91 Year Old Spitfire Pilot Needs Your Help
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 82
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
91 Year Old Spitfire Pilot Needs Your Help
I have just finished filming a 91 year old Spitfire photo reconnaissance pilot talking about his wartime experiences. Alec would have to fly over to Brest in France, which was the heaviest defended of the occupied ports on the French coast. A total of five Spitfires were shot down over Brest trying to look out for the Battleship "Scharnhorst" & submarines. Alec would then have to fly on to St-Nazaire, La Rochelle, Bairritz & St Jean-de-Luz on the Spanish Border photographing all the harbours & airfields. They weren't armed & had extra fuel tanks fitted where the machine guns, cannons & ammunition used to be. He would have to fly nearly 1,000nm.
On one sortie over Brest, he was hit by flak & soon, engine oil covered his windscreen & side canopy, so had to fly back to St Eval in Cornwall on instruments. When he thought that he was about there, he opened the canopy slightly so he could see out of the side, to land. He carried out a perfect landing but unfortunately, his brakes were damaged so went off the end of the runway & the Spitfire flipped up on it's nose. He was uninjured so was flying the very next day.
In 2002, Alec attended the 60th anniversary reunion of the PRU at RAF Benson & was asked if he would bring photographs of his Spitfires & his aerial reconnaissance pictures as well as press cuttings that he had saved, to be displayed at the event. After the reunion, when his items were not returned, he wrote to the Flt Sgt that was organising the event. He didn't get a response, so wrote to Benson's C.O. & again amazingly didn't receive a response. He even tried to get his local Member of Parliament involved, but without success. Alec is nearly blind now & this has had a bad effect on him. He gave his all for the Airforce & feels badly let down by the modern Airforce, which is a shame as he is a smashing gentleman.
I know that this is a long shot because the many years that have past, but if there is anyone out there that might have any information on Alec's property, you would make a very brave aviator very happy.
On one sortie over Brest, he was hit by flak & soon, engine oil covered his windscreen & side canopy, so had to fly back to St Eval in Cornwall on instruments. When he thought that he was about there, he opened the canopy slightly so he could see out of the side, to land. He carried out a perfect landing but unfortunately, his brakes were damaged so went off the end of the runway & the Spitfire flipped up on it's nose. He was uninjured so was flying the very next day.
In 2002, Alec attended the 60th anniversary reunion of the PRU at RAF Benson & was asked if he would bring photographs of his Spitfires & his aerial reconnaissance pictures as well as press cuttings that he had saved, to be displayed at the event. After the reunion, when his items were not returned, he wrote to the Flt Sgt that was organising the event. He didn't get a response, so wrote to Benson's C.O. & again amazingly didn't receive a response. He even tried to get his local Member of Parliament involved, but without success. Alec is nearly blind now & this has had a bad effect on him. He gave his all for the Airforce & feels badly let down by the modern Airforce, which is a shame as he is a smashing gentleman.
I know that this is a long shot because the many years that have past, but if there is anyone out there that might have any information on Alec's property, you would make a very brave aviator very happy.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 32,742
Received 2,726 Likes
on
1,159 Posts
That is absolutely disgusting... Shame on them. 
In 2001 I loaned an album of WWI aerial photographs (taken in Palestine and France, with annotations) to the PR museum at Benson. Tried to view it several years later - the said folio could not be found...
I am surprised, however, that the Stn Cdr didn't respond to the letter from the former Spitfire Pilot. A quiet call to the Adj or PA/CO should get this matter sorted out, pdq.
I am surprised, however, that the Stn Cdr didn't respond to the letter from the former Spitfire Pilot. A quiet call to the Adj or PA/CO should get this matter sorted out, pdq.
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Somewhere
Posts: 868
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Try the Benson MCO (I have copied this thread to her) and she might be able to point somebody in the right direction.
RAF Benson - Visiting Us
RAF Benson - Visiting Us
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Singapore
Age: 61
Posts: 89
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
VIProds
Do you have any names? In particular the Flt Sgt? I think I know who the CO was at the time, but names would be useful. Stick them up here and you will have a response in hours, either that or send them by PM.
