Global Aviation Magazine : 60 Years of the Hercules
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Nostalgia
Gradually working my way through all the threads. Sadly not too many photos from me but still searching. Can anyone remember an enforced "holiday" in Alice Springs in Sept '70 courtesy of Hydraulic Jim (alleged)
aeroid,
Have you read my posts on the subject of the control snatching etc and my views on the 'suspect'. As I posted I have refrained from any hint as to his name as I understand he was never charged much less convicted of any offence.
Have you read my posts on the subject of the control snatching etc and my views on the 'suspect'. As I posted I have refrained from any hint as to his name as I understand he was never charged much less convicted of any offence.
Have been dipping into this thread (109 pages!) and admiring the photos of all the exotic places that have been visited. And now for somewhere even more exotic. (Answers on a postcard not required...
aeroid #2159,
I stayed in a similar looking place on Mauritious in the mid 80's. Certainly had the facility to "skinny dip" direct from the front door. Although Indian, not Pacific Ocean. Someone must know ?
Lyneham Lad, I'm sure that the nicely outlined TFD is the giveaway.
Smudge
I stayed in a similar looking place on Mauritious in the mid 80's. Certainly had the facility to "skinny dip" direct from the front door. Although Indian, not Pacific Ocean. Someone must know ?
Lyneham Lad, I'm sure that the nicely outlined TFD is the giveaway.
Smudge
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Ah memories...I seem to remember spending half my time travelling between conversion Sqn and TFD clutching my butty box. Thanks Lynehamlad
Last edited by aeroid; 28th Dec 2014 at 18:29. Reason: wrong post
Huge 72,
Now you have me thinking. I stayed there too, 1991/92 so could easily be mistaken about Mauritius. Whatever the prize is, I reckon you just won it.
Smudge
Now you have me thinking. I stayed there too, 1991/92 so could easily be mistaken about Mauritius. Whatever the prize is, I reckon you just won it.
Smudge
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Re: 2158
Another incidence of every man and his dog ignoring the 60˚ bank limitation flapless (even less with flap). These displays were watched by Messrs All and Sundry including Station Commanders (who usually held a category on the aircraft).
No wonder the fuel tank baffles were shagged (yes I know it's a quarter of a barrel roll, but not many pilots can do them well, besides which it was set by Lockheed for a reason).
Still can't help it after all these years.
Another incidence of every man and his dog ignoring the 60˚ bank limitation flapless (even less with flap). These displays were watched by Messrs All and Sundry including Station Commanders (who usually held a category on the aircraft).
No wonder the fuel tank baffles were shagged (yes I know it's a quarter of a barrel roll, but not many pilots can do them well, besides which it was set by Lockheed for a reason).
Still can't help it after all these years.
Brian,
I would never dispute the voracity of your argument re bank angles and limitations, though perhaps some better qualified than me might, I'm a bit curious as to what these "baffles" are in the fuel tanks. I spent the early part of my career on the tank team at Colerne, as you know, and can remember no "baffles" in the main tanks, just struts and sealed wing structure. Are you referring to the baffles in the external tanks ? Fore and Aft, designed to prevent large changes of trim during steep climb and descent ? If so, I suspect that such displays were flown with external and aux tanks empty.
Smudge
I would never dispute the voracity of your argument re bank angles and limitations, though perhaps some better qualified than me might, I'm a bit curious as to what these "baffles" are in the fuel tanks. I spent the early part of my career on the tank team at Colerne, as you know, and can remember no "baffles" in the main tanks, just struts and sealed wing structure. Are you referring to the baffles in the external tanks ? Fore and Aft, designed to prevent large changes of trim during steep climb and descent ? If so, I suspect that such displays were flown with external and aux tanks empty.
Smudge
At The Risk Of Entering A Lion's Den.......................
1975:
Harriers deploy to Belize to defend said country against Guatemalan aggression. Six Harriers fly UK to Bermuda supported by Herc Route Support. Pilots who fly UK - Bermuda are replaced by six pilots pre-positioned in Bermuda who take the jets over and fly Bermuda into Belize. The route support Herc departs after the last jet has gone, but en-route has a "suspect standby Artificial Horizon" for the co-pilot. Decision is made to divert to Nassau. Senior Harrier mate on-board (Sqn Exec) pleads with the Driver to continue to Belize. It's daylight, the weather is good, and there is an operational need to get the six Harrier pilots on-board to Belize 'cos at that stage, there was a real possibility that the jets there would be needed to fight, and the six on-board pilots were important to provide some presence on the ground. GASO's were produced from behind one of the seats, and the Herc diverted to Nassau.
