Quarter of RAF trainee pilots to be sacked
Very sad, particularly when dissenting views to any subject or a comment get responses pulled for no good reason, and not for anything against the Pprune rules. Very disappointed indeed at whoever did it. Can I suggest the forums are intended for debate, not for following the party line slavishly.
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GrahamO - it would be helpful if you could be a little more specific with your accusations.
I have just spent the time going through this whole thread. The sum total of deleted posts comes to:
a. About half a dozen that I deleted on 13 and 14 Feb as they were severe thread drift and absolutely nothing to do with the topic under discussion. For example, personal slanging matches about who gets flying pay and when, and whether or not they deserve it is rather outside the sphere of this subject. None of these were your posts.
b. There were 7 posts deleted by the posters themselves on 13, 14, 15, 26 and 28 Feb (one of them was yours).
c. There was one post deleted on 13 Mar because it had been posted twice by a newbie who obviously made a mistake.
So maybe you could make it a bit more clear where "slavishly following the party line" has detracted from this debate, because I actually have better things to do with my time than to spend it refuting odd charges from the punters.
Many thanks in advance .
I have just spent the time going through this whole thread. The sum total of deleted posts comes to:
a. About half a dozen that I deleted on 13 and 14 Feb as they were severe thread drift and absolutely nothing to do with the topic under discussion. For example, personal slanging matches about who gets flying pay and when, and whether or not they deserve it is rather outside the sphere of this subject. None of these were your posts.
b. There were 7 posts deleted by the posters themselves on 13, 14, 15, 26 and 28 Feb (one of them was yours).
c. There was one post deleted on 13 Mar because it had been posted twice by a newbie who obviously made a mistake.
So maybe you could make it a bit more clear where "slavishly following the party line" has detracted from this debate, because I actually have better things to do with my time than to spend it refuting odd charges from the punters.
Many thanks in advance .
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Hmmmmmm - seems to have gone very quiet in here. Shame really,as I would have liked a reply so that I didn't feel that I had wasted all that time!
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High Spirits - I'm with you all the way. I'm sat here behind a desk inside the M25 writing to PPRuNe when I should be flying!
PS - I was on my first Sqn at 21 in 1986. Ahh those were the days - 250' in RAFG, F104s to laugh at, LOA, tax-free beer. Pull up a sand-bag.......
PS - I was on my first Sqn at 21 in 1986. Ahh those were the days - 250' in RAFG, F104s to laugh at, LOA, tax-free beer. Pull up a sand-bag.......
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Re post 388
I was selected for national service pilot training having arrived at Padgate 30 Nov '49. We were kitted out for about a week, then to Hornchurch for aptitude tests etc, back to Padgate for a couple of days then those selected went to Driffield to hold until Christmas. 28 Dec report to No 1 ITS Wittering for groundschool, drill etc. At Easter the whole unit moved to Jurby, then 17 May 50 to 6 FTS Tern Hill until 31 May 51. When I started national service was for eighteen months so that should have been the end of my time but sometime around the start of 1951 it was increased to two years. So providing there were no holdups you were awarded your wings, commissioned or became a sgt pilot, then had time to go on leave, go to 202 AFS Valley on 2nd Jul via a week holding at Feltwell, and at the end of October to 229 OCU Chivenor. Not enough time for me to complete the course before finishing national service on 28 Nov 51. After five months of civvy street I rejoined, went reluctantly to CFS and was instructing on Meteors age twenty one and a bit but had it not been for that posting (and that's another story ) to become a QFI I would have been on a fighter squadron before my 21st birthday.
A prerequisit of acceptance for pilot training was an agreement to complete five years in either the RAux AF or RAFVR. I seem to remember that there were periods of leave at natural points during training such as completion of ITS, end of basic (Prentice) and on completion of Harvard phase.
A prerequisit of acceptance for pilot training was an agreement to complete five years in either the RAux AF or RAFVR. I seem to remember that there were periods of leave at natural points during training such as completion of ITS, end of basic (Prentice) and on completion of Harvard phase.
