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Royal Air Force Club

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Royal Air Force Club

Old 2nd Jun 2011, 23:20
  #141 (permalink)  
 
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Update

Just to let you all know, I wrote to Group Captain Tony Banks, the author of the article in the Club newsletter which provoked this discussion, with what I thought was a fair summary of the various points raised on this thread (favourable and unfavourable). He also has the link to the thread so he can read it in full if he wishes.

I have today heard from the Club Secretary, Peter Owen, that Gp Capt Banks has received the email, and its contents will be discussed at the next board meeting on 16th June.

After that I'm hoping for some feedback, and naturally I'll keep you informed.

TTN
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Old 2nd Jun 2011, 23:37
  #142 (permalink)  
 
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...or to post thousand upon thousand of WIWO drivel in here...
See now you're a hostage to fortune. You'll not be able to give up pprune, it's way too addictive!

Still you can change your user name to save face and we will never know.
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 02:45
  #143 (permalink)  
 
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There are likely to many retired officers living a great distance away who would only use the services of the club once a decade or so but who, nevertheless, would like to retain a link - just in case!

Perhaps Tony might care to have a think about a much, much reduced subscription to take account of this situation.

With plans to visit the UK in 2013 for my training entry's 50th reunion the ability to stay at the Club and introduce my wife to the genteel delights of a British London club would be invaluable.
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 04:04
  #144 (permalink)  
 
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Sisemen, old chap, assuming you dwell under Capricorn, you could always join an Antipodean Club (such as the Naval, Military and Air Force Club of South Australia) that has reciprocal membership rights with many UK, European and North American clubs, including the establishment at 128 Piccadilly.

Membership - Naval, Military and Air Force Club of South Australia
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 07:24
  #145 (permalink)  
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There are likely to many retired officers living a great distance away who would only use the services of the club once a decade or so but who, nevertheless, would like to retain a link - just in case!

Perhaps Tony might care to have a think about a much, much reduced subscription to take account of this situation.
I will second that. And, thank you for your action TTNav.

On my last very rare visit we couldn't get a room and we were put into The Caledonian Club where ladies were not allowed into the bar. Needless to say neither was I by my wife

Last edited by Exascot; 3rd Jun 2011 at 07:30. Reason: Addition
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 09:46
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Perhaps Tony might care to have a think about a much, much reduced subscription to take account of this situation.
One of the points I covered in my letter. I thought that at around £50 (currently £131), a lot more retired officers living a long way from the capital might be tempted to take up "country " membership, with maybe room occupancy restricted to a certain number of days a year.

Blimey Exascot , amazed that places like The Caledonian Club still exist! Do the men have to wear skirts (sorry, kilts) to make up for the lack of ladies?
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 09:51
  #147 (permalink)  
 
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A "country membership" category is long overdue. If the Club wishes to retain the membership of retiring members and encourage those "oop north" and us "out west" to pop in occasionally I am sure that apart from the principle of the matter the trustees could come up with such a scheme. Any reduced subscription rate could maybe be offset by a slighthty higher accomodation charge which would still be good value for the location and quality that the club offers.
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 10:15
  #148 (permalink)  
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Blimey Exascot , amazed that places like The Caledonian Club still exist! Do the men have to wear skirts (sorry, kilts) to make up for the lack of ladies?
'In the public rooms, gentlemen are required to wear suits or jackets with ties and ladies to conform to the same standard.'

It actually doesn't mention kilts in their rules (above) but there again it doesn't mention trousers either

All I know is that a certain little lady will not be staying there again.

It is however a splendid establishment.
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 11:32
  #149 (permalink)  
 
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A "country membership" category is long overdue. If the Club wishes to retain the membership of retiring members and encourage those "oop north" and us "out west" to pop in occasionally I am sure that apart from the principle of the matter the trustees could come up with such a scheme.
How would you define 'country membership' limits though? Even if you said '100 miles from London' (or whatever), there'll always be someone living 99.9 miles away who would be disadvantaged by such a ruling.

Nevertheless, the Club must not become a 'London-centric' institution.