We once had an Octoberfest in Germany and invited some very special German guests one particular year. One of them was an old boy, maybe 70 years who came wearing the best traditional German clothes, including a Hat with badges and medals on covering Octoberfests around Germany for the previous 50 years. He elected to leave his hat in the cloakroom of the Officers Mess, a fair thing to be able to expect to do. By the end of the night, when he was going to leave the hat had gone. He had been wearing this since he was 20 years old. he was simply stunned, and we had that 'beam me up Scotty' moment. I am not sure I have felt embarrassment like it, either before or since. Despite an appeal around the station we never had the hat returned, and we lost some very good local Station friends and landowners. The main culprit was a young Fg Off who had been holding. He never answered the 'charges'.
Mmmmm! Good luck with the search for the photos, sadly the elderly chap was willing to give his life for this generation, but someone somewhere will not be willing to give him his memories back.
Do you have any names? In particular the Flt Sgt? I think I know who the CO was at the time, but names would be useful. Stick them up here and you will have a response in hours, either that or send them by PM.
We once had an Octoberfest in Germany and invited some very special German guests one particular year. One of them was an old boy, maybe 70 years who came wearing the best traditional German clothes, including a Hat with badges and medals on covering Octoberfests around Germany for the previous 50 years. He elected to leave his hat in the cloakroom of the Officers Mess, a fair thing to be able to expect to do. By the end of the night, when he was going to leave the hat had gone. He had been wearing this since he was 20 years old. he was simply stunned, and we had that 'beam me up Scotty' moment. I am not sure I have felt embarrassment like it, either before or since. Despite an appeal around the station we never had the hat returned, and we lost some very good local Station friends and landowners. The main culprit was a young Fg Off who had been holding. He never answered the 'charges'.
Mmmmm! Good luck with the search for the photos, sadly the elderly chap was willing to give his life for this generation, but someone somewhere will not be willing to give him his memories back.
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Somewhere
Posts: 868
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks to VIProds for bringing this to the public fourm. With the power of PPRuNe I have contacted the Benson MCO/PRO who has asked me to publish the following on behalf of the Station (she does not have a Proon account).
Hopefully this will go someway to helping Alec achieving the response he should have been originally afforded.
Edit: email address = *[email protected]*
Hopefully this will go someway to helping Alec achieving the response he should have been originally afforded.
“Unfortunately due to our operational commitments the collation of our historic material, both donated to us and loaned to us, was delayed for a number of years and there was no dedicated team available to look after it thus it was simply stored. This has now been rectified and we are fully cataloguing all material and ensuring that it is displayed with the correct recognition and honour to which we owe those who have served our country. We have recently opened our Heritage Centre, which takes pride of place in Station Headquarters and displays RAF Benson’s historic information, images and artefacts. If anyone believes that they have loaned images or artefacts to RAF Benson and they would like to obtain them, please do get in contact with the Public Relations Officer via email at [email protected] giving details of the items and she will ensure that a thorough search of the archives is completed at the earliest opportunity.”
Edit: email address = *[email protected]*
Last edited by TheWizard; 9th Dec 2010 at 14:53. Reason: Addition of email
Not good enough.
Start with an unequivocal apology, rather than an excuse.
Don't use phrases such as 'If anyone believes they have loaned images...' unless you want to imply that Alec and others are somehow suffering from senility.
What is 'the earliest opportunity' supposed to mean? To a 91 year old man in ill health that's not very helpful. At least be accountable to those on whom you depend for contributions. A deadline would be a start.
End by reinforcing your regret for any inconvenience that may have been caused.
Again, rubbish response, but par for the course if the experience of Alec and others is anything to go by.
Start with an unequivocal apology, rather than an excuse.
Don't use phrases such as 'If anyone believes they have loaned images...' unless you want to imply that Alec and others are somehow suffering from senility.
What is 'the earliest opportunity' supposed to mean? To a 91 year old man in ill health that's not very helpful. At least be accountable to those on whom you depend for contributions. A deadline would be a start.
End by reinforcing your regret for any inconvenience that may have been caused.
Again, rubbish response, but par for the course if the experience of Alec and others is anything to go by.
TheWizard, good effort, but that Kremlin Communique from whatever an MCO/PRO is was frankly appalling. Totally inadequate in all respects - it's worse than some customer service excuse.
No apology - and the cr@p about 'operational commitments' simply doesn't hold water. Benson had $od all 'operational commitments' back in 2002 and someone (probably the Flt Sgt) totally cocked up.
