Flying phobias in aircrew
Old Sarum
at Old Sarum ... waiting for the RN Commander to finish a lecture.
My dad may have been the said RN Commander, he was there from ~1959 - 1961. Not sure of the exact dates (I was under ten years old!) but I do remember we lived at No 1 Officers' Married Quarters
Last edited by kiwi grey; 11th Sep 2011 at 01:45.
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Interesting thread. Never had a problem airborne in anything. I can stand on the edge of the house roof where if I fell I could be a goner. However the edge of a 1,000 ft cliff (many here) no way 
We guide walking groups here, some people suffer vertigo in different scenarios. We have some clients who are happy with narrow cliff paths with dead drops but not happy with a narrow path on a 45 deg scree slope and vice versa.
There is a 2,000 ft cliff here which drops straight into the sea. At one point there is a very wide shelf about 5 ft down. My party trick was to rush ahead of the group and drop down onto it pretending to be hanging onto the edge of the cliff. Mrs Exascot has put a stop to that one, threatened to stop the beer allowance
We guide walking groups here, some people suffer vertigo in different scenarios. We have some clients who are happy with narrow cliff paths with dead drops but not happy with a narrow path on a 45 deg scree slope and vice versa.
There is a 2,000 ft cliff here which drops straight into the sea. At one point there is a very wide shelf about 5 ft down. My party trick was to rush ahead of the group and drop down onto it pretending to be hanging onto the edge of the cliff. Mrs Exascot has put a stop to that one, threatened to stop the beer allowance
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Cruise Zombie,
you ask,
There are several references on 'Fear of Flying' among pilots, but if you are looking for the same in classical military setting there is no better reference than Flying and danger, joy and fear, by Col (Retd) DR Jones.
However in commercial aviation setting, may be the statistics quoted by Chew, in his paper, Fear of flying - a Singapore perspective, may throw some light.
you ask,
Any information, or links to information, about such cases which may shine some light on this problem would be very helpful.
However in commercial aviation setting, may be the statistics quoted by Chew, in his paper, Fear of flying - a Singapore perspective, may throw some light.
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In the 1970's, on an AAC squadron in BAOR, I recall a Scout pilot who apparently lost confidence in his ability to fly and came off flying duties.
Unfortunately, I never found out what the outcome was as I moved on, but I always felt very safe in the aircraft when he was in control, and always had him on my "good pilot" list.
Unfortunately, I never found out what the outcome was as I moved on, but I always felt very safe in the aircraft when he was in control, and always had him on my "good pilot" list.
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In cloud/over the sea/in the dark/in the desert - and any combination of the former - but I used to cheer up at low level; provided I wasn't being shot at!
Seriously though, I did once get v stressed in a relatively straightforward job that I had no trouble doing. It manifested itself as my having trouble sleeping.
The day I was posted I slept for 12hrs straight - wierd thing the psyche....
Seriously though, I did once get v stressed in a relatively straightforward job that I had no trouble doing. It manifested itself as my having trouble sleeping.
The day I was posted I slept for 12hrs straight - wierd thing the psyche....
While we're recommending books, it's worth pointing out that Fear of Flying by Erica Jong hasn't got a great deal to say about the subject.
Lot's of sex in it though!
Lot's of sex in it though!
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Lots of talk here of being scared of open space and heights. What about claustrophobia?
Although I wasn't aircrew I was fortunate enough to do a fair amount of back and side seating in a variety of aircraft, and flew gliders for a while. I thoroughly enjoyed most of it, even the odd LABS trip!
Having once spent some time flying 4hr legs in the righthand back seat of a B15, I have some admiration for the Navs/Obs who flew in the Sea Vixen or Canberra PR9, and the back of the V's for that matter. I take my hat off to them.
Although I wasn't aircrew I was fortunate enough to do a fair amount of back and side seating in a variety of aircraft, and flew gliders for a while. I thoroughly enjoyed most of it, even the odd LABS trip!
Having once spent some time flying 4hr legs in the righthand back seat of a B15, I have some admiration for the Navs/Obs who flew in the Sea Vixen or Canberra PR9, and the back of the V's for that matter. I take my hat off to them.
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Many hours in the Nimrod down to 200ft and 300ft at night and never worried too much. Whilst looking out of the port beam, maintaining straight and level but watching the Afghan, Omani, Iraqi hills coming up to meet us, brought definite feelings of unease. Bit like being in a descent that nobody else had noticed!
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pontifex
The AEO you mentioned was my AEO on Victors and although his brothers death was the final straw I should have seen the signs long before. He never refused a trip but often gave signs of nervousness and on a long detachment overseas became very nervy and intolerant. It is easy to be wise after so much time has past and attitudes have changed but I wonder just how much help one could have given him at the time.
