Advocating RAFAT trip to New Zealand.
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Advocating RAFAT trip to New Zealand.
I have a mate down there who wants to try and get the Reds to visit. He tells me they have never visited, which really surprised me. Has it been considered before and rejected out of hand?
Assuming the idea gets some traction, what should he be looking for when proposing the event, what is going to sell the idea, what would the MoD be looking for and who would be the best points of contact (Air Attache in the first instance etc?). I imagine that the lead in time is a few years by which time of course..
.. I know that the Reds are on the cusp of disbanding and that we can't even afford the fuel anymore anyway!
Assuming the idea gets some traction, what should he be looking for when proposing the event, what is going to sell the idea, what would the MoD be looking for and who would be the best points of contact (Air Attache in the first instance etc?). I imagine that the lead in time is a few years by which time of course..
.. I know that the Reds are on the cusp of disbanding and that we can't even afford the fuel anymore anyway!
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They would need a drop tank fit, a refuelling probe or an aircraft carrier. The Hawk doesn't have the legs.
They have done their best to redress the omission by selecting a stream of NZ pilots in the last few years!
They have done their best to redress the omission by selecting a stream of NZ pilots in the last few years!
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If they flew to NZ to do a display, wouldn't they then do other displays
like in Aus and other countries along the way ?
Middle East ? Get some rich Sheik to pay for the trip ?
Re the anniversary of the end of WWI, can't see the relevance of the Red Arrows to it.
like in Aus and other countries along the way ?
Middle East ? Get some rich Sheik to pay for the trip ?
Re the anniversary of the end of WWI, can't see the relevance of the Red Arrows to it.
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They have displayed in Australia and they came back just before Christmas from a busy tour of the Middle East. A year ago they went to Russia. About six years ago they went as far as Malaysia. They fly the flag right across the globe.
Brisbane to Norfolk Island is 790 NM. Too far. NI to North Island is just about achievable.
Brisbane to Norfolk Island is 790 NM. Too far. NI to North Island is just about achievable.
Last edited by Genstabler; 20th Jan 2014 at 10:38.
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Sponsorship
All, or mostly all, overseas tours have had some significant levels of industry support to cover costs. Having sponsored several times (on behalf of my shareholders you understand) I can attest to the fact that it a most expensive exercise, but if the destination is a large customer or potential customer then shareholders will wear it. NZ, even in range, would not be on any industry list.
IIRC there is actually a statement on the RAFAT website that specifically calls out NZ as being out of reach.
Which is a great pity as I cant think of many other places on Earth where a few displays would be more warmly welcomed.
Red Arrows over Wanaka - now that would be worth seeing :-)
Which is a great pity as I cant think of many other places on Earth where a few displays would be more warmly welcomed.
Red Arrows over Wanaka - now that would be worth seeing :-)
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Lord Howe Island Airport, Australia (YLHI)
Runways: One asphalt, 2,908ft (886m)
Air Traffic: Commuter aircraft and light aircraft
Hazards: Short runway, high terrain on both sides, water at both ends, frequently poor weather.
Excerpt from an article about the world's most dangerous airports.
Don't think the Reds would be happy staging through there!
Runways: One asphalt, 2,908ft (886m)
Air Traffic: Commuter aircraft and light aircraft
Hazards: Short runway, high terrain on both sides, water at both ends, frequently poor weather.
Excerpt from an article about the world's most dangerous airports.
Don't think the Reds would be happy staging through there!
Advocating RAFAT trip to New Zealand.
I would just like to add that 790NM is not too far for a Hawk to fly. However, operating under a 'point of no return' scenario in a single engine jet is not most people's idea of fun. Plus the sea down there has lots of sharks in it. Sharks are scary.
BV
BV
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I think the logistics are fair enough and the fish food aspects are understandable. But what about a limited presence.. say, 3 jets doing a limited display? It's the thought that counts. I can't think of a more deserving bunch who would be more appreciative. I know the variables and other factors remain the same but they might make the thing more do-able.
It was one of the harder pub quiz question ie which is the only capital city that the Red Arrows couldn't display at ? Ans Wellington -of course the use of a boat etc would make it possible but the question is aimed at the range of the Hawk. A quick look at great circle planner puts the range from the closest mainland Australian airfield to the nearest NZ one as about 1100 nm. Even if it was possible one way , the wind component would preclude the recovery. Doesn't matter if it 3 or 9/10 ac it is just too far unless as stated above the drop tank fit becomes an option.
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Surely it would be cheaper to bring the interested parties to the UK. Hopefully when those north of the border get their independence then we won't be sending the Reds there either
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(Sciolist hat jammed firmly over ears)
Take wings off, stick 'em in containers (would tail fit in 9ft wth u/c up ? - and there must be a container port in NZ, surely), take out at other end and put wings back on.
Do shows, come back same way.
Take wings off, stick 'em in containers (would tail fit in 9ft wth u/c up ? - and there must be a container port in NZ, surely), take out at other end and put wings back on.
Do shows, come back same way.
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Cost?
How much would it cost? What happens to RAF Scampton when they are away-is it mothballed?
What are the total costs of having the Red Arrows for one FY anyway? I'm interested.
p.s. they're about to close the last remaining Fire Station in my old town. From now on the good people of XX will be relying upon a life saving service from a station over a dozen miles away. Great Britain is FUBAR>we have had a town fire service for over 100+ years. But let them eat cake, yes?
Moneys tight lads, all I'm saying.
What are the total costs of having the Red Arrows for one FY anyway? I'm interested.
p.s. they're about to close the last remaining Fire Station in my old town. From now on the good people of XX will be relying upon a life saving service from a station over a dozen miles away. Great Britain is FUBAR>we have had a town fire service for over 100+ years. But let them eat cake, yes?
Moneys tight lads, all I'm saying.
Last edited by Hangarshuffle; 20th Jan 2014 at 18:52.
