BBC 2 : Castles In The Sky
tucumseh
Not on any RAF ground kit in service that I know of since 1998 (bar Spadeadam), maybe a different story for the Navy, but I've never got chance to look at the radar office in any of the ships that I ever have been on (T22,T23,T42) to talk engineering of the kit on board.
Not on any RAF ground kit in service that I know of since 1998 (bar Spadeadam), maybe a different story for the Navy, but I've never got chance to look at the radar office in any of the ships that I ever have been on (T22,T23,T42) to talk engineering of the kit on board.
Last edited by MAINJAFAD; 4th Sep 2014 at 19:53.
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On balance I thought the programme was quite good and certainly worth watching. Yes I would have liked more on the technical background ... but that's just me I guess. Probably a bit rushed at the end in terms of integrating RDF into the Fighter Control infrastructure ... but it was badged as a drama and needed to be watchable/engaging for a majority.
I'm sure there were excerpts from the Battle of Britain film used in the making of this production
Here is the OU follow-up link ...
OU on the BBC: Castles in the Sky - OpenLearn - Open University
Interesting info provided by the OU ... See ... Radar: What happened next?
Coff.
I'm sure there were excerpts from the Battle of Britain film used in the making of this production
Here is the OU follow-up link ...
OU on the BBC: Castles in the Sky - OpenLearn - Open University
Interesting info provided by the OU ... See ... Radar: What happened next?
Coff.
I still remember the H2S magnetron frequency was 9375 Mhz and the klystron frequency was 9330 Mhz giving a "working" beat frequency of 45 Mhz.
Buggered if I can remember my mobile telephone number
I found the programme a bit confusing at times. Why did Lindemann have Watson- Watt excluded from the ops room in the scene towards the end?
Buggered if I can remember my mobile telephone number
I found the programme a bit confusing at times. Why did Lindemann have Watson- Watt excluded from the ops room in the scene towards the end?
From what I have read Lindeman and Tizzard hated each others guts with a passion, come from the BBC book 'The Secret War' by Brian Johnson and R V Jones's book 'Most Secret War'
Would have been good at the end to fade from aa 1940 ops room to the present day at Scampton, maybe use the Battle of Britain documentary fronted by Colin and Ewan McGregor.
Would have been good at the end to fade from aa 1940 ops room to the present day at Scampton, maybe use the Battle of Britain documentary fronted by Colin and Ewan McGregor.
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My own feelings was he was excluded so they could bask in the limelight and take some credit for the work, that and some resentment that he was right.
Excellent show and Beags, one would imagine it will be on catch up, I checked, but it's probably to early for it to be listed.
That's two good new shows in one week, the other new one being about the beginnings of Chester Zoo.
Excellent show and Beags, one would imagine it will be on catch up, I checked, but it's probably to early for it to be listed.
That's two good new shows in one week, the other new one being about the beginnings of Chester Zoo.
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@ MAINJAFAD
A slip of the pen? 
STP
But I've seen footage of RDF mechanics picking up the bodies of dead birds laying at the base of Chain Home transmitter aerials and GCI antennas after picking a very bad place to roast overnight.
STP
Steve
Damm Autochecker. Of course i mean roost, but of course they did a bit of roasting as well.
To be honest, too much drama, not enough factual (in fact quite a bit of it didn't happen like that at all). 10 out of 10 for showing Lindermann as a major hindrance, but that was at the start of the project. He was on the Tizard committee when it formed (he was put on it to keep Churchill quiet), but did nothing but rubbish RDF in an attempt get funding for his own pet projects (Aerial Minefields and Infrared detection). The other members of the committee bar Tizard, Lindermann and Rowe (who was the Secretary) resigned which allowed Tizard to disband and reform it without Lindermann. By the time this happened Watson Watt's team had already built a working system at Orfordness with a range of 80 miles and were well on the way to solving the problems that gave them the real headaches (bearing and height finding). As for bouncing signals of the ionosphere to increase range, totally boll@cks. Reflections off the ionosphere were a major problem with CH (it caused clutter) that required some careful design in radar operating parameters to overcome. By the end of 1935 the Air Ministry were totally committed on building the first 5 CH Stations starting at Bawdsey. As for the end part in the Ops room with an Operational Trial on the eve of the start the Battle of Britain? The first five stations were fully operational by the time of Munich, the command and control bugs were being ironed out (the filter room had just been installed at Bentley Priory and declared operational) and one of the first tracks ever plotted by the RAF C&R network was Chamberlain's aircraft outbound to Germany for his 'peace in our time; meeting with Adolf. Plenty of real operational radar controlled combat intercepts had been done before July 1940. Watson Watt wasn't cut out of anything, he became the director of Bawdsey and in 1938 was promoted to control development of the wider range of radio systems at the Air Ministry.