Tell the woman to damn well get herself a PPRuNe account immediately so that she can tell us what she is doing about this unacceptable state of affairs tomorrow.
A VIP station visit should be arranged personally by the Stn Cdr - this gallant old chap put his neck on the line for his country all those years ago and all he gets is this bland statement? Nonsense - Benson, you screwed up in spades, now sodding well unbugger things!
And whilst you're at it, get the plastic Spitfire repaired - last time I saw it, it was an utter disgrace.
But perhaps symptomatic of today's pitiful excuse for an air force?
No apology - and the cr@p about 'operational commitments' simply doesn't hold water. Benson had $od all 'operational commitments' back in 2002 and someone (probably the Flt Sgt) totally cocked up.
Tell the woman to damn well get herself a PPRuNe account immediately so that she can tell us what she is doing about this unacceptable state of affairs tomorrow.
A VIP station visit should be arranged personally by the Stn Cdr - this gallant old chap put his neck on the line for his country all those years ago and all he gets is this bland statement? Nonsense - Benson, you screwed up in spades, now sodding well unbugger things!
And whilst you're at it, get the plastic Spitfire repaired - last time I saw it, it was an utter disgrace.
But perhaps symptomatic of today's pitiful excuse for an air force?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 82
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Many thanks for your inputs & TheWizard's help in getting the PRO's e-mail address. I drove Alec & his wife to our Aircrew Association Ladies Christmas Luncheon yesterday & while there asked if he would mind me mentioning it on PPRuNe. He didn't mind, but thought it was a lost cause. He obviously didn't realise the PPower of PPRuNe.
I have just 'phoned Alec & he is over the moon whith your support & gave me more details of what he lent them. I am about to e-mail the PRO with the details, so will keep you informed.
I have just 'phoned Alec & he is over the moon whith your support & gave me more details of what he lent them. I am about to e-mail the PRO with the details, so will keep you informed.
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Cheshire, California, Geneva, and Paris
Age: 67
Posts: 867
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The non-commital and bland statement from a representative of the Royal Air Force probably comes from page one of the PR handbook together with "Lessons will be learnt" and "Our thoughts and prayers are with the family"
It is also on a par with any statement issued by Tesco, Morrisons, PC World, or Asda but certainly inferior to Marks and Spencer after all that appears to be what the Royal Air Force is nowadays a multi-cultural, market orientated, profit centre with budget holder responsibilities.
God, how I hate the modern world!!!
It is also on a par with any statement issued by Tesco, Morrisons, PC World, or Asda but certainly inferior to Marks and Spencer after all that appears to be what the Royal Air Force is nowadays a multi-cultural, market orientated, profit centre with budget holder responsibilities.
God, how I hate the modern world!!!
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Deep inth Norhtern Hills
Posts: 264
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Disgrace!
What a disgrace!
My father is 91 and an ex spitfire pilot, his pictures and other momentos are a big part of his life.
t
I do hope the RAF get this sorted asap. It would be nice if the pprune members could all chip in and lets send this guy something nice for Xmas!
PB
My father is 91 and an ex spitfire pilot, his pictures and other momentos are a big part of his life.
t
I do hope the RAF get this sorted asap. It would be nice if the pprune members could all chip in and lets send this guy something nice for Xmas!
PB
The Modern World
It's fair to say I seriously regret being a member of this so called modern world. Alec has been treated appallingly and deserves infinitely better. A while ago I closed an ex WW2 recce Sqn and sadly put a considerable amount of history into the hands of the RAF to look after, just in case..... When the Sqn was eventually reformed the new team went to get the stuff only to find bits missing with some pretty horrible allegations about where they had gone. Fortunately the valuable pieces had been stored securely elsewhere thanks to a strong, influential Association. We are losing the decent core of everything I loved when I joined the RAF and I really regret it. I will continue to do my bit, all the rest of you who are serving must do yours to try and maintain at least a modicum of the history we have inherited.
?
Originally Posted by MartinCh
What about involving some tabloid papers?
I agree with previous posters - publicly putting the onus back on Alec to get his own loaned property back is disgraceful.
This reads a bit like a 'how not to do PR' nightmare!
