Tirpitz - 617 v 9
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Tirpitz - 617 v 9
I'm in the middle of a book about 617 Sqn post the 1943 dams' op (doco to be broadcast on Ch 5 in May I think).
Over the years, I've heard many stories of the tussle between 617 and 9 over ownership of the bit of the Tirpitz presented to the RAF by the Norwegian government at the end of WW2. Stories (some clearly exaggerated?) seem to have included parachute drops, pneumatic drills, helicopter flights and car chases.
I'd like to include an account of this 'battle' in the book (not the TV doc as that's already finished) - does anyone have any publishable memories of the antics?
Over the years, I've heard many stories of the tussle between 617 and 9 over ownership of the bit of the Tirpitz presented to the RAF by the Norwegian government at the end of WW2. Stories (some clearly exaggerated?) seem to have included parachute drops, pneumatic drills, helicopter flights and car chases.
I'd like to include an account of this 'battle' in the book (not the TV doc as that's already finished) - does anyone have any publishable memories of the antics?
The IX Sqn link describes the stealing of the bulkhead from 617 in 71 pretty much as I remember it. The contested article was hanging on the wall in our crewroom, unguarded and easily removable. At about 1800 we were advised of its theft, and given a description of the van that was used. There then followed a "Rootes Group" pursuit - 2 Sunbeam Alpines (one of which was mine) and Trevor Hurrell's Humber Hawk, which led us to Waddington. Although we were quite miffed, it was viewed at the time as a bit of a lark, and Waddington's Station Commander, although declaring himself neutral, allowed 617 to monitor the pan where IX Sqn's Vulcan was parked. I did a 2-hour shift in the adjacent crew chief's hut, only for the enemy to rush out and tie the door shut with a length of rope. Fortunately, they did not cover the hatch at the back of the hut, through which I scrambled and raised the alarm, ensuring that the bulkhead was not loaded onto their Vulcan. However, this was just a clever diversion, as it was already on its way to Wittering by road, and the rest is history.
This was not the first time that the bulkhead had changed ownership, but we felt that IX was not playing fairly this time. Up until then, the trophy had been displayed freely somewhere in the respective sqn's hangar, making it fair game for repatriation. When 617's next Cyprus Ranger arrived at Akrotiri the crew were shown the bulkhead concreted into the wall of the IX Sqn building, making a slick high-speed removal impossible.
The Vulcan B2 had no fuel jettison facility, so IX's ac must have left Waddington with minimal fuel to be able illegally to declare an emergency and divert into Wittering, just down the road. Does this sort of high jinx still go on in today's RAF I wonder?
This was not the first time that the bulkhead had changed ownership, but we felt that IX was not playing fairly this time. Up until then, the trophy had been displayed freely somewhere in the respective sqn's hangar, making it fair game for repatriation. When 617's next Cyprus Ranger arrived at Akrotiri the crew were shown the bulkhead concreted into the wall of the IX Sqn building, making a slick high-speed removal impossible.
The Vulcan B2 had no fuel jettison facility, so IX's ac must have left Waddington with minimal fuel to be able illegally to declare an emergency and divert into Wittering, just down the road. Does this sort of high jinx still go on in today's RAF I wonder?
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More here as contribution to a thread I started ...
From #6 onwards ...
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...nship-fun.html
Might be a good call to PM those who posted just to be sure they are happy
From #6 onwards ...
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...nship-fun.html
Might be a good call to PM those who posted just to be sure they are happy
John,
Another 617 v IX story you might like is actually a Strike Command v Air Support Command one as well:
On April 22nd 1971 my (617) crew were on our way back to Scampton having carried out a series of air displays in Australia to mark the RAAF's 50th anniversary. That day was a 4-hour leg from Tengah to Gan, where we arrived above MAUM for landing, and so had to burn off some fuel. Coincidentally, a IX Sqn Vulcan arrived from Masirah at about the same time, and also had to burn off fuel. Both captains quickly came up with a competition which involved accurate instrument flying and visual bombing and timing skills. Each ac took it in turns to do a short-pattern PAR, whilst the other attempted to overfly the runway at 90 degrees and 250ft to capture the rolling Vulcan with the nose-mounted F95 camera. Whichever crew had more photos of the other's ac would be bought the beers by the losers in the bar that evening.
This is actually more difficult than it sounds, and half way through our second approach a VC10 arrived on the scene and requested landing clearance. The Gan Approach controller advised him he would have to hold, as there was a bombing exercise in progress. At this juncture the VC10's pilot said:
"Gan, this is an Air Support Command Scheduled Transport!" whereupon the controller replied:
"Sorry, didn't realise you were an Air Support Command Scheduled Transport - Hold."
