WOULD YOU JOIN UP NOW
Ah, that's the Ali Qado I remember. Direct, to the point and deliciously cynical. But, underneath it all, absolutely right as ever.
My years in the service constituted a very mixed bag, but with many more plusses than minuses. I was there for the flying, although managed to hang on for a long time after that was all over as long as the odd mate took me for rides now and then and I felt like my time in the mahogany bomber was doing some good for the guys and girls, the front line and whatever it was we were supposed to be doing at the time. I only left a few years early and that was only because of a very good redundancy offer and circumstances at the time. As it turned out, I certainly left at the right time. For me.
Would I join now? As things stand, no, my life has moved on. As it was when I joined; Hell, yes. If I were a youngster with a dream of flying today; yes, I really think I would.
It's a good thread, this one. Very interesting points being made.
My years in the service constituted a very mixed bag, but with many more plusses than minuses. I was there for the flying, although managed to hang on for a long time after that was all over as long as the odd mate took me for rides now and then and I felt like my time in the mahogany bomber was doing some good for the guys and girls, the front line and whatever it was we were supposed to be doing at the time. I only left a few years early and that was only because of a very good redundancy offer and circumstances at the time. As it turned out, I certainly left at the right time. For me.
Would I join now? As things stand, no, my life has moved on. As it was when I joined; Hell, yes. If I were a youngster with a dream of flying today; yes, I really think I would.
It's a good thread, this one. Very interesting points being made.
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Ali Qadoo
You said it much better than I!
It's more to do with how I perceive today's UK and it's very poor recent governments and their failure towards the military covenant, rather than the service I was once proud to be a member of and would go the extra mile for in my day.
You said it much better than I!
It's more to do with how I perceive today's UK and it's very poor recent governments and their failure towards the military covenant, rather than the service I was once proud to be a member of and would go the extra mile for in my day.
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84nomore & BEagle
Thank you for the kind words and encouragement to join the RAF. Its words like these that keep the motivation high to strive for the ultimate goal. I appreciate it! With all the current cuts that are happening its sometimes hard to think I could get selected. The competition is very fierce.
Long story regarding the UAS - I went to apply for MASUAS during my first year of University however I was still a member of the Air Training Corps at the time. I couldn't be a member of each simultaneously. It was one or the other. After long discussion with my squadron CO I decided to stay in the ATC for my final year as I was put in for promotion to F/Sgt and was also awarded my gliding scholarship so it was the best choice for me personally. I was awarded an ACPS too.
Start of my second year of University I re-applied for the UAS. Having timed out as a cadet due to my age I decided to give it another shot. Interview went well however I came across a little too shy. First time I've been interviewed by a Sqn Ldr, Flt Lt and an APO at the same time so the nerves got to me. In the end I wasn't selected for the UAS. Very disappointed news it was. I tried my best though!
I feel this set back puts me at a disadvantage to the competition when applying for the RAF. Especially against candidates who were selected for the UAS. I'm in a pickle as I don't know if this set back will really effect my chances of being selected. Still going to go for it though. It hasn't put me off joining a single bit. I've recently started as a CI at my cadet squadron so still keeping in the loop and volunteering!
Thanks again. All the best!
Chris
Thank you for the kind words and encouragement to join the RAF. Its words like these that keep the motivation high to strive for the ultimate goal. I appreciate it! With all the current cuts that are happening its sometimes hard to think I could get selected. The competition is very fierce.
Long story regarding the UAS - I went to apply for MASUAS during my first year of University however I was still a member of the Air Training Corps at the time. I couldn't be a member of each simultaneously. It was one or the other. After long discussion with my squadron CO I decided to stay in the ATC for my final year as I was put in for promotion to F/Sgt and was also awarded my gliding scholarship so it was the best choice for me personally. I was awarded an ACPS too.
Start of my second year of University I re-applied for the UAS. Having timed out as a cadet due to my age I decided to give it another shot. Interview went well however I came across a little too shy. First time I've been interviewed by a Sqn Ldr, Flt Lt and an APO at the same time so the nerves got to me. In the end I wasn't selected for the UAS. Very disappointed news it was. I tried my best though!
