Extending air brake on approach
Why would a barn door require an airbrake/speedbrake in the first place?
Why, for dropping leaflets of course
- Probably because the Hunter had one...
Actually it was useful in formation flying
Why, for dropping leaflets of course
- Probably because the Hunter had one...
Actually it was useful in formation flying
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"All USN jet aircraft - until the Hornet - kept the speedbrake open for approaches for the same 'faster engine spool up response time' reason described earlier in the thread."
USN F-4 Phantom did not have the speedbrakes open for approaches. Also the A-7 would have had a hard time landing with their speedbrake out!!
USN F-4 Phantom did not have the speedbrakes open for approaches. Also the A-7 would have had a hard time landing with their speedbrake out!!
Never mind all this spool-up time business; good point about the leaflets, hum.
One of the best uses for a speed brake I've seen was on a bush push with my helicopter squadron.
Macchi MB326Hs were involved in the exercise and 'bombed' our squadron loc with masses of interleaved toilet tissue, having stuck it in their speed brake wells prior to departure. Seemed to come floating down forever. Nice work!
One of the best uses for a speed brake I've seen was on a bush push with my helicopter squadron.
Macchi MB326Hs were involved in the exercise and 'bombed' our squadron loc with masses of interleaved toilet tissue, having stuck it in their speed brake wells prior to departure. Seemed to come floating down forever. Nice work!
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Yep, classic A4G bog paper in the S/Bs trick - must be an Oz thing. In the meantime for youse crabs (and thanks for the headsup 'Tomcatvf51') straight from the F-4B NATOPS: [click de tumbs]
Used the A/B on a Tucano to deliver Mars bars once. We were doing the 'Location Exercise' part of the junior course's survival training and we thought that once we found them, they might appreciate some treats. So we lowered and raised the A/B on the hand pump, making sure there was a good selection of goodies trapped (remembering not to test the A/B after start). We found the survivors OK, then set up for a run, flicking the switch at the approprite moment.
One thing we failed to appreciate was that a long transit at altitude had frozen the Mars bars rock solid and they had taken on the same properties as a 30mm ball round! They did find a couple - but it took some digging!
Good job my aim was lousy!
One thing we failed to appreciate was that a long transit at altitude had frozen the Mars bars rock solid and they had taken on the same properties as a 30mm ball round! They did find a couple - but it took some digging!
Good job my aim was lousy!
In case you had not seen it..
A good first-hand account of leaflet-dropping here... and a bit more..
Jever Steam Laundry - 4 Sqn personnel Pollock 004
Jever Steam Laundry - 4 Sqn personnel Pollock 004
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On the CF104 we used to put A4 envelopes full of cut up strips of foil(one shot chaff!) in the speed brakes both sides. (A hazardous job for the groundcrew as it was done after start).
Quite often we would not use this ECM! and with the standard practice of popping the speedbrake on short finals the locals would get hacked off with their Spargel fields full of foil.
The question is why was the speedbrake put on the Harrier in the first place? (Other then Hum's reasons). It was only after it was put their that someone found a use for it. Wonder where we have heard that before.
Quite often we would not use this ECM! and with the standard practice of popping the speedbrake on short finals the locals would get hacked off with their Spargel fields full of foil.
The question is why was the speedbrake put on the Harrier in the first place? (Other then Hum's reasons). It was only after it was put their that someone found a use for it. Wonder where we have heard that before.
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Falklands Harriers had Chaff Bundles in S/Bs
COPING WITH THE UNEXPECTED: GREAT BRITAIN AND THE WAR IN THE SOUTH ATLANTIC by Christopher J. Bowie | April 1985
http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc...f&AD=ADA158354 [PDF 1.5Mb]
"...Heavy radar-directed gunfire led to a quick electronic countermeasure (ECM) "fix" on both RN and RAF Harriers. Resource constraints had prevented the British from providing these aircraft with a chaff dispensing system; to reduce their vulnerability during combat in the South Atlantic, the Harriers carried chaff bundles in speed brake wells and jammed between munitions and pylons for release over engagement zones. By May 20, the Harriers had been fitted with an internal chaff/flare dispenser unit...." page 7
http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc...f&AD=ADA158354 [PDF 1.5Mb]
"...Heavy radar-directed gunfire led to a quick electronic countermeasure (ECM) "fix" on both RN and RAF Harriers. Resource constraints had prevented the British from providing these aircraft with a chaff dispensing system; to reduce their vulnerability during combat in the South Atlantic, the Harriers carried chaff bundles in speed brake wells and jammed between munitions and pylons for release over engagement zones. By May 20, the Harriers had been fitted with an internal chaff/flare dispenser unit...." page 7
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A good first-hand account of leaflet-dropping here... and a bit more..
