Putin threatens NATO & EU ?
Curious racedo, your response to me mentions everything but Ukraine. You're predisposed to find fault no matter what direction the US takes. Your body of work speaks to it so save yourself a response.
Curious racedo, your response to me mentions everything but Ukraine. You're predisposed to find fault no matter what direction the US takes.
All interfering in rights of other countrys rather than leaving them alone.
I distinguish the ineptitude of a countrys Political Leadership and its Foreign Policy to the people of that country as there is a real difference.
Frankly if people knew what their Govt really got up to there would be lots of internal revolutions.
I read what the propoganda merchants want people to believe on economies and then look for the facts.
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All interfering in rights of other countrys rather than leaving them alone.
So I hear you say, we should be better than them and not do it due to our moral superiority. Well theres nothing in nature thats says the righteous has to prevail, in fact its the opposite. Nature says the strong will survive.
Hence you either try for a good outcome for yourself/ country or run the risk of falling some time down the track. Life's unfair.
The US policy WRT the Ukraine has been to condemn Vlad's actions and to do its best to ensure he doesn't annex anymore than he already has. Had the US "left the issue alone" Vlad arguably would have taken the rest of the Ukraine. Certainly Ukraine's neighbors thought so. Euro action alone wouldn't have stopped him.
You go off on a tangent talking about generalizations of government incompetency. You might get a few head from nods from fellow US bashers but you've not said a damn thing.
You're being called out, man up or shut up. Explain EXACTLY how US policy is to blame with regard to Ukraine. If your comfortable condemning US policy, then you should be just as comfortable explaining how the US is to blame in the Ukraine.
I'm not so biased to say the US hasn't cocked up things in the past and surely will in the future. I however look at policy on a case by case basis, and avoid broadly condemning actions. Might work well in the cocktail circuit but doesn't do anything but call your bias into question.
Face it, no matter the situation, you are predisposed to point your finger at the US.
You go off on a tangent talking about generalizations of government incompetency. You might get a few head from nods from fellow US bashers but you've not said a damn thing.
You're being called out, man up or shut up. Explain EXACTLY how US policy is to blame with regard to Ukraine. If your comfortable condemning US policy, then you should be just as comfortable explaining how the US is to blame in the Ukraine.
I'm not so biased to say the US hasn't cocked up things in the past and surely will in the future. I however look at policy on a case by case basis, and avoid broadly condemning actions. Might work well in the cocktail circuit but doesn't do anything but call your bias into question.
Face it, no matter the situation, you are predisposed to point your finger at the US.
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I read what the propoganda merchants want people to believe on economies and then look for the facts.
Further to that (and your previous response to me), Russia might have wealth, but it doesn't have the wealth it did a few years ago. It doesn't have as much flexibility in varying how it derives it, it has fewer options where it draws it from and she has greater demands, bleaker prospects, worsening conditions, far fewer friends and rapidly reduced options. She doesn't have the money she needs or want for the future she has promised her people.
America is addicted to borrowing, but only in the way that Russia and China are addicted to lending. How else could Russia and China get meaningful exposure to the west? It's a weakness for Obama, but also one for those who hold the debt (owe the bank £100,000 and it owns you, owe it £100,000,000 though and you own it). What is Putin going to do now, flood the market with US sovereign debt to prove a point? Hardly.
The US/Israeli comparison is a pointless one and no one is suggesting Russia is going to be invaded and it doesn't matter either that Russia doesn't use the dollar (her currency has fallen almost 20% this year). That is the only silver lining, ie; she exports in dollars and spends in rubles, so the horrific devaluation means there are more rubles kicking around. But Putin has spent $13 billions alone this month to support the ruble and keep it from free fall. He might be managing the battle but he is losing the war. And investors are hard nosed people. They won't forget in a hurry.
Forgetting for one moment, the Kremlin sofa cushions are being groped behind daily for shrapnel, and the fact that the state has effectively stolen the state pension fund for two years running (Maxwell would be proud), the oligarchs didn't exist 100 years ago either and it's probably going to be them turning the screw on the Colonels and Generals, quietly. Putin should be worried, look how he is trying to keep them sweet. As recently as late last week the Russian government announced it was planning to shelve infrastructure and social projects too, and actually forecasting recession if this goes on any further.