I feel this set back puts me at a disadvantage to the competition when applying for the RAF. Especially against candidates who were selected for the UAS. I'm in a pickle as I don't know if this set back will really effect my chances of being selected. Still going to go for it though. It hasn't put me off joining a single bit. I've recently started as a CI at my cadet squadron so still keeping in the loop and volunteering!
Thanks again. All the best!
Chris
AQ - Saved me half an hour typing it out myself..
Would I if I were 18 again? - Yes. Would they have me? - No chance. At least not with the standard of education with which I left comprehensive in 1977.
I can understand why those who shot for and attained a higher standard might now consider that under the same circumstances they would choose a different route, but imagine how many of todays youth who's attainment lagged potential (read me...) have no (or at least a limited) outlet that will teach them how to be men, educate them and set them on the right path. You probably need 10 GCSE's to be a cook. Well, you might if they still existed as a trade!
Would I if I were 18 again? - Yes. Would they have me? - No chance. At least not with the standard of education with which I left comprehensive in 1977.
I can understand why those who shot for and attained a higher standard might now consider that under the same circumstances they would choose a different route, but imagine how many of todays youth who's attainment lagged potential (read me...) have no (or at least a limited) outlet that will teach them how to be men, educate them and set them on the right path. You probably need 10 GCSE's to be a cook. Well, you might if they still existed as a trade!
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To answer the question as posed, then I would say no because the Air Force as I perceive it today is not the one I knew in the 50's and for 30 years thereafter. However, if a young man or woman wants to fly and test their abilities to the max then i would say go for it! You will not have the same experiences I had, but that is to be expected. However, you will have your own experiences with good men and women who share your endeavor and enthusiasm for flight. I don't regret one minute of my 30 years in the RAF, but there is no doubt that todays air force is different and some of us old codgers don't quite understand it. My dad who flew with bomber command in WWII had a different perspective than me too! I will say this, the training and experience you get is second to none, and you will acquire something that makes you stand out from the crowd for the rest of your life.
Bob C
Bob C
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Christian, that should not be a problem. Provided you learn from that experience, get a good degree, gain in confidence etc. It could even work to your advantage.
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I found reading some of the opinions here fascinating. Especially those from waaaay back. I just couldn't resist leaving my opinion here too.
I'm a gnats dick over 10 years in and still here just about. Only a short stint so far in comparison to some of you but I think it's a certainty that things have changed during my time. Indeed I fall on the side of the fence where the changes have been for the worse. Here are a few random thoughts off the top of me swede...
It seems so convoluted to get anything done in recent years (3-4) as each thing needs an in depth analysis or auditing or a signature from 20 different people. Over complicated procedures usually for the budgets sadly. Using ELCAS for something useful can be a challenge for instance.
Oddly I used to be able to get a lot done during down time with the random cluster of pals we find ourselves amongst. So I think perhaps less 'work' is being done over a casual pint in the bar/mess than it used to. I also think its a sad fact of todays RAF that although opportunities for AT and sport are still there, it's damn difficult to get the time off to do it. Overall we've probably got a little less work to do with much less manpower, resulting in some ridiculous workloads and OOA turn overs.
Job security came up earlier. Even so little as 5 years ago job security was a main reason for sitting tight and enjoying ride. But new legislation seems to threaten that security, as well as the redundancies. For example the new RAFFT process reads like a quicker way to get rid of people (I'm not starting a debate on the FT, it's one of those hoops though which we must jump). its almost as if there's an increasing amount of new 'do this or you're out!' rules being forced on us.
I often ask myself what has changed for me over the last 10 years and I'm not sure I can put my finger on it. Would I join now from scratch? No.... but maybe. Because it's alright, fun most of the time, good mates, reasonable salary. It was mentioned earlier about having an exit plan. Definitely wish I'd had one of those now as I would probably consider the big ol PVR. I think I'd refuse a promotion or two too, things don't seem so much fun now with this extra crap to deal with. This isn't to say that I wouldn't encourage others to join. I'd just advise them to KNOW what they are doing, rather than be railroaded into something misunderstood and misguided. Good luck to them too!