(But do we really want to encourage FNMs to come up to Town? )
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 12:39
  #150 (permalink)  
 
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Allow an NCO to help you all out...

Membership need not be based on distance. A person who regularly travels from Edinburgh would benefit unfairly. Surely, it can be charged by use with an inverse formula to allow for those who rarely if ever visit. Pulling numbers from the air, (the board will know what it needs to sustain itself), let's say that a standard membership is £100pa. For that you get unlimited use of the club and can book rooms whenever they are available. Each time you enter the club you must "sign in" at the door, (maybe you can be given a Membership Card that can be swiped to save time, effort and staff intervention). Each subsequent year, your dues are reduced from £100 by £10 for each visit less than 8 you made to the club the previous year leaving someone who did not visit at all with a £20 bill. That would be affordable to maintain a membership and should you use it 20 times that year your bill will go back to £100 the next year. To discourage those who would let membership lapse because they are too cheap to pay the £20 the board could institute a "lapsed membership" surcharge of £100 on the first year of a returning member's dues.

As I say the numbers are pulled from the air but it makes some sense. The club would receive a minimum of £20pa from people who never use the facilities, (thus not making dues a punitive burden for those who wish to be members but can rarely avail themselves), and a varying amount each year from those who use it infrequently up to £90pa and £100pa from the regular users. Since the amount you pay each year is dependent upon the previous years use then changes in personal circumstances automatically adjust to fit.

You don't need to thank me just PM me for the address to send my cheque...
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 13:00
  #151 (permalink)  
 
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Perhaps the 'country membership' could be on a sliding scale that reduces the annual subscription the further away from London you live?

Absolutely no connection to the fact that I live in Aberdeenshire...
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Old 3rd Jun 2011, 23:15
  #152 (permalink)  
 
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I belong to the Phyllis court Club in Henley on Thames as an o/seas member which has a reciprocal agreement with the RAF club so cancelled my subscription and use that facility when I want to go there. I love the exSpeedbird remark. I used to belong to the same 2 airlines as him and wish I had thought of doing what he did when he was last there - the uniform!!!!! Mind you whilst wearing my uniform to go to work on a provincial railway station once I was asked what time the train for so and so got in and I replied that I didnt know and was told by the person who asked me that she was going to report me to the Station Master for insubordination. I wonder if she thought that 4 gold stripes and a pair of wings on my uniform was indicative of a station porter. Sorry for going off thread!!!!!











1
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Old 4th Jun 2011, 14:08
  #153 (permalink)  
 
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Argus -
you could always join an Antipodean Club (such as the Naval, Military and Air Force Club of South Australia)
With an entrance fee of $939 plus an annual sub of $470 for a 'country' member it would almost be worth it for a West Aussie to get a first class flight to London, go to the RAF Club in person and empty my wallet on the front counter. And with the value of the Oz dollar currently cutting my RAF pension virtually in half the likelihood of spending dosh in SA is somewhat unlikely.
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Old 5th Jun 2011, 13:36
  #154 (permalink)  
 
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As much as I enjoy staying at the RAF Club, not having had a bad experience in over a decade, I must qualify that statement with the fact that I have only stayed at the Club on a handful of occassions in the past 12 years having been unable to get a room there on almost all recent attempts to book. So much so, that when I recently spent the weekend in London with friends, we automatically discounted the Club on the grounds that as we rarely manage to get in as individuals, there was likely to be no chance for 4 of us collectively, so we went to The Cumberland instead and got exactly what we wanted, when we wanted.

And although the price is quite good for Central London, I really think that the days of single rooms with facilities down the corridor are a little old fashioned in the 21st century and will almost certainly put off people used to at least having a reasonable sized bed and basic facilities on hand. This isn't basic training, and I think to remain competitive, then a baseline standard of rooms really has to be considered rather than simply titivating old tired rooms.