During the six months 1(F) Sqn was in Belize 1975/76 at no stage did a Herc ever stay overnight - the accommodation was pretty basic. There were usually some dozen or so with serviceability problems on the ground at Nassau. One evening, a Herc could not start one of its engines, and there was a real possibility that it might have to stay the night. We watched the activity closely with a Belikin Beer in hand - eventually, they got the engine turning, and very quickly the Herc took off - three tubes of condensation evident from three of the engines, with nothing behind the fourth. The fourth engine was stopped immediately after take-off, in sight of the airfield, and before the undercarriage was fully retracted.
Several months later after the Harriers had returned from Belize, with a new Squadron Commander on 1(F) Sqn, he wanted to visit in case the Sqn had to return - which, of course, it did. He wanted to visit with a pilot who had been there for the 75/76 deployment. He chose me.
In those days, 1(F) Sqn was a part of 38 Gp, the same as the Hercs, so he negotiated that we would travel out as super crew, returning after a few days on the ground in a VC-10. Our Herc went u/s for several days in Gander and Nassau on the way out - we missed our VC-10 connection for the return, and went u/s in Nassau on the way back. We spent almost 14 days away from the UK, about 2 hours on the ground in Belize, and received amazing amounts of money from the imprest, and ate huge amounts of food during the flights that we made.
I am afraid that in those days there were very definitely two different Royal Air Forces.
Harriers deploy to Belize to defend said country against Guatemalan aggression. Six Harriers fly UK to Bermuda supported by Herc Route Support. Pilots who fly UK - Bermuda are replaced by six pilots pre-positioned in Bermuda who take the jets over and fly Bermuda into Belize. The route support Herc departs after the last jet has gone, but en-route has a "suspect standby Artificial Horizon" for the co-pilot. Decision is made to divert to Nassau. Senior Harrier mate on-board (Sqn Exec) pleads with the Driver to continue to Belize. It's daylight, the weather is good, and there is an operational need to get the six Harrier pilots on-board to Belize 'cos at that stage, there was a real possibility that the jets there would be needed to fight, and the six on-board pilots were important to provide some presence on the ground. GASO's were produced from behind one of the seats, and the Herc diverted to Nassau.
During the six months 1(F) Sqn was in Belize 1975/76 at no stage did a Herc ever stay overnight - the accommodation was pretty basic. There were usually some dozen or so with serviceability problems on the ground at Nassau. One evening, a Herc could not start one of its engines, and there was a real possibility that it might have to stay the night. We watched the activity closely with a Belikin Beer in hand - eventually, they got the engine turning, and very quickly the Herc took off - three tubes of condensation evident from three of the engines, with nothing behind the fourth. The fourth engine was stopped immediately after take-off, in sight of the airfield, and before the undercarriage was fully retracted.
Several months later after the Harriers had returned from Belize, with a new Squadron Commander on 1(F) Sqn, he wanted to visit in case the Sqn had to return - which, of course, it did. He wanted to visit with a pilot who had been there for the 75/76 deployment. He chose me.
In those days, 1(F) Sqn was a part of 38 Gp, the same as the Hercs, so he negotiated that we would travel out as super crew, returning after a few days on the ground in a VC-10. Our Herc went u/s for several days in Gander and Nassau on the way out - we missed our VC-10 connection for the return, and went u/s in Nassau on the way back. We spent almost 14 days away from the UK, about 2 hours on the ground in Belize, and received amazing amounts of money from the imprest, and ate huge amounts of food during the flights that we made.
I am afraid that in those days there were very definitely two different Royal Air Forces.
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Hi Smuj, and others.
We were told on the OCU (originally) that the bank limitations were derived due to the movement of fuel outboard during (uncoordinated) turns. This 'slug' of fuel (depending on the severity of the yaw).
I'm trying to find the info, but I read of an incident where this 'slug' of fuel caused complete failure of the outer wing box and the fuel broke into the vent box (if I remember correctly - bear in mind I've been qualified on 6 aircraft types since). I'll come back if I find it.
Indisputably the bank limit was 60˚ clean and 45˚ with flap.
We were told on the OCU (originally) that the bank limitations were derived due to the movement of fuel outboard during (uncoordinated) turns. This 'slug' of fuel (depending on the severity of the yaw).
I'm trying to find the info, but I read of an incident where this 'slug' of fuel caused complete failure of the outer wing box and the fuel broke into the vent box (if I remember correctly - bear in mind I've been qualified on 6 aircraft types since). I'll come back if I find it.
Indisputably the bank limit was 60˚ clean and 45˚ with flap.