I'm a gnats dick over 10 years in and still here just about. Only a short stint so far in comparison to some of you but I think it's a certainty that things have changed during my time. Indeed I fall on the side of the fence where the changes have been for the worse. Here are a few random thoughts off the top of me swede...
It seems so convoluted to get anything done in recent years (3-4) as each thing needs an in depth analysis or auditing or a signature from 20 different people. Over complicated procedures usually for the budgets sadly. Using ELCAS for something useful can be a challenge for instance.
Oddly I used to be able to get a lot done during down time with the random cluster of pals we find ourselves amongst. So I think perhaps less 'work' is being done over a casual pint in the bar/mess than it used to. I also think its a sad fact of todays RAF that although opportunities for AT and sport are still there, it's damn difficult to get the time off to do it. Overall we've probably got a little less work to do with much less manpower, resulting in some ridiculous workloads and OOA turn overs.
Job security came up earlier. Even so little as 5 years ago job security was a main reason for sitting tight and enjoying ride. But new legislation seems to threaten that security, as well as the redundancies. For example the new RAFFT process reads like a quicker way to get rid of people (I'm not starting a debate on the FT, it's one of those hoops though which we must jump). its almost as if there's an increasing amount of new 'do this or you're out!' rules being forced on us.
I often ask myself what has changed for me over the last 10 years and I'm not sure I can put my finger on it. Would I join now from scratch? No.... but maybe. Because it's alright, fun most of the time, good mates, reasonable salary. It was mentioned earlier about having an exit plan. Definitely wish I'd had one of those now as I would probably consider the big ol PVR. I think I'd refuse a promotion or two too, things don't seem so much fun now with this extra crap to deal with. This isn't to say that I wouldn't encourage others to join. I'd just advise them to KNOW what they are doing, rather than be railroaded into something misunderstood and misguided. Good luck to them too!
Lots of people commenting on what's changed and having started my career working for the Scottish Gp Capt when he was the Scottish Gp Capt, I've seen those changes too. However, to me the important stuff is what hasn't changed. In the main:
I still go to work with a bunch of people I would trust my life to.
We still banter in pretty much the same non-PC way we did in the 80s.
If they're asked to do stuff then they'll do their damndest to get it done.
Apart from missing the family, Ops are still the most satisfying part of the job.
The youngsters are just as keen, motivated as we ever were (but they're probably cleverer and less naive)
So they're missing out on RAFG and Tacevals in the same way I missed out on Changi and Aden. Their Air Force is less than 40,000 strong, 'my' Air Force was almost 100,000 and the old lags when I joined talked of an RAF of a million. Things change, but the character of the people doesn't. In the end, so what if yesterday's generation winge about the state of things - it was ever thus.
I'm sorry if all this sounds PR guff but it's how I feel. The RAF is still a great place to be for the people who want to be there. And that includes, for the moment, me.
I still go to work with a bunch of people I would trust my life to.
We still banter in pretty much the same non-PC way we did in the 80s.
If they're asked to do stuff then they'll do their damndest to get it done.
Apart from missing the family, Ops are still the most satisfying part of the job.
The youngsters are just as keen, motivated as we ever were (but they're probably cleverer and less naive)
So they're missing out on RAFG and Tacevals in the same way I missed out on Changi and Aden. Their Air Force is less than 40,000 strong, 'my' Air Force was almost 100,000 and the old lags when I joined talked of an RAF of a million. Things change, but the character of the people doesn't. In the end, so what if yesterday's generation winge about the state of things - it was ever thus.
I'm sorry if all this sounds PR guff but it's how I feel. The RAF is still a great place to be for the people who want to be there. And that includes, for the moment, me.
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^^^
RLE...well said sir.