Russia is in a situation that will affect her far more than a similar set of circumstances would affect a far more mature, evolved and diversified (50% of Russia foreign income comes from natural resources) economy in similar foreign policy straits. And it was against that backdrop that I posed my question a day or so ago. Could Putin decide to deflect attention to save his own career/skin? I think/hope that realpolitik will kick in and he'll blink, he knows how resolute the west can be with sanctions (Iran?) and he knows that the west will tolerate only so much sand being kicked in its face by a bloke with a private gym and an inferiority complex.
You're being called out, man up or shut up. Explain EXACTLY how US policy is to blame with regard to Ukraine. If your comfortable condemning US policy, then you should be just as comfortable explaining how the US is to blame in the Ukraine.
I'm not so biased to say the US hasn't cocked up things in the past and surely will in the future.
I'm not so biased to say the US hasn't cocked up things in the past and surely will in the future.
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Putin is great, seeing a leader push back against the western elite is brilliant indeed. He is working against the EU, so that's one good point, he is also working against Washington, so yet another good point.
Putin has been totally right about all the western interventions in the middle east. He is a far more effective and logical world leader than Washington can ever hope to be.
As Russia and China grow closer together we are seeing the creation of the future dominant power block in the world. India, Brazil, South Africa, Iran, Cuba, Venezuela, Ecuador, Bolivia, Nicaragua, Argentina, DPRK and Syria are with them to.
One can tell Washington is worried as the Russian and Chinese forces combined are vastly superior to those of the US and from this point on the US military will grow weaker and smaller. All empires fall in the end!
Putin has been totally right about all the western interventions in the middle east. He is a far more effective and logical world leader than Washington can ever hope to be.
As Russia and China grow closer together we are seeing the creation of the future dominant power block in the world. India, Brazil, South Africa, Iran, Cuba, Venezuela, Ecuador, Bolivia, Nicaragua, Argentina, DPRK and Syria are with them to.
One can tell Washington is worried as the Russian and Chinese forces combined are vastly superior to those of the US and from this point on the US military will grow weaker and smaller. All empires fall in the end!
Further to that (and your previous response to me), Russia might have wealth, but it doesn't have the wealth it did a few years ago. It doesn't have as much flexibility in varying how it derives it, it has fewer options where it draws it from and she has greater demands, bleaker prospects, worsening conditions, far fewer friends and rapidly reduced options. She doesn't have the money she needs or want for the future she has promised her people.
In 2013 it was $89.84........................... which would you rather have ?
Someone already mentioned the Pension steal but UK has had £100 ($160) billion stolen from its pensions since 1997.
Putin is great, seeing a leader push back against the western elite is brilliant indeed. He is working against the EU, so that's one good point, he is also working against Washington, so yet another good point.
Putin has been totally right about all the western interventions in the middle east. He is a far more effective and logical world leader than Washington can ever hope to be.
As Russia and China grow closer together we are seeing the creation of the future dominant power block in the world. India, Brazil, South Africa, Iran, Cuba, Venezuela, Ecuador, Bolivia, Nicaragua, Argentina, DPRK and Syria are with them to.
One can tell Washington is worried as the Russian and Chinese forces combined are vastly superior to those of the US and from this point on the US military will grow weaker and smaller. All empires fall in the end!
Putin has been totally right about all the western interventions in the middle east. He is a far more effective and logical world leader than Washington can ever hope to be.
As Russia and China grow closer together we are seeing the creation of the future dominant power block in the world. India, Brazil, South Africa, Iran, Cuba, Venezuela, Ecuador, Bolivia, Nicaragua, Argentina, DPRK and Syria are with them to.
One can tell Washington is worried as the Russian and Chinese forces combined are vastly superior to those of the US and from this point on the US military will grow weaker and smaller. All empires fall in the end!
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Well racedo, it either comes down to Washington or Moscow/Beijing doesn't it! We know Washington have basically come close to ruining the world though their actions. The political elite in Washington are utterly useless in every respect. Most other western governments appear to be nothing more than puppets and willing accomplices to US foreign policy, a foreign policy that is a total disaster. I think Moscow and Beijing (along with some of the other nations I listed) are about the only ones who can change the existing world order for the better. I would imagine in time that China and India alone will dominate the world each a full and true superpower while Washington will be essentially irrelevant. Russia's best bet is to attach itself to China and India.
