Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Military Aviation
Reload this Page >

Request for FJ wheels up pics

Wikiposts
Search
Military Aviation A forum for the professionals who fly military hardware. Also for the backroom boys and girls who support the flying and maintain the equipment, and without whom nothing would ever leave the ground. All armies, navies and air forces of the world equally welcome here.

Request for FJ wheels up pics

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 7th Oct 2010, 13:28
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Luberon
Age: 72
Posts: 953
Likes: 0
Received 7 Likes on 3 Posts
Originally Posted by Trim Stab
Why not just use the control tower?
You have to get close enough first.....

sitigeltfel is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 13:28
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Southampton
Posts: 859
Received 42 Likes on 21 Posts
It's not just coming into land that caravans were useful.

I've stopped many aircraft in the past as I've spotted something wrong as they'd taxied past me on the line. That was just luck though. Having someone at the beginning of the runway who's job it is to give every aircraft a once over before it takes off will prove it's worth in the long run, especially if it saves someon'e life.
Saintsman is online now  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 13:51
  #23 (permalink)  
Drain Bamaged
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Earth
Age: 56
Posts: 536
Received 33 Likes on 13 Posts
Inside gear up landing footage for a change!



Not so funny for the one who did it
ehwatezedoing is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 13:53
  #24 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Longton, Lancs, UK
Age: 80
Posts: 1,527
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
All explained in this interesting site Gainesy

Radfan and the Hawker Hunter
jindabyne is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 14:26
  #25 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Lincs
Posts: 2,307
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
JEM60 wrote,

TEEJ. Many thanks.
No problem.

TJ
TEEEJ is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 14:32
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,780
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Having someone at the beginning of the runway who's job it is to give every aircraft a once over before it takes off will prove it's worth in the long run, especially if it saves someon'e life.
That's the pilot's responsibility too.

How do the RAF manage when they visit civilian airfields?
Trim Stab is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 15:07
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Luberon
Age: 72
Posts: 953
Likes: 0
Received 7 Likes on 3 Posts
Not every RAF airfield had a runway caravan. IIRC the main requirements were, MDA's, where flying training was taking place or if the runway threshold could not be seen from the tower.
sitigeltfel is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 16:35
  #28 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Here and there
Age: 41
Posts: 245
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 1 Post
That's the pilot's responsibility too.

How do the RAF manage when they visit civilian airfields?
Have you always been a chopper, or is it something you've taken up recently?

Feel free to give it the big "I am" about how great a pilot you are, but you should probably remember that a) you weren't good enough (and I say that as a non-pilot), and b) the least safe people are those whose self-belief exceeds their talent...
frodo_monkey is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 17:52
  #29 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Devon
Age: 71
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Civvy/GA pilots don't really need a caravan , most of the aircraft they fly will have the gear down & welded anyway . As heard at Chiv. once when an Islander on finals was asked to "Check gear" by ATC . "Down & welded" was the reply .
grandfer is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 18:30
  #30 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,780
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Some aggressive replies above.

I'm just curious as to why some RAF personnel seek to justify a caravan to avoid wheels up landings. It seems a bit of a sensitive subject though, given that some of you are getting a bit annoyed!
Trim Stab is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 18:59
  #31 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Trim Stab

I went solo in a jet aircraft with retractable undercarriage at the tender age of 19 with around 50 hours total flying under my belt, as did many others at the time (don't get too jealous).

Because of that small amount of experience, the RAF's risk mitigation was to stick a caravan at the end of the runway - an insurance policy if you like against Mr. Cockup knocking at the door. Guess what? It worked and may have saved a few aircraft and crew from being mashed.

If you have a problem with that, then I'd seriously question your attitude towards flight safety.
Lockstock is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:21
  #32 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,780
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I think you are getting a bit uppity, trying to defend the indefensible. Landing wheels up has no excuse for a professional pilot, whether civilian or military.

Trying to blame it on a lack of caravans is absurd. The aircrew should take responsibility for the final checks themselves.

If you follow one of the links above to the contributions by the Blue Angels pilot who forgot to put the gear down, he doesn't try to blame a lack of caravans does he?
Trim Stab is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:25
  #33 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: 58-33N. 00-18W. Peterborough UK
Posts: 3,040
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Trim Stab, give it a rest for God's sake.
forget is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:29
  #34 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,780
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
lol! Wheels up landings are obviously a touchy subject for the RAF.
Trim Stab is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:30
  #35 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The Roman Empire
Posts: 2,448
Received 72 Likes on 33 Posts
Here we go again.....

Trim - in the example quoted by Lockstock, a 19 year old with a total of 50 hours, is he a "professional pilot" as you refer to it, or a young and inexperienced individual who the system should try to support as much as possible, and can be expected to make mistakes - hopefully not disasterous ones.......

If you dislike military avaition so much why are you interested in becoming a reservist on FSTA????
Biggus is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:30
  #36 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: London
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Hehe..love the quote above about confidence exceeding ability...truest words in aviation.

As a civvie pilot (albeit one who displays ex-military aircraft) I have to say trim stab, there really are those that have and those that will...if they do enough of the right sort of flying.

Never forgotten the gear in me jet but one time after a particularly challenging display practice...well, let's just say I was grateful for the voice from the tower "Check greens".

To deny the possibilty of it happening to you...well, see the quote above.

Cheers
Dunbar is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:37
  #37 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,780
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
As a civvie pilot (albeit one who displays ex-military aircraft) I have to say trim stab, there really are those that have and those that will...if they do enough of the right sort of flying.
What is the "right sort" of flying in your view? One where you don't make basic pre-landing checks?
Trim Stab is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:47
  #38 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: London
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
You're a funny guy. You been flying long?
Dunbar is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:51
  #39 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 816
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Your attitude to flighty safety is, quite frankly, retarded.
Torque Tonight is offline  
Old 7th Oct 2010, 19:54
  #40 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: London
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I wanted to, I really did, but I can't just leave it at that...

Challenging flight + distraction in the approach phase + single pilot (though that doesn't have to be the case) = possibility of failure to deploy undercarriage.

I know pilots should never do it, but as humans we are not naturally adapted to cope with all aspects of aviation and as an airliner TRI/TRE, single engine piston instructor and display pilot I appreciate the possibility that it might happen to me.

So should you, ace.
Dunbar is offline  


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.