To anybody still in the mob and reading this pretty decent well-balanced thread, the game of..."everything's changed for the worse" is clearly as old as the hills. You can imagine an old centurion lamenting such like, shortly after Caeser got voted out the forum, Roman style.
Fact is times change and whether the net effect is for better or worse is entirely a matter of personal perspective.
Just remember the old adage...look before you leap. The WSOP job was recently advertised in the press, at a starting salary of circa £34K. Where I live that is the going rate for a senior manager in a large company, or a company director of a small business (I've been both). And I absolutely guarantee that...
They will be working a lot more hours.
They will have zero job security.
They will have 28 days off a year...if they are lucky.
They will not have a pension unless they are buying it themselves.
Of course they probably won't be being shot at...so you pays your money and you take your chance.
GL whatever each and everyone of you decide to do.
RLE...well said sir.To anybody still in the mob and reading this pretty decent well-balanced thread, the game of..."everything's changed for the worse" is clearly as old as the hills. You can imagine an old centurion lamenting such like, shortly after Caeser got voted out the forum, Roman style.
Fact is times change and whether the net effect is for better or worse is entirely a matter of personal perspective.
Just remember the old adage...look before you leap. The WSOP job was recently advertised in the press, at a starting salary of circa £34K. Where I live that is the going rate for a senior manager in a large company, or a company director of a small business (I've been both). And I absolutely guarantee that...
They will be working a lot more hours.
They will have zero job security.
They will have 28 days off a year...if they are lucky.
They will not have a pension unless they are buying it themselves.
Of course they probably won't be being shot at...so you pays your money and you take your chance.
GL whatever each and everyone of you decide to do.
Last edited by The Old Fat One; 27th Nov 2012 at 09:07.
I've resisted joining this thread, but here goes...
After 27 years in 2 Services and several close shaves with leaving the RAF prematurely (and still serving) I enjoy immensly what I do. Would I have done things differently? Probably. Do I miss my brief flying career? Not really.
Have there been tours I've hated? One or two were not what I wanted but I got the best out of them, in part due to the great guys and girls that I have worked with. And that's the key - it's the people, not the job. Several years ago we went to a family wedding and the happy couple (both City lawyers) were supported by some of their City Alpha Male (and Alpha Female) friends. They were all about 30, earning 6 figure salaries...and hating every minute of it. They didn't trust their co-workers, they didn't trust their bosses, they were incredibly cynical about their work, and they couldn't wait to do the mythical 'down-shift' and move to a more simple life.
By comparison I had just returned from AFG, had a really interesting job in MB, had previously served overseas etc etc. I trusted my bosses, I really trusted my fellow SP and CS, I generally believed in what I was doing...etc.
Yes, the RAF is smaller and there are few overseas postings now; but when I joined people were bemoaning the loss of Singapore, Gan, you name it. However, for those who know me and my blunty background, in the last 13 years I have managed to pack in a huge range of operational tours, overseas postings, joint appointments and now likely to top it off with another great posting (probably my last). How have I done this? Self belief and doggedly pursuing the Desk officer with options - not problems! (and an understanding wife....)
In sum, would I join if I was 18-23 now? Absolutely!
After 27 years in 2 Services and several close shaves with leaving the RAF prematurely (and still serving) I enjoy immensly what I do. Would I have done things differently? Probably. Do I miss my brief flying career? Not really.
Have there been tours I've hated? One or two were not what I wanted but I got the best out of them, in part due to the great guys and girls that I have worked with. And that's the key - it's the people, not the job. Several years ago we went to a family wedding and the happy couple (both City lawyers) were supported by some of their City Alpha Male (and Alpha Female) friends. They were all about 30, earning 6 figure salaries...and hating every minute of it. They didn't trust their co-workers, they didn't trust their bosses, they were incredibly cynical about their work, and they couldn't wait to do the mythical 'down-shift' and move to a more simple life.
By comparison I had just returned from AFG, had a really interesting job in MB, had previously served overseas etc etc. I trusted my bosses, I really trusted my fellow SP and CS, I generally believed in what I was doing...etc.