Ronald, I think everyone in this forum knows your views on the subject by now. Let's just take it as read that for this and all related threads your opinions are that:
1. Washington and the West are evil
2. Moscow is good
3. China is the future
There, now there's no need for you to chime in any more....
1. Washington and the West are evil
2. Moscow is good
3. China is the future
There, now there's no need for you to chime in any more....
Typhoon Godwin has arrived, right on schedule. 
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Typhoon93, after the disasters of Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and very nearly Syria (still time yet) it became apparent to me (someone who you could describe as your typical pro western average citizen) that western foreign policy is nothing but a total disaster. Basically the world needs someone who can push back enough to ensure western leaders don't always get their own way, someone who can stand against them. Right now the most effective individual at doing that is President Putin. Nations like China and India as well as various South American nations can also take up this role.
The west was supposed to be engaged in a war on terror but actually its actions have greatly helped terrorists and actually removed various secular dictators who were enemies of the terrorists. In many situations Washington, various Middle Eastern allies and European governments are actually supporting the terrorists ie Libya and Syria. The western attack on Libya, removal of Gaddafi and resulting disintegration of Libya as a nation state was the thing that made me realise western governments were essentially the bad guys. Up until then I was naïve enough to think that Iraq was a kind of honest mistake that no one would repeat! But then after Libya they wanted to remove Assad and follow the same game plan in Syria. Compared to western leaders Putin is a genius.
You mentioned the Nazis, well who is engaged in the most warfare around the world, the clue is it isn't Russia!
The west was supposed to be engaged in a war on terror but actually its actions have greatly helped terrorists and actually removed various secular dictators who were enemies of the terrorists. In many situations Washington, various Middle Eastern allies and European governments are actually supporting the terrorists ie Libya and Syria. The western attack on Libya, removal of Gaddafi and resulting disintegration of Libya as a nation state was the thing that made me realise western governments were essentially the bad guys. Up until then I was naïve enough to think that Iraq was a kind of honest mistake that no one would repeat! But then after Libya they wanted to remove Assad and follow the same game plan in Syria. Compared to western leaders Putin is a genius.
You mentioned the Nazis, well who is engaged in the most warfare around the world, the clue is it isn't Russia!
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Typhoon93, after the disasters of Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and very nearly Syria (still time yet) it became apparent to me (someone who you could describe as your typical pro western average citizen) that western foreign policy is nothing but a total disaster. Basically the world needs someone who can push back enough to ensure western leaders don't always get their own way, someone who can stand against them. Right now the most effective individual at doing that is President Putin. Nations like China and India as well as various South American nations can also take up this role.
The west was supposed to be engaged in a war on terror but actually its actions have greatly helped terrorists and actually removed various secular dictators who were enemies of the terrorists. In many situations Washington, various Middle Eastern allies and European governments are actually supporting the terrorists ie Libya and Syria. The western attack on Libya, removal of Gaddafi and resulting disintegration of Libya as a nation state was the thing that made me realise western governments were essentially the bad guys. Up until then I naïve enough to think that Iraq was a kind of honest mistake that no one would repeat! But then after Libya they wanted to remove Assad and follow the same game plan in Syria. Compared to western leaders Putin is a genius.
You mentioned the Nazis, well who is engaged in the most warfare around the world, the clue is it isn't Russia!
The west was supposed to be engaged in a war on terror but actually its actions have greatly helped terrorists and actually removed various secular dictators who were enemies of the terrorists. In many situations Washington, various Middle Eastern allies and European governments are actually supporting the terrorists ie Libya and Syria. The western attack on Libya, removal of Gaddafi and resulting disintegration of Libya as a nation state was the thing that made me realise western governments were essentially the bad guys. Up until then I naïve enough to think that Iraq was a kind of honest mistake that no one would repeat! But then after Libya they wanted to remove Assad and follow the same game plan in Syria. Compared to western leaders Putin is a genius.
You mentioned the Nazis, well who is engaged in the most warfare around the world, the clue is it isn't Russia!
Do you disagree with going in? Or do you disagree with the way in which NATO forces went in?