My personal view is that if this sat within my area, I would be making a quick phone call to the MOD press office in Main Building, advising them that right now there is the making of a wonderful tabloid story on this website, and that unless something is done PDQ, then the RAF is about to be seriously publicly embarrased and its all its own fault. I would suggest that some fairly quick damage control is needed now, as this is the sort of story that Tabloids love, and will enjoy running (particularly if they can do a 'it woz the sun wot won it' angle).
Rebrief the key people now, get them in over the weekend if needs be to find the items and then get someone suitably (i.e. very) senior to turn up at this gentlemans house and present him with his belongings in person with a full and unreserved apology.
People are always busy, but in my book, anything involving individuals who served us at our time of greatest need goes straight to the top of the 'to do' pile regardless of what else is brewing. We owe them a debt we can never repay, and shabby treatment like this is a disgrace.
My personal view is that if this sat within my area, I would be making a quick phone call to the MOD press office in Main Building, advising them that right now there is the making of a wonderful tabloid story on this website, and that unless something is done PDQ, then the RAF is about to be seriously publicly embarrased and its all its own fault. I would suggest that some fairly quick damage control is needed now, as this is the sort of story that Tabloids love, and will enjoy running (particularly if they can do a 'it woz the sun wot won it' angle).
Rebrief the key people now, get them in over the weekend if needs be to find the items and then get someone suitably (i.e. very) senior to turn up at this gentlemans house and present him with his belongings in person with a full and unreserved apology.
People are always busy, but in my book, anything involving individuals who served us at our time of greatest need goes straight to the top of the 'to do' pile regardless of what else is brewing. We owe them a debt we can never repay, and shabby treatment like this is a disgrace.
Jimlad - agreed. I hope they use this as an example at Staff College / Media Ops cses etc of how not to manage a situation, because frankly it really does tick all the boxes of how not to do it.
Sadly, probably not the first time, certainly won't be the last time, and it's not just the RAF. My grandfather was a sgt in the Paras when they first stood up. I remember my grandmother lent my grandfather's medals back to the Army for a display they were doing in the 80s. Half of them went missing, and she had to do the donkey work with the Medals Office to get them replaced. She was so proud of his service and what he had done for his country, but that one incident was the only thing I know to have rankled her right to the end.
We really do know how to shoot ourselves in the foot sometimes. Then again, if you're going to cock it up, you may as well make it a whopper like this. I used to be the Station Historian at one of my old units, and frankly, it was fantastic getting to talk to the old boys and legitimately sloping off work to host them. But here, it seems to be a bit of a chore. Many of us here may not be able to actively do anything to help reunite Alec with his photos, but buy God VIProds, I think it's fair to say you have our total support in your efforts.
Sadly, probably not the first time, certainly won't be the last time, and it's not just the RAF. My grandfather was a sgt in the Paras when they first stood up. I remember my grandmother lent my grandfather's medals back to the Army for a display they were doing in the 80s. Half of them went missing, and she had to do the donkey work with the Medals Office to get them replaced. She was so proud of his service and what he had done for his country, but that one incident was the only thing I know to have rankled her right to the end.
We really do know how to shoot ourselves in the foot sometimes. Then again, if you're going to cock it up, you may as well make it a whopper like this. I used to be the Station Historian at one of my old units, and frankly, it was fantastic getting to talk to the old boys and legitimately sloping off work to host them. But here, it seems to be a bit of a chore. Many of us here may not be able to actively do anything to help reunite Alec with his photos, but buy God VIProds, I think it's fair to say you have our total support in your efforts.
Sadly, I have had a similar experience with many of my father's mementos that were loaned to a squadron at ISK ... I have never ever even had a letter acknowledging anything about them ...
I'm glad I left when I did...
I'm glad I left when I did...
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Detroit MI
Age: 66
Posts: 1,460
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As a passing thought, if any of you have anything on paper related to earlier days, be it RAF or Family, get it put on a PC soon as you can. Let's not lose anything else for the want of a good copy being made. I am working my way through a digital vault of our family photographs. This way, no one house fire will rob all of the kids of their heritage.
It might not be important to you, the rest of your family or their kids. But one day one of your descendants will thank you more than you can imagine for keeping such precious artifacts.
All that having been said - Benson needs utterly reaming... They have stolen a families heritage. Shame on them, utter shame!