Yes, the RAF is smaller and there are few overseas postings now; but when I joined people were bemoaning the loss of Singapore, Gan, you name it. However, for those who know me and my blunty background, in the last 13 years I have managed to pack in a huge range of operational tours, overseas postings, joint appointments and now likely to top it off with another great posting (probably my last). How have I done this? Self belief and doggedly pursuing the Desk officer with options - not problems! (and an understanding wife....)
In sum, would I join if I was 18-23 now? Absolutely!
Last edited by Whenurhappy; 27th Nov 2012 at 16:30.
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Here's the exam question for the nay sayers out there:
What would you do instead?
If a young lad or lady asked your advice - you'd genuinely say "Don't bother mate, go and be a ......". Really?
Where else can one fly, control or maintain (whole ship me!
) military hardware? Why do 'lad mags' regularly contain some form of military fantasy? Answer - because everyone has one but few have the motivation to fulfill them. We are those few, those happy (sometimes not) few. Fortunately we enjoy an all volunteer armed forces. Which is actually the great part about this thread - everyone volunteered no matter whether or not they'd do it again. (Well done us.)
I have always felt incredibly sorry for those, no matter how well off, that go to work simply to pay for their hobbies at the weekend. I go to work because it pretty much is my hobby.
And yes I have worked with knobs, yes I have genuinely wanted to kill some people 'on our side' and yes - I have briefly flirted with plans to leave. But I'd do it all again in a heart beat.
What would you do instead?
If a young lad or lady asked your advice - you'd genuinely say "Don't bother mate, go and be a ......". Really?
Where else can one fly, control or maintain (whole ship me!
) military hardware? Why do 'lad mags' regularly contain some form of military fantasy? Answer - because everyone has one but few have the motivation to fulfill them. We are those few, those happy (sometimes not) few. Fortunately we enjoy an all volunteer armed forces. Which is actually the great part about this thread - everyone volunteered no matter whether or not they'd do it again. (Well done us.)I have always felt incredibly sorry for those, no matter how well off, that go to work simply to pay for their hobbies at the weekend. I go to work because it pretty much is my hobby.
And yes I have worked with knobs, yes I have genuinely wanted to kill some people 'on our side' and yes - I have briefly flirted with plans to leave. But I'd do it all again in a heart beat.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
I have an 18 yr old nephew. He wanted to be a pilot in the RAF. Then he switched his goal to the AAC. More recently to go civvie. I suspect that he has been persuaded to go in that direction with scant consideration of the inevitable costs to his parents, as there is no way a bright 18 yr old can finance his own training.
The Forces on the other hand . . .
TOD has the right of it on earning power. Yes, there are high powered, higher paying jobs but even now to they offer the quality of life?
The Forces on the other hand . . .
TOD has the right of it on earning power. Yes, there are high powered, higher paying jobs but even now to they offer the quality of life?
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I left last year just shy of 42 years service. The RAF has changed, but no more so than virtually every other aspect of life in the country.
Would I join up now? In a heart beat.
Would I join up now? In a heart beat.
Dengue Dude
I've only just read your post (#68) and presume it was directed at me. You appear to have missed my point.
I wholeheartedly agree that everyone is entitled to an opinion and I, for one, am very glad that we are not all the same. Life would be dull if that were the case.
I was just trying to answer the original question. Would I as an 18/21 year old still want to join the RAF as a fighter pilot in 2012? The answer is a categorical yes because I wouldn't know any different. I joined in 1999 having harboured the dream of flying FJs since my parents took me to the Yeovilton Air Days of the early 80's. Wild Horses couldn't have dragged me away (tenuous Rolling Stones reference).
On the other hand would I, as a 36 year old married father of two, join in 2012? Maybe not but that was not my personal circumstances when I went to the recruiting office. However, as mentioned above, what the hell would I be doing instead? I would bet money it wouldn't be as much fun as flying low level at high speed and dropping bombs.
I can absolutely understand why others feel differently but to compare the RAF of 1972 with the RAF of 2012 is fallicy.