The AEO you mentioned was my AEO on Victors and although his brothers death was the final straw I should have seen the signs long before. He never refused a trip but often gave signs of nervousness and on a long detachment overseas became very nervy and intolerant. It is easy to be wise after so much time has past and attitudes have changed but I wonder just how much help one could have given him at the time.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Art, the AEO I refered to was Vulcans and I do not believe ever did Victors, so more than one AEO.
They may have had the worst job at low level. No maps to see or radar just a periscope to show all the hills you had just missed.
They may have had the worst job at low level. No maps to see or radar just a periscope to show all the hills you had just missed.
The AEO story has reminded me of something I'd almost forgotten. A controller on my watch at LATCC ( West Drayton) in the 70s was the brother of the Trident captain in the Zagreb mid-air.
He never spoke to an aircraft again and was quietly pensioned-off. The days when there was still a caring side to management.
He never spoke to an aircraft again and was quietly pensioned-off. The days when there was still a caring side to management.
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Goudie
Thanks for mentioning what I imagine is the most common aircrew phobia of all - claustrophobia
I spent hours in the back of V bombers without any hint of claustrophobia. Even a small cockpit of, say, a JP was not a problem. But nothing would induce me to get into the inside (ie starboard) seat in the back of a Canberra. A panic attack would be guaranteed. ....can't get into the back of two door car either - would rather walk.
Wierd or what?
Thanks for mentioning what I imagine is the most common aircrew phobia of all - claustrophobia
I spent hours in the back of V bombers without any hint of claustrophobia. Even a small cockpit of, say, a JP was not a problem. But nothing would induce me to get into the inside (ie starboard) seat in the back of a Canberra. A panic attack would be guaranteed. ....can't get into the back of two door car either - would rather walk.
Wierd or what?
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Lasted until about 3:30 of the video, albeit with the hairs up on the back of my neck and found myself clenching my hands...as well as another part of the anatomy! I thought I was doing OK, even after he'd gone 'outside' and had even started to relax (marginally) when he clipped on just next to the spiky aerials.....then he unclipped again and I couldn't take any more!!
I've spent more than enough time orbiting a few thousand feet over the top of those great holiday spots like Basrah and Helmand, I love tactical descents from height to LL and can just about cope with ladders at home. Put me anywhere near a cliff edge (or even a slightly steep slope to be honest) and I'm hugging the far wall trying very hard not to look anywhere near the big open space!!
I've spent more than enough time orbiting a few thousand feet over the top of those great holiday spots like Basrah and Helmand, I love tactical descents from height to LL and can just about cope with ladders at home. Put me anywhere near a cliff edge (or even a slightly steep slope to be honest) and I'm hugging the far wall trying very hard not to look anywhere near the big open space!!
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Ok, sorry to put some airline flying on this thread. But I do sometimes have an irrational fear of a bomb going off in the hold. It doesn't last long and it's not a good feeling to have. It won't stop me flying and I hope it goes away. I think it may come from my hearing R/T reporting the Lockerbie Crash and seeing the faint glow to the south as I climbed out of Glasgow. But I'm not a shrink and so I wouldn't know.
I also get the dream about flying down a street, under power cables and bridges. Funny old thing about that is that my old Dad, 40 years at sea, used to dream he was driving his ship down a street. That stopped after he retired.
I also get the dream about flying down a street, under power cables and bridges. Funny old thing about that is that my old Dad, 40 years at sea, used to dream he was driving his ship down a street. That stopped after he retired.
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Returning the original subject:
Gordon Smith was a flying doc in CFS Standards at Little Rissington in the early 1970s who did rehab flying with aircrew.
Most were aircrew who suffered from airsickness and were being put through a desensitisation syllabus, but I remember one Lightning pilot who'd found LL over the sea at night less than comfortable and who they tried to coax back into confidence. Can't remember if he succeeded.
Perhaps the most memorable was an Iranian pilot who'd broken his back in a T33 crash and taught himself the Bader walk. He was being assessed to see if he could still fly OK despite the lower limb issue. As far as I recall he was passed OK in a JP.
Doc Smith sadly died in a Meteor accident at Farnborough a few years later.
When I was at CFS again 10 years later, this rehab flying had been moved to IAM at Farnborough.
Gordon Smith was a flying doc in CFS Standards at Little Rissington in the early 1970s who did rehab flying with aircrew.
Most were aircrew who suffered from airsickness and were being put through a desensitisation syllabus, but I remember one Lightning pilot who'd found LL over the sea at night less than comfortable and who they tried to coax back into confidence. Can't remember if he succeeded.
Perhaps the most memorable was an Iranian pilot who'd broken his back in a T33 crash and taught himself the Bader walk. He was being assessed to see if he could still fly OK despite the lower limb issue. As far as I recall he was passed OK in a JP.
Doc Smith sadly died in a Meteor accident at Farnborough a few years later.
When I was at CFS again 10 years later, this rehab flying had been moved to IAM at Farnborough.
