). No way SNP will sanction increased defence spending, I think and guess their vision is for a much more Scando style future for the nation. Its just chickens coming home to roost.
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I disagree with everything Galliway says, but the world of politics would be far worse off without him.
He is the best debater and orator I have seen by a country mile.
Watch the video of him destroying a senate inquiry. Awesome
He is the best debater and orator I have seen by a country mile.
Watch the video of him destroying a senate inquiry. Awesome
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"no way SNP would sanction increased defence spending..." Thats a gigantic understatement! They would be in a position to block EVERY vote concerning defence, and vote to divert funds in favour of other expensive projects which would take chunks out of the existing budget. If that rendered the UK defenceless, as far as they're concerned, so what?
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**bonus stars for Hang shuff for somehow getting in a mention for Mrs Thatcher here. Did she hate Scotland? How would you know -her party were/are firmly committed to the union; it's even in the name. Trade unions? Ok nothing to do with the thread but I'll bite, and I write as a fully paid up trade union member. Would you really prefer to live in a country where the likes of Scargill or Gormley could turn your electricity off at will?
Nicola Sturgeon has had a good teacher in the "tell them how it is going to be" before we actually win anything show thanks to Wee Eck. I think Scotland should be Independent, and am I also certain Scotland could be Independent but not with Wee Eck and his puppet running the show, which is why the majority said no.