I am very heartened to see that there are still guys who want to live the dream. good luck to them all.
I don't want to come across as a stuck record so I shall leave it there.
BV
I wholeheartedly agree that everyone is entitled to an opinion and I, for one, am very glad that we are not all the same. Life would be dull if that were the case.
I was just trying to answer the original question. Would I as an 18/21 year old still want to join the RAF as a fighter pilot in 2012? The answer is a categorical yes because I wouldn't know any different. I joined in 1999 having harboured the dream of flying FJs since my parents took me to the Yeovilton Air Days of the early 80's. Wild Horses couldn't have dragged me away (tenuous Rolling Stones reference).
On the other hand would I, as a 36 year old married father of two, join in 2012? Maybe not but that was not my personal circumstances when I went to the recruiting office. However, as mentioned above, what the hell would I be doing instead? I would bet money it wouldn't be as much fun as flying low level at high speed and dropping bombs.
I can absolutely understand why others feel differently but to compare the RAF of 1972 with the RAF of 2012 is fallicy.
I am very heartened to see that there are still guys who want to live the dream. good luck to them all.
I don't want to come across as a stuck record so I shall leave it there.
BV
Bob, the first Yeovilton air show I can remember featured the Avro 707C! (No, not the 504 before any smart ar$e suggests that!)
The shows with formations of Sea Hawks, Sea Venoms plus the odds and sods like Meteors and Wyverns...
Then there was the show which featured the 'forthcoming' Sea Vixen and Scimitar prototypes. I can still remember exatly what the Scimitar's impressive arrival and max rate turn around the airfield sounded like!
The show with Vixens doing an airfield attack - and another doing a simulated tactical nuclear weapon 'over-the-shoulder' attack. Good flash, bang and petrol mushroom cloud followed!
The shows with the 'new' Phantoms......and Simon's Circus.....and the Blue Herons....
Yes, you can't compare the RAF of 1972 with the RAF (or RN) of today. But you could compare the RAF of 1992 with the RAF of 1972 and it would still have been easily recognisable. It was the rapid degeneration following the mid-90s which ruined everything in my opinion, I'm sorry to have to say.
The shows with formations of Sea Hawks, Sea Venoms plus the odds and sods like Meteors and Wyverns...
Then there was the show which featured the 'forthcoming' Sea Vixen and Scimitar prototypes. I can still remember exatly what the Scimitar's impressive arrival and max rate turn around the airfield sounded like!
The show with Vixens doing an airfield attack - and another doing a simulated tactical nuclear weapon 'over-the-shoulder' attack. Good flash, bang and petrol mushroom cloud followed!
The shows with the 'new' Phantoms......and Simon's Circus.....and the Blue Herons....
Yes, you can't compare the RAF of 1972 with the RAF (or RN) of today. But you could compare the RAF of 1992 with the RAF of 1972 and it would still have been easily recognisable. It was the rapid degeneration following the mid-90s which ruined everything in my opinion, I'm sorry to have to say.
Last edited by BEagle; 27th Nov 2012 at 18:40.
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Having read all of this with some interest, and being officially "an old fart", I feel that I ought to contribute my twopennorth.
At the age of 6 or 7 I was intrigued by aeroplanes and thought it would be great if I could "do that".
At the age of 10 I was pretty much decided that I was going to be the best fighter pilot there had ever been (apart that is from Ace Brave who was really a space pilot but who cared, he was still a hero!).
At the age of 15 I had narrowed it down to the fact that I was going to be the best goddam Hunter pilot in the world!
I was very fortunate in that I fooled enough of the people enough of the time that I was able to become a Hunter pilot.
I really rather like to think that there are still a lot of young bloods out there who have today's equivalent of my dreams, and who will pursue them as hard as they can. If I am wrong then I shall go sit in a corner chewing a hankie and crying.
Right you lot, yes I lived through the best of times in the RAF (OK OK in my opinion that is).
Would I recommend that today's youth sign on the dotted line to join the RAF? Not only would I ...... I do whenever I get the chance.