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"When I were a lad",
In the 50s, before gaps between training courses, holding postings & leave had been invented, things were a little quicker. Having joined the RAF in September 1954 I was declared "Operational" (Combat Ready?) in January 1957 at 20˝ years old. Training included flying the Hunter F1 (no T7 yet) for the first time on my 20th birthday at Pembrey, nice present from my Flight Commander!
In the 50s, before gaps between training courses, holding postings & leave had been invented, things were a little quicker. Having joined the RAF in September 1954 I was declared "Operational" (Combat Ready?) in January 1957 at 20˝ years old. Training included flying the Hunter F1 (no T7 yet) for the first time on my 20th birthday at Pembrey, nice present from my Flight Commander!
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Conversion ...
From Meteors (inc. T7) and Vampires (inc. T11) to Hunters wasn't that difficult - some hours poring over Pilots' Notes and sitting in the cockpit "doing" the checks with a supervisor on the access ladder did the trick. How else ?
Did Lightning squadrons get 2-seaters before or after single-seaters?
Did Lightning squadrons get 2-seaters before or after single-seaters?
Last edited by Jig Peter; 8th Apr 2011 at 13:29. Reason: typo (again !)
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Caught in the act ...
And there was I thinking nobody was watching ...
But that experience came in handy when I had a go in the A320 simulator (not ecksherly flown one though) years later - PIO on finals - Berk !!!
But that experience came in handy when I had a go in the A320 simulator (not ecksherly flown one though) years later - PIO on finals - Berk !!!
Last edited by Jig Peter; 8th Apr 2011 at 13:46. Reason: Add PS
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In those days, with no T7 - how did you undertake conversion to the Hunter?
The OCU was a bit less formal than its modern counterparts, Since the Hunter F1 was fairly restricted in endurance what it could do (2100 lbs fuel, no gun firing) the first half of the OCU was flown on VampireT11 and FB5, just as our FTS had been. When it was time to fly the Hunter, our first flight included a supervised start, after which we were (literally) on our own. When all the checks including the take-off vital actions were complete before taxying, I can still remember the staff pilot patting me on the bonedome and shouting “Remember you’ve got 30 minutes of fuel to learn how to land the thing”
Prior to the flight we were supposed to have completed a written test on the aircraft systems and have this certificate pasted into our log book:-
No. 233(F) O.C.U. - R,A.F. PEMBREY
PILOT'S PRE-SOLO CERTIFICATE OF COMPETENCE
1. Certified that I have received ground instruction on the
following subjects and that I fully understand the use of each
service on the Hunter F.1:-
(a) Avon engine Mk. 115
(b) Power Control system
(c) Hydraulic system (including wheel brakes)
(d) Electrical system (including R./T)
e) Fuel system
(f) Oxygen system
2. I certify that I have completed the Hunter questionnaire
in writing. I have also been checked out in the Hunter instr-
uctional cockpit and I am fully conversant with:-
(a) Vital actions
(b) Action in the event of emergencies
(c) Re-light procedure
(d) Procedure for abandoning aircraft
3. I possess an amended copy of Hunter F,1 Pilot's Notes and
I understand that I am not to fly without carrying them on me,
I also possess a copy of "Hints on Flying the Hunter F.1".
Date 10th July 1956 ...............................
Pilot's Signature
Certified that this pilots pre-solo Certificate of
Competence is correct and has been pasted into his flying log-
book, His questionnaire (serial no. 9) has been filed.
Date.10.7.56 .............................
O.C. "B" 'Flight
The 10th July, however, was the first day back at work after the mid-course long weekend. In mid afternoon my Flight Commander found me in the hangar, trying to learn where things were in the cockpit. He’d noticed it was my birthday and thought that my first Hunter trip would be a nice present.
In the rush, no-one noticed that this administration had been overlooked, so it was completed as a post flight procedure the following day, with a flexible attitude to the recorded date. He was right, though, it was one of the most memorable presents I ever had.