BomberH.... whist your tale has a certain "ring of truth" to it .. a few points to add for completeness ...
In the early days of the "Belize Slip" (or reinforcement/deployment call it what you will) the airfield was not as it became ... the parking area was two tiny concrete patches, one by the terminal, one by the tower. It was decreed by those on high that the Herc was NOT to nightstop Belize for "any reason" as when parked the passage of the mighty 10 was hindered .. and that could not happen ..
No spares were initially prepositioned in Belize (we eventually got that changed) but two "ranger packs" and "enhanced support" (extra couple of GE's) were positioned in Nassau. The "slip" route being Lyn - Gander - Nassau - (flag) Belize - Nassau - Gander - Lyn Eventually the infrastructure at Belize changed dramatically and the Herc stopped there on many occasions ... if memory serves the Chinese Restaurant was particularity popular ..
In the early days of the "Belize Slip" (or reinforcement/deployment call it what you will) the airfield was not as it became ... the parking area was two tiny concrete patches, one by the terminal, one by the tower. It was decreed by those on high that the Herc was NOT to nightstop Belize for "any reason" as when parked the passage of the mighty 10 was hindered .. and that could not happen ..
No spares were initially prepositioned in Belize (we eventually got that changed) but two "ranger packs" and "enhanced support" (extra couple of GE's) were positioned in Nassau. The "slip" route being Lyn - Gander - Nassau - (flag) Belize - Nassau - Gander - Lyn Eventually the infrastructure at Belize changed dramatically and the Herc stopped there on many occasions ... if memory serves the Chinese Restaurant was particularity popular ..
MalDrop #2163,
I can't afford a postcard on my wages, (I do so miss the co pilot and his largesse (or was that imprest)) so will take a punt at somewhere in Kenya. I was only a GE, so rarely saw the view from the front of the bus, but the red soil and scrub indicates Africa, formation drop indicates some formal training area used by the Army, and I remember doing many trips to Nairobbery to deliver "ground pounders"!! I'm sure one of the drivers will be along soon to correct my guess, once again, a good picture contribution to this ongoing record of Albert in the RAF.
Smudge
I can't afford a postcard on my wages, (I do so miss the co pilot and his largesse (or was that imprest)) so will take a punt at somewhere in Kenya. I was only a GE, so rarely saw the view from the front of the bus, but the red soil and scrub indicates Africa, formation drop indicates some formal training area used by the Army, and I remember doing many trips to Nairobbery to deliver "ground pounders"!! I'm sure one of the drivers will be along soon to correct my guess, once again, a good picture contribution to this ongoing record of Albert in the RAF.
Smudge
OMEGAV6 is correct ref the small parking area at Belize in the early days. Before the Herc came into service we used to go there in the Hastings. After offloading pax/frt we then taxied to an area of the airport we christened the scrapyard because that is what it looked like. Full of bits of dead a/c etc. Naturally the Hastings looked right at home there.
This was done to leave room on the very small parking area for the civilian a/c to park, no VC10 then.
Whether you liked it or not GASOS ruled our lives and you disobeyed them at your peril. Unless of course you got an exemption in writing from HQ or were the AOC ! (see my earlier Belize tale)
As the comms back to HQ improved so did micromanagement. IMHO this was to the detriment of getting the job done on many an occasion.
This was done to leave room on the very small parking area for the civilian a/c to park, no VC10 then.
Whether you liked it or not GASOS ruled our lives and you disobeyed them at your peril. Unless of course you got an exemption in writing from HQ or were the AOC ! (see my earlier Belize tale)
As the comms back to HQ improved so did micromanagement. IMHO this was to the detriment of getting the job done on many an occasion.
AA62,
Yourself and MalDrop are absolutely correct in your assertion that the no night stop policy in Belize was part of the operational plan of the time. In my day, as a GE, Belize trips were a standard night stop, with no parking restriction. The practice experienced by BomberH did though continue, and certainly both the UN relief mission in to Sarajevo from Falconara and the Kigale slip through Dar Es Salaam both precluded night stops at the "coal face". I'm sure others will have examples of getting in and out of airheads during tactical transport operations.
Smudge
Yourself and MalDrop are absolutely correct in your assertion that the no night stop policy in Belize was part of the operational plan of the time. In my day, as a GE, Belize trips were a standard night stop, with no parking restriction. The practice experienced by BomberH did though continue, and certainly both the UN relief mission in to Sarajevo from Falconara and the Kigale slip through Dar Es Salaam both precluded night stops at the "coal face". I'm sure others will have examples of getting in and out of airheads during tactical transport operations.
Smudge