Whether or not I believe that the RAF today is as much fun as it was, is as much of a challenge as it was, is as well equipped as it was, is as well supported as it was, is as well led as it was, or whatever ..... the one thing that I can pretty much be certain of (because it has to be this way) is that the people you will serve with will be an amazing bunch of guys and gals that - in my opinion - will be better in every way than the people that have chosen not to follow such a dream at your particular point in time.
You will have an awesome time that will be difficult to match anywhere else. You'll be pissed off severely at times, hell I was pissed off severely at times. Learn to live with that sh1t and make the most of life at its best anywhere!!!
So fu**ing there!
Edited to say: Joined in February 1964 and served continuously for 46 years, the last few as FTRS running an AEF.
At the age of 6 or 7 I was intrigued by aeroplanes and thought it would be great if I could "do that".
At the age of 10 I was pretty much decided that I was going to be the best fighter pilot there had ever been (apart that is from Ace Brave who was really a space pilot but who cared, he was still a hero!).
At the age of 15 I had narrowed it down to the fact that I was going to be the best goddam Hunter pilot in the world!
I was very fortunate in that I fooled enough of the people enough of the time that I was able to become a Hunter pilot.
I really rather like to think that there are still a lot of young bloods out there who have today's equivalent of my dreams, and who will pursue them as hard as they can. If I am wrong then I shall go sit in a corner chewing a hankie and crying.
Right you lot, yes I lived through the best of times in the RAF (OK OK in my opinion that is).
Would I recommend that today's youth sign on the dotted line to join the RAF? Not only would I ...... I do whenever I get the chance.
Whether or not I believe that the RAF today is as much fun as it was, is as much of a challenge as it was, is as well equipped as it was, is as well supported as it was, is as well led as it was, or whatever ..... the one thing that I can pretty much be certain of (because it has to be this way) is that the people you will serve with will be an amazing bunch of guys and gals that - in my opinion - will be better in every way than the people that have chosen not to follow such a dream at your particular point in time.
You will have an awesome time that will be difficult to match anywhere else. You'll be pissed off severely at times, hell I was pissed off severely at times. Learn to live with that sh1t and make the most of life at its best anywhere!!!
So fu**ing there!
Edited to say: Joined in February 1964 and served continuously for 46 years, the last few as FTRS running an AEF.
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Beagle is talking hoop as far as I'm concerned. The helicopter world was definitely not ruined in the mid 90s and has enjoyed it's heyday whilst I have been in. It's still a hoot and you know that you are doing a good job for those on the ground, whatever your service. Nothing like low level into the GZ in Helmand to give you the 'pucker factor' which has endured in spite of fewer aircraft numbers. The other enduring factor is the banter and camaraderie.
The answer is an emphatic 'yes I damn well would'.
The answer is an emphatic 'yes I damn well would'.
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Erehwon
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For Bob Viking
I wholeheartedly agree that everyone is entitled to an opinion and I, for one, am very glad that we are not all the same. Life would be dull if that were the case.
I was just trying to answer the original question. Would I as an 18/21 year old still want to join the RAF as a fighter pilot in 2012? The answer is a categorical yes because I wouldn't know any different. I joined in 1999 having harboured the dream of flying FJs since my parents took me to the Yeovilton Air Days of the early 80's. Wild Horses couldn't have dragged me away (tenuous Rolling Stones reference).
I was just trying to answer the original question. Would I as an 18/21 year old still want to join the RAF as a fighter pilot in 2012? The answer is a categorical yes because I wouldn't know any different. I joined in 1999 having harboured the dream of flying FJs since my parents took me to the Yeovilton Air Days of the early 80's. Wild Horses couldn't have dragged me away (tenuous Rolling Stones reference).
Sounds a bit quaint, but I did join up and learn a trade and I'm grateful for that. Would I join up now . . . unequivocally no. What would I do instead - wow, that's the tough one, frankly I don't know.
Anyway, thanks for clearing that up - that's one of the better things about some folks on the site. Not everyone can do that without a slanging match.
Take care.