Ok, its a television drama designed for people that don't know the subject and technical issues don't make good drama and in that light, it does highlight what was done. Though the Telephone in the bucket of water bit wasn't done by Watson Watt, it was favorite of R V Jones. I think Peter Ustinov's 1946 film based on what TRE did from 1938 - 1945 is better, even with its 1940's stereotypes because most of what was shown on film actually happened.
Damm Autochecker. Of course i mean roost, but of course they did a bit of roasting as well.
To be honest, too much drama, not enough factual (in fact quite a bit of it didn't happen like that at all). 10 out of 10 for showing Lindermann as a major hindrance, but that was at the start of the project. He was on the Tizard committee when it formed (he was put on it to keep Churchill quiet), but did nothing but rubbish RDF in an attempt get funding for his own pet projects (Aerial Minefields and Infrared detection). The other members of the committee bar Tizard, Lindermann and Rowe (who was the Secretary) resigned which allowed Tizard to disband and reform it without Lindermann. By the time this happened Watson Watt's team had already built a working system at Orfordness with a range of 80 miles and were well on the way to solving the problems that gave them the real headaches (bearing and height finding). As for bouncing signals of the ionosphere to increase range, totally boll@cks. Reflections off the ionosphere were a major problem with CH (it caused clutter) that required some careful design in radar operating parameters to overcome. By the end of 1935 the Air Ministry were totally committed on building the first 5 CH Stations starting at Bawdsey. As for the end part in the Ops room with an Operational Trial on the eve of the start the Battle of Britain? The first five stations were fully operational by the time of Munich, the command and control bugs were being ironed out (the filter room had just been installed at Bentley Priory and declared operational) and one of the first tracks ever plotted by the RAF C&R network was Chamberlain's aircraft outbound to Germany for his 'peace in our time; meeting with Adolf. Plenty of real operational radar controlled combat intercepts had been done before July 1940. Watson Watt wasn't cut out of anything, he became the director of Bawdsey and in 1938 was promoted to control development of the wider range of radio systems at the Air Ministry.
Ok, its a television drama designed for people that don't know the subject and technical issues don't make good drama and in that light, it does highlight what was done. Though the Telephone in the bucket of water bit wasn't done by Watson Watt, it was favorite of R V Jones. I think Peter Ustinov's 1946 film based on what TRE did from 1938 - 1945 is better, even with its 1940's stereotypes because most of what was shown on film actually happened.
I tend to agree with MAINJAFAD I spent most of the programme with my copy of Taffy Bowen's "Radar Days" open on my lap saying "but it didn't happen like that and, "b@llocks, they were given the valves - they did not steal them!!"
Still to the uninitiated it at least showed the birth of Chain Home / CHL.
Radar101
Still to the uninitiated it at least showed the birth of Chain Home / CHL.
Radar101
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
I have 5 radar history books I would recommend. The first is the most technical tome - and rarest. The last two are more historical reminiscences of operators. The last is a part of the history of RAF GCI little known, a mobile radar advancing through Normandy and France to the Rhine - sometimes finding themselves on a hilltop between the lines!