And we all knew you were on your first flight in the Hunter by the way your wings "twitched" after take off.
airsound
My dreams of becoming a Hunter pilot were dashed by a short sighted politician by the name of Duncan Sandys! Our course (Vampire) passed out of Swinderby in July 1957. There were 18 of us, 11 regular and 7 national service - who were demobbed immediately after receiving their wings. I was the only student with a posting to Hunters. My course was not due to start until December, so I was detached to Valley (RN Vampire FTS) to beg borrow and steal as many hours as I could muster. On the 17th of October, which just happened to be my birthday, I was informed that all the RAF courses at Chivenor had been cancelled and I was to report to 242 OCU Dishforth to start a Hastings second pilot course the following week. I was a very pissed off pilot officer!
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NutherA2
29th June 1956 I had my one and only trip in a Seahawk. I was stationed at Tangmere. By this time we had all converted to the Hunter F5 but there were still some Meteors left. Being owed a favour by Lt Cdr Bloggs, having given him an IRT and passed him so he could go to the Air Warfare College (the Navy needed five hours actual in the last six months whereas the RAF accepted two hours actual and eight simulated) I took a Meteor for the short trip to Ford where I was met, taken to their coffee bar, handed a mug and the Pilot's Notes for the Seahawk. I had reached the first page where it said "the the Seahawk is a single seat naval fighter" when I was told that the aircraft was ready. On explaining that I 'd not read the PNs they said "you've flown Meteors, Vampires and Hunters so no sweat. Just make sure the wings are locked". Somebody had the decency to lean over my shoulder to make quite sure and off I went for an hour. When I landed I was offered a trip in a Wyvern which co-incided with the arrival of an ashen faced aviator saying that his had caught fire downwind. As they say in the News of the World, I made my excuses and left ! Shortly after that we Quickfired off to Cyprus for a week which became months, returning just before Christmas. That put paid to my hopes of further FAA aircraft flying.
Things were simple in those days. There were numerous chaps in 2TAF who, when squadrons exchanged for a week or so, were able to have a trip in the other's aircraft but no doubt they had a proper briefing. A ride in a RCAF Sabre for a ride in a Hunter.
Things were simple in those days. There were numerous chaps in 2TAF who, when squadrons exchanged for a week or so, were able to have a trip in the other's aircraft but no doubt they had a proper briefing. A ride in a RCAF Sabre for a ride in a Hunter.
Tangmere is one of those magical RAF names - as is West Malling.
My first ULAS Summer Camp was at RAF Thorney Island in 1970; by then I'd finished my circuit consolidation, so spent most of the time aerobatting over the Isle de Blanche.
But those who hadn't finished circuit bashing were sent off to RAF Tangmere to do so. A few months later, Tangmere closed. I've kicked myself ever since for not having Tangmere in my logbook! But at least I had one landing at Malling!
It is simply appalling the way the RAF is being hacked to pieces these days. How lucky we were in the early 1970s; as UAS Acting Pilot Officers we were paid well and had a pretty good future ahead of us - lots of new aircraft coming into service and everyone was looking forward to flying the JP at Cranwell.
Now look at it. Makes you sick....
My first ULAS Summer Camp was at RAF Thorney Island in 1970; by then I'd finished my circuit consolidation, so spent most of the time aerobatting over the Isle de Blanche.
But those who hadn't finished circuit bashing were sent off to RAF Tangmere to do so. A few months later, Tangmere closed. I've kicked myself ever since for not having Tangmere in my logbook! But at least I had one landing at Malling!
It is simply appalling the way the RAF is being hacked to pieces these days. How lucky we were in the early 1970s; as UAS Acting Pilot Officers we were paid well and had a pretty good future ahead of us - lots of new aircraft coming into service and everyone was looking forward to flying the JP at Cranwell.
Now look at it. Makes you sick....
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BEags,
I was at Thorney Island a couple of weeks ago on a day much like today (now where is that Weber thread?) and, not surprisingly, the people who serve there are a very happy bunch. The runway is still in reasonably good nick and used by visiting light aircraft occasionally.
LE
I was at Thorney Island a couple of weeks ago on a day much like today (now where is that Weber thread?) and, not surprisingly, the people who serve there are a very happy bunch. The runway is still in reasonably good nick and used by visiting light aircraft occasionally.
LE