The VC10 crew were very miffed, but later in the bar they discovered that both Vulcans had real (not acting) Sqn Ldr captains, so there was little they could do about it. Moreover, we had 2 of their Cpl air stewards removed from a 6-man air conditioned room where they were the sole occupants so that 5 officers got a proper night's sleep.
Sadly, I don't think either Vulcan managed to capture a vertical photo of the other on the runway, but it was fun, and had valuable training value.
Another 617 v IX story you might like is actually a Strike Command v Air Support Command one as well:
On April 22nd 1971 my (617) crew were on our way back to Scampton having carried out a series of air displays in Australia to mark the RAAF's 50th anniversary. That day was a 4-hour leg from Tengah to Gan, where we arrived above MAUM for landing, and so had to burn off some fuel. Coincidentally, a IX Sqn Vulcan arrived from Masirah at about the same time, and also had to burn off fuel. Both captains quickly came up with a competition which involved accurate instrument flying and visual bombing and timing skills. Each ac took it in turns to do a short-pattern PAR, whilst the other attempted to overfly the runway at 90 degrees and 250ft to capture the rolling Vulcan with the nose-mounted F95 camera. Whichever crew had more photos of the other's ac would be bought the beers by the losers in the bar that evening.
This is actually more difficult than it sounds, and half way through our second approach a VC10 arrived on the scene and requested landing clearance. The Gan Approach controller advised him he would have to hold, as there was a bombing exercise in progress. At this juncture the VC10's pilot said:
"Gan, this is an Air Support Command Scheduled Transport!" whereupon the controller replied:
"Sorry, didn't realise you were an Air Support Command Scheduled Transport - Hold."
The VC10 crew were very miffed, but later in the bar they discovered that both Vulcans had real (not acting) Sqn Ldr captains, so there was little they could do about it. Moreover, we had 2 of their Cpl air stewards removed from a 6-man air conditioned room where they were the sole occupants so that 5 officers got a proper night's sleep.
Sadly, I don't think either Vulcan managed to capture a vertical photo of the other on the runway, but it was fun, and had valuable training value.
I've certainly no axe to grind on behalf of the ASC Strat Fleets. As a lowly MRT driver sans scraper, I always felt they were fair game for beating to the air conditioned accomodation in the Route Hotels, etc. However, I can't fathom the reasoning for holding an inbound a/c while he consumed his Island Holding fuel (ie he had nowhere else to go) while two aircraft with excess fuel burned it off doing an impromptu 'bombing exercise'.
I realise that Gan Approach was the instigator of this arbitrary decision, but wouldn't Flight Safety have been better served if one of the SC aircraft had piped up that, as far as he was concerned, the VC-10 could go ahead and land while they held off?
The reaction of the other SC captain would have determined if he was a good egg or an utter bounder, of course!
I realise that Gan Approach was the instigator of this arbitrary decision, but wouldn't Flight Safety have been better served if one of the SC aircraft had piped up that, as far as he was concerned, the VC-10 could go ahead and land while they held off?
The reaction of the other SC captain would have determined if he was a good egg or an utter bounder, of course!
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
While the bulkhead may have been secured in the IX HQ at Akrotiri it was still recovered.
While I was not on IX IIRC this is what happened:
A 617 crew managed to free the bulkhead whose loss was discovered before the 617 Vulcan had departed. Under a pretext it was searched and then a guard mounted but the bulkhead had already gone. Not to UK but to Masirah in a Belfast!
While I was not on IX IIRC this is what happened:
A 617 crew managed to free the bulkhead whose loss was discovered before the 617 Vulcan had departed. Under a pretext it was searched and then a guard mounted but the bulkhead had already gone. Not to UK but to Masirah in a Belfast!
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Chug, digressing, we were once on an approach to Tengah and told to break off as a 10 was coming in and had priority to chocks and they didn't want us occupying the runway ahead of him.
We did a quick orbit, landed behind him and were on chocks, door open, before the 10. Sad to say we were not quick enough to get seats home on that 10 and had to wait another week down town for the next aircraft.
We did a quick orbit, landed behind him and were on chocks, door open, before the 10. Sad to say we were not quick enough to get seats home on that 10 and had to wait another week down town for the next aircraft.
A sad story, PN, and I can only sympathise at such an unjust outcome. How you must have pleaded with the AMO to let you on, but what will be will be...