Technical History of the Beginnings of Radar; S.S. Swords, Peter Peregrinus Ltd on behalf of the Institute of Electrical Engineers. ISBN 0-86341-043-X
A Radar History of World War II - Technical and Military Imperatives; Louis Brown, Institute of Physics Publishing Bristol and Philadelphia. ISBN 0-7503-0659-9
The Invention that Changed the World; Robert Buderi, Simon Schuster. ISBN 0-684-81021-2
Radar - A Wartime Miracle; Colin Lataham and Anne Stobbs, Alan Sutton Publishing Ltd. ISBN 0-7509-1114-X
Off to War with "054", John Kemp, Merlin Books Ltd. ISBN 0-86303-459-4
Technical History of the Beginnings of Radar; S.S. Swords, Peter Peregrinus Ltd on behalf of the Institute of Electrical Engineers. ISBN 0-86341-043-X
A Radar History of World War II - Technical and Military Imperatives; Louis Brown, Institute of Physics Publishing Bristol and Philadelphia. ISBN 0-7503-0659-9
The Invention that Changed the World; Robert Buderi, Simon Schuster. ISBN 0-684-81021-2
Radar - A Wartime Miracle; Colin Lataham and Anne Stobbs, Alan Sutton Publishing Ltd. ISBN 0-7509-1114-X
Off to War with "054", John Kemp, Merlin Books Ltd. ISBN 0-86303-459-4
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I thought it was good television drama with the added bonus that it featured a significant element in our history. Had it been truly factual and accurate the majority of viewers (at whom it was aimed) would have changed channels after ten minutes or so and nothing would have been gained. Even Mrs P, who cringes at anything aeronautical, (who can blame her?) thought it was watchable.
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Thoroughly enjoyed it as TV entertainment.
Impressed once again by Eddy Izzard in a serious roll, and not a false eyelash or stiletto heal in sight!
Sadly I wish the writer, director and editor had put a little more effort into the historical accuracy of the whole story. People will be saying "it's just entertainment and not supposed to be an accurate account of history" however films and tv programmes do end up distorting the truth however unintentional.
As an example I was staying with friends in Las Vegas just after the film U571 came out on DVD. These friends are educated to phd standard and very successful business people.
We decided to watch U571 one evening which we thoroughly enjoyed as a piece of entertainment. Over a before bed tipple we were discussing the film when I mentioned that the film was in fact pretty inaccurate in the respect that it was the British who captured the enigma from U110 in 1941 and the polish had actually captured an earlier version several years beforehand.
My friend's reactions were complete disbelief and swore that nobody would be aloud to re write history in such a way. Fortunately my friends being in the IT business, they were already connected up to the Internet and used to doing research on the Web. The next morning at breakfast my friend apologised to me profusely for not believing what I had said about the film. In his embarrassment he took us out for a very nice lunch at the Bellagio.
Sadly I wish the writer, director and editor had put a little more effort into the historical accuracy of the whole story. People will be saying "it's just entertainment and not supposed to be an accurate account of history" however films and tv programmes do end up distorting the truth however unintentional.
As an example I was staying with friends in Las Vegas just after the film U571 came out on DVD. These friends are educated to phd standard and very successful business people.
We decided to watch U571 one evening which we thoroughly enjoyed as a piece of entertainment. Over a before bed tipple we were discussing the film when I mentioned that the film was in fact pretty inaccurate in the respect that it was the British who captured the enigma from U110 in 1941 and the polish had actually captured an earlier version several years beforehand.
My friend's reactions were complete disbelief and swore that nobody would be aloud to re write history in such a way. Fortunately my friends being in the IT business, they were already connected up to the Internet and used to doing research on the Web. The next morning at breakfast my friend apologised to me profusely for not believing what I had said about the film. In his embarrassment he took us out for a very nice lunch at the Bellagio.
Gentleman Aviator
Ah the cousins' view (or Hollywood's) of WW2!
I seem to recall seeing a B of B scene in a US film - can't remember which one - where the "wonderful new radar" had PPI screens complete with rotating sweep, rather than the actual Chain Home displays comme ça:
I seem to recall seeing a B of B scene in a US film - can't remember which one - where the "wonderful new radar" had PPI screens complete with rotating sweep, rather than the actual Chain Home displays comme ça:
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I watched it for 5 minutes and switched channels I do not do docudramas but I do appreciate I am not a typical viewer. I would think that most viewers only vaguely knew about RDF and this was the background for a play.
I do hope the viewers who watched it all the way through enjoyed it and it makes them investigate the background of the drama further.
I do hope the viewers who watched it all the way through enjoyed it and it makes them investigate the background of the drama further.