Finally, whilst I notice that the Club has introduced an online booking system which allows you to check availability, I still can't help but feel that something must be done to mitigate the perceptions of many younger serving members that the Club is dominated by retired senior and air officers who have the luxury of being able to book months in advance. It really would be a huge step forward if a proportion of the rooms were set aside for current serving personnel who don't necessarily know whether or not they will in the country next week, let alone be able to arrange their diaries months in advance. That would be an acknowledgement of the operational climate and tempo of operations that current serving members are enduring, and would be a nod towards addressing their specific needs. Failure to at least look at the issue of retired vs serving availability will only further alienate those serving members who are already frustrated, with the likely effect of continued declining membership. In many cases, I suspect inertia is the only thing keeping many serving members on the Club's books.
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 08:01
  #155 (permalink)  
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the luxury of being able to book months in advance. It really would be a huge step forward if a proportion of the rooms were set aside for current serving personnel who don't necessarily know whether or not they will in the country next week, let alone be able to arrange their diaries months in advance.
Holding back a few rooms might be a good idea.

Once I was delayed in UK before RTU and shared a twin room with a Gp Capt also caught short. Another time I was able to use the club next door. I was in town and caught when 7/7 shut London; Mrs PN was able to book me a room.

As for arranging your diary; I learnt years ago to book early and cancel late. Unfair maybe but that was the system. Now the book early can be months early; anyone booked for the Olympics yet?
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 10:06
  #156 (permalink)  
 
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I think Melchetts comment about 'inertia' keeping people is probably a good one. Certainly when the subs were automatically taken from my pay it kept me as a member (as I never actually got round to cancelling!). However, now that the automatic deduction from pay has been binned it has effectively cancelled my membership by default. I'm a little torn, it was nice to have that feeling of membership but the sums don't really add up. For the number of years I haven't stayed in the Club my annual membership could have paid for some very nice digs in a more modern and convenient accommodation.

J_J
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 11:18
  #157 (permalink)  
 
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Tankertrashnav
Blimey is that Fred in the middle behind the counter, or is it a cardboard cutout? He's been there so long he can remember Pontius Navigator as an APO!
I'll be very sorry to see him go. He's one of the last who understands the ethos of the club. Perhaps I'll go before he does

rolling20,
IIRC, membership of the C&G varies from £150 to £650.

Tankertrashnav, I understand your wish to have an open discussion of the RAFC but it IS a private club and, regrettably, there are always those who are unable to contain themselves. If this airing attracts new members then well and good. Meant to bring it up at a BBQ on Saturday with an ex VR and senior trainer and forgot.
There's always the club's own discussion forum.

There was some mention of The In & Out. Is it still operating as a club?


May I ask the poster to remove the caption to the picture in post #19
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 14:11
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An olde boys club.................

I too got shivers down my spine on entering it but I have let my membership relax for two reasons. The service which I did not find welcoming last year on either the telephone or in person when I popped in for apre-dinner sharpener. In the last 9 years I have never been able to get a room when I wanted one and when I delved into it I found that some on the mgt staff give preferential treatment to the retired members as they believed wrongly that those who were serving could go elsewhwere to other messes in the city. I was even asked if I had tried the officers mess at Uxbridge by one member on the front desk. It was this that made me give up my membership and advised those going through Cranwell to do the same when ever they came on a stn visit.

It will be a sad loss but they need to get those serving in the door and remind the old ones that they are just that - retired members.

I give it 5 years before its gone...............and as an ex knocker I do not believe it should be opened up to SNCO Cadre. It is an Officers club and Beagle is right.
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 16:02
  #159 (permalink)  
 
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May I ask the poster to remove the caption to the picture in post #19
Basil, as the OP I have done what I should have done right away and used the "report" button on the left and asked the Mods to deal with it, which they have done pretty swiftly. Pity the picture has gone too, as it was rather a good one, but at least the obnoxious comments are no longer there.

Btw The In and Out (The Naval and Military) moved to St James in 1999, but as of last year nothing had come of plans to re-open the old place as a hotel or whatever. Pity, it's a magnificent location.

In and Out Club on the market as sale fails | Business
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 17:27
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Tankertrashnav,
Thanks, I wondered what was going on.
There are a few other empty buildings along Piclidicly which would seem to be prime locations for something or other.
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