LtGen Hal Moore-Failing Health
Thread Starter
The movie was typical Hollywood in its ending for sure.....nothing at all like the real events.
The LZ X-Ray fight was a distinct event from the subsequent ambush and destruction of the Battalion that was moving by ground towards LZ Albany.
That event could very well be its own movie.
In my view, the best Vietnam Movie is "Hamburger Hill"......followed perhaps by "More American Graffiti".
Books I recommend....
"We Were Soldiers Once....And Young" by Moore and Galloway
"The Army and Vietnam" by Andrew Krepinevich, Jr.
"On Strategy, A Critical Analysis of the Vietnam War" by Harry G. Summers
"Thunderbolt", by Lewis Sorley (about General Creighton Abrams)
"Westmoreland" by Lewis Sorley (about General Westmoreland)
"Dereliction of Duty" by H.R. McMaster
"Flawed Giant" by Robert Dallek (about LBJ)
"A Bright Shining Lie" by Neil Sheehan (about John Paul Vann)
The LZ X-Ray fight was a distinct event from the subsequent ambush and destruction of the Battalion that was moving by ground towards LZ Albany.
That event could very well be its own movie.
In my view, the best Vietnam Movie is "Hamburger Hill"......followed perhaps by "More American Graffiti".
Books I recommend....
"We Were Soldiers Once....And Young" by Moore and Galloway
"The Army and Vietnam" by Andrew Krepinevich, Jr.
"On Strategy, A Critical Analysis of the Vietnam War" by Harry G. Summers
"Thunderbolt", by Lewis Sorley (about General Creighton Abrams)
"Westmoreland" by Lewis Sorley (about General Westmoreland)
"Dereliction of Duty" by H.R. McMaster
"Flawed Giant" by Robert Dallek (about LBJ)
"A Bright Shining Lie" by Neil Sheehan (about John Paul Vann)
Good list SASLess;
I'd add "We are Soldiers Still..." by Hal Moore- and then make every politician read it. The post-war bridges that he built with his wartime enemy are a lesson to all who'd practice politics with violence.
I'd also add Summers' 'Rise and fall of an American Army' and Hackworth's 'About Face'.
I'd add "We are Soldiers Still..." by Hal Moore- and then make every politician read it. The post-war bridges that he built with his wartime enemy are a lesson to all who'd practice politics with violence.
I'd also add Summers' 'Rise and fall of an American Army' and Hackworth's 'About Face'.
Thread Starter
Absolutely....excellent books.
Some others I would add to my list....
"Steel My Soldiers Heart" by David Hackworth
"Low Level Hell" by Hugh Mills
"Five Years to Freedom" by Nick Rowe
"A Rumour of War" by Phillip Caputo
"The Killing Zone" by Frederick Downs
"Platoon Leader" by James McDonald
"Firebase Illingsworth" by Phillip Keith
"Hell In A Very Small Place" by Bernard Fall
"Street Without Joy" by Bernard Fall
"When Hell Was In Session" by Jeremiah Denton
Firebase Illingsworth was partially over run by 400 NVA Soldiers while being defended by 220 American's....who incurred 24 KIA, 54 WIA, with one Medal of Honor being given to a Soldier for his actions that night. The fight devolved to Hand to Hand combat during part of the attack.
Some others I would add to my list....
"Steel My Soldiers Heart" by David Hackworth
"Low Level Hell" by Hugh Mills
"Five Years to Freedom" by Nick Rowe
"A Rumour of War" by Phillip Caputo
"The Killing Zone" by Frederick Downs
"Platoon Leader" by James McDonald
"Firebase Illingsworth" by Phillip Keith
"Hell In A Very Small Place" by Bernard Fall
"Street Without Joy" by Bernard Fall
"When Hell Was In Session" by Jeremiah Denton
Firebase Illingsworth was partially over run by 400 NVA Soldiers while being defended by 220 American's....who incurred 24 KIA, 54 WIA, with one Medal of Honor being given to a Soldier for his actions that night. The fight devolved to Hand to Hand combat during part of the attack.
Last edited by SASless; 20th Jan 2014 at 16:05.
Thread Starter
Good News!
It would appear I was premature in reporting the pending demise of the General.....much like Mark Twain....the reports of his pending demise were exaggerated.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Lt-Co...re/59545011275
It would appear I was premature in reporting the pending demise of the General.....much like Mark Twain....the reports of his pending demise were exaggerated.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Lt-Co...re/59545011275
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SASless,
If you have a strong stomach, I recommend "Nam" by Mark Baker. It is the most in-your-face account of the war's brutality that I've yet read. And if you are looking for a grunts account of the war, this is also the book for you. Be warned...it is not an easy read.