Jever Steam Laundry - 4 Sqn personnel Pollock 004
Jever Steam Laundry - 4 Sqn personnel Pollock 004
absolutely brilliant!! =D
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4.4.10 SPEED BRAKES | page 75 (of 220)
http://www.robertheffley.com/docs/HQ...IR_2002_71.pdf (3Mb)
“Many historic Navy aircraft extended speed brakes on CV approach. This provided several benefits.
First, the increased drag of the speed brakes moved the bottom of the drag bucket to a lower speed, moving the Vpa closer to the frontside of the power-required curve, and thus improving the flightpath stability. Next, the additional drag necessitated a higher mean power setting, with two consequent benefits. A higher mean power point enabled faster, more linear thrust response, thereby improving GS tracking.
Furthermore, the higher mean power setting permitted a quicker transition to full power in the event of either bolter or waveoff. This, together with simultaneous stowage of the speed brakes, permitted more rapid achievement of the maximum excess power. While not deployed by the F/A-18A-D models on approach, speed brakes remain a viable means of improving the handling and performance on approach (e.g., operationally deployed EA-6B and F-14).”
http://www.robertheffley.com/docs/HQ...IR_2002_71.pdf (3Mb)
“Many historic Navy aircraft extended speed brakes on CV approach. This provided several benefits.
First, the increased drag of the speed brakes moved the bottom of the drag bucket to a lower speed, moving the Vpa closer to the frontside of the power-required curve, and thus improving the flightpath stability. Next, the additional drag necessitated a higher mean power setting, with two consequent benefits. A higher mean power point enabled faster, more linear thrust response, thereby improving GS tracking.
Furthermore, the higher mean power setting permitted a quicker transition to full power in the event of either bolter or waveoff. This, together with simultaneous stowage of the speed brakes, permitted more rapid achievement of the maximum excess power. While not deployed by the F/A-18A-D models on approach, speed brakes remain a viable means of improving the handling and performance on approach (e.g., operationally deployed EA-6B and F-14).”
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In June 1957, victims of Duncan Sandys infamous white paper, we dropped leaflets on to as many 2TAF airfields as we could manage. We stowed them in the Hunters' flaps rather than the airbrakes, which caused some interesting pitch changes when my close formation leader (Bodger Edwards) elected to travel across Ahlhorn very low at about 450 kias and called for 20° flap. Meanwhile our Staish was not amused when he heard of the drops & sent for our boss. The conversation apparently went roughly:-
Staish: "How am I going to explain this, what can I say to the C-in-C, what is he going to say about all this?"
Boss: " I don't know , Sir, but while I was refuelling at Geilenkirchen before doing the drop at 2TAF HQ he telephoned me and asked me to delay by 10 minutes so that he could get outside and watch".
The leaflets carried diagrams of bowler hats, umbrellas & Cerberus, and read:
WE REGRET TO ANNOUNCE THE PASSING
AT ROYAL AIR FORCE, JEVER,OF
No. 98 SQUADRON
LONGEST IN 2nd T.A.F.
BELOVED BY ALL CREDITORS, ANGRY HUSBANDS,
SATISFIED SPINSTERS, BREWERS etc.,
OF REDUNDANCY ....................R.I.P.
(BEST WISHES TO ALL IN THE SAME PREDICAMENT AND THOSE IN BETTER STRAITS)
Staish: "How am I going to explain this, what can I say to the C-in-C, what is he going to say about all this?"
Boss: " I don't know , Sir, but while I was refuelling at Geilenkirchen before doing the drop at 2TAF HQ he telephoned me and asked me to delay by 10 minutes so that he could get outside and watch".
The leaflets carried diagrams of bowler hats, umbrellas & Cerberus, and read:
WE REGRET TO ANNOUNCE THE PASSING
AT ROYAL AIR FORCE, JEVER,OF
No. 98 SQUADRON
LONGEST IN 2nd T.A.F.
BELOVED BY ALL CREDITORS, ANGRY HUSBANDS,
SATISFIED SPINSTERS, BREWERS etc.,
OF REDUNDANCY ....................R.I.P.
(BEST WISHES TO ALL IN THE SAME PREDICAMENT AND THOSE IN BETTER STRAITS)