If you have a strong stomach, I recommend "Nam" by Mark Baker. It is the most in-your-face account of the war's brutality that I've yet read. And if you are looking for a grunts account of the war, this is also the book for you. Be warned...it is not an easy read.
Last edited by The Old Fat One; 20th Jan 2014 at 20:50.
Thread Starter
I will look for it......but this is the one that got to me. I passed through Camp Zama after being wounded.....so I can connect to what I saw there. I was very lucky...extremely lucky....blessed even.....not so, way too many I saw there.
About thirty years later at Johns Hopkin's delivering a Burn Patient while flying EMS......I helped the Medical Crew push the Patient into the facility and we were directed straight to the "Tub Room".
As we turned into the Tub Room....my Crew noted my countenance was not as it should be and asked if I was okay. I was not.....and there was no one being treated when we entered the room. The mere sight of the Tubs was all it took to bring back memories I wish I do not have.
I know what Hell is like....I have seen it here on Earth. Even as only a witness to other's real torment....you carry those sights and sounds with you forever.
About thirty years later at Johns Hopkin's delivering a Burn Patient while flying EMS......I helped the Medical Crew push the Patient into the facility and we were directed straight to the "Tub Room".
As we turned into the Tub Room....my Crew noted my countenance was not as it should be and asked if I was okay. I was not.....and there was no one being treated when we entered the room. The mere sight of the Tubs was all it took to bring back memories I wish I do not have.
I know what Hell is like....I have seen it here on Earth. Even as only a witness to other's real torment....you carry those sights and sounds with you forever.
Thread Starter
My Sainted Mother would argue with that forecast!
Got to meet Joe Galloway and Lt Gen Moore back in the 90's.
On a book tour, but also on a tour to visit with officers in various places, and teach them a thing or two about how we in uniform relate to and with the press. They opened my eyes.
Both are fine men.
Joe is from Refugio, Texas (Nolan Ryan's home town, FWIW) and occasionally returns to southern Texas to speak at various colleges and universities.
He is a very outspoken and blunt critic of governments, and high command. He reserved a special cup of bile for Donald Rumsfeld due to a lot of what went down in both Iraq and Afghanistan.
I hope he makes another pass soon, I'd like to talk with him again.
On a book tour, but also on a tour to visit with officers in various places, and teach them a thing or two about how we in uniform relate to and with the press. They opened my eyes.
Both are fine men.
Joe is from Refugio, Texas (Nolan Ryan's home town, FWIW) and occasionally returns to southern Texas to speak at various colleges and universities.
He is a very outspoken and blunt critic of governments, and high command. He reserved a special cup of bile for Donald Rumsfeld due to a lot of what went down in both Iraq and Afghanistan.
I hope he makes another pass soon, I'd like to talk with him again.
Thread Starter
Joe is also an Obama supporter.....of all things!
Thread Starter
Joe has earned the Right to think and say whatever he wishes.....there were no non-combatants on LZ X-Ray. Gathering at "Fiddlers Green" with a bunch of Troopers is going to be an interesting time when it happens......no time soon I hope!
Last edited by SASless; 21st Jan 2014 at 22:31.
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"Joe has earned the Right to think and say whatever he wishes.....their were no non-combatants on LZ X-Ray."
SaSless
Agree with you on this
SaSless
Agree with you on this
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Apart from Moore and Plumley, you had Joe Galloway, Rick Rescorla
Ed Freeman and Bruce Crandall and from memory a couple of others who were decorated in that battle who went on and applied the lessons learned.
Ed Freeman and Bruce Crandall and from memory a couple of others who were decorated in that battle who went on and applied the lessons learned.
Joe is also an Obama supporter.....of all things!
In a sense that his politics will support whatever candidate is Democrat rather than just Obama.
Thread Starter
No idea but have heard he got miffed with Rumsfeld and that bunch over events in Iraq and Afghanistan......but no matter his political beliefs are his alone.
I might disagree with him re Obama for sure....but that is what is great about this country....freedom to think how we want....even if in some cases the other folks are dead wrong.
I might disagree with him re Obama for sure....but that is what is great about this country....freedom to think how we want....even if in some cases the other folks are dead wrong.
No idea but have heard he got miffed with Rumsfeld and that bunch over events in Iraq and Afghanistan......but no matter his political beliefs are his alone.
I might disagree with him re Obama for sure....but that is what is great about this country....freedom to think how we want....even if in some cases the other folks are dead wrong.
I might disagree with him re Obama for sure....but that is what is great about this country....freedom to think how we want....even if in some cases the other folks are dead wrong.
