F-35 Cancelled, then what ?
Just so the guys in the Zils don't come round my place again, I have to say it's a great movie. By the way, the last guys you sent are still in my basement.
What can one say? The SUper Flanker is a hell of a jet and they told us what we already know about the F35 in close, visual combat. Let's hope the long range stuff is so good they never have to get there.
What can one say? The SUper Flanker is a hell of a jet and they told us what we already know about the F35 in close, visual combat. Let's hope the long range stuff is so good they never have to get there.
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: London
Age: 64
Posts: 238
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How many Super Flankers can be bought with the cost of one F-35 ?
Is the F-35 a Yak 141 in drag? They both burn up the tarmac on landing.
Is the F-35 a Yak 141 in drag? They both burn up the tarmac on landing.
Last edited by Stuffy; 23rd Mar 2013 at 16:38.
When we were doing the future basing plan for F-35, the burning up of the tarmac and the noise were the two biggest issues. When Lossie was the base of choice, the cost drivers included both of those. Big bucks and the worry about where else they might be able to operate from.
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 495
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
except that it's bullschite and rand didn't conduct a study as per their statement
you guys should know better than using Kopp as a source
APA clown club is a joke
I'm pretty sure russia ended wvr bfm in the 80's when they brought out hobs and hmd and the west played catch-up, the odds of a mutual kill is too great.
you guys should know better than using Kopp as a source
APA clown club is a joke
I'm pretty sure russia ended wvr bfm in the 80's when they brought out hobs and hmd and the west played catch-up, the odds of a mutual kill is too great.
Last edited by JSFfan; 23rd Mar 2013 at 21:02.
JSFfan,
In air-to-air warfare, one cannot always choose where one fights the battle. If defenders fail to score 100% BVR the only way to engage the rest may well be a WVR fight; either that or run away, in which case the attackers win.
In air-to-air warfare, one cannot always choose where one fights the battle. If defenders fail to score 100% BVR the only way to engage the rest may well be a WVR fight; either that or run away, in which case the attackers win.
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: netherlands
Age: 56
Posts: 769
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm not a Sukhoi Su30/32 fan, but it seems to me the available space to put in a very large antenna and the payload available point to good long range/ BVR capabilities.
The bigger problem is that the Sukhois are enthusiastically exported and rebuild in and around Asia (China). In serious numbers.
File
perators of the Su-30.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Combined that with:
- F22 age and export restriction
- US defense cuts
- questions around F35 performance and price
- earlier then expected/ hoped J-20, J-31 prototypes flying in China
.. and it becomes clear countries like Australia, Japan, Taiwan are getting nervous and have started their own, independent programs.
The bigger problem is that the Sukhois are enthusiastically exported and rebuild in and around Asia (China). In serious numbers.
File
perators of the Su-30.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaCombined that with:
- F22 age and export restriction
- US defense cuts
- questions around F35 performance and price
- earlier then expected/ hoped J-20, J-31 prototypes flying in China
.. and it becomes clear countries like Australia, Japan, Taiwan are getting nervous and have started their own, independent programs.
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 495
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
there is wvr, then there is as I said wvr bfm which doesn't seem to be a good idea
AIM-9x SIDEWINDER Trial - YouTube
AIM-9x SIDEWINDER Trial - YouTube
Last edited by JSFfan; 24th Mar 2013 at 10:54.
.Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: London
Posts: 7,072
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
what is the availability of Su30/32's in places like Algeria, Venezuela, Uganda Vietnam, Malaysia & Indonesia ???
probably around 10% on a good day
probably around 10% on a good day
Last edited by Heathrow Harry; 24th Mar 2013 at 14:56.
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 495
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
glad rag, the aussies did asraam ots shots at woomera a litle while back, no video of it though and I'm surprised that the US releases video
Heathrow, it's no secret that we use jorn to keep up with the movements of each fighter in our region. you also have to take out the number of fighters that are used as personal toys by some big wigs, but they are getting better, indonesia sent some su-30 to an ex we did last year, opex pitch black
All Images - FotoWeb 7.0
Heathrow, it's no secret that we use jorn to keep up with the movements of each fighter in our region. you also have to take out the number of fighters that are used as personal toys by some big wigs, but they are getting better, indonesia sent some su-30 to an ex we did last year, opex pitch black
All Images - FotoWeb 7.0
Last edited by JSFfan; 24th Mar 2013 at 18:45.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Oz
Posts: 644
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
keesje
I'd have to question the accuracy of that second chart...only a minor point, but the "F-35 C" on that chart is actually an F-35A. Makes me wonder what else is wrong?
I didn't think the KFX and Shinshin had even been launched let alone properly defined yet. The artist sure must be good if he can draw scale plan representations of them!
Oh, and Australia has it's own independant programme?
Got a plan view of that one? 
I'd have to question the accuracy of that second chart...only a minor point, but the "F-35 C" on that chart is actually an F-35A. Makes me wonder what else is wrong?
I didn't think the KFX and Shinshin had even been launched let alone properly defined yet. The artist sure must be good if he can draw scale plan representations of them!
Oh, and Australia has it's own independant programme?
Got a plan view of that one?
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: netherlands
Age: 56
Posts: 769
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Of course the Australians didn't start their own program. They are on the JSF track, which is the perfect replacement for F111's, F18s and everything required for the next 30 yrs..
There are more initiatives though. Turkey is looking with Italy at options (TFX) and possibly Saab. India has set apart billions for their AMCA, the Koreans are reconsidering their KF-X and talking to Turkey (?)
I'm not sure the Germans/ French are sitting on their hands either. Even the frigg'n Iranians are developping a light stealth fighter. The Brazilians will come out if they can make money, Russia and China are steadily progressing. The Japanese are starting to loose their patience begging for F22s.
I'm just not sure the JSF is the answer to all requirements.
Sooner then we think/ hope a J-31 might land on a carrier & we can all be surprised again.
There are more initiatives though. Turkey is looking with Italy at options (TFX) and possibly Saab. India has set apart billions for their AMCA, the Koreans are reconsidering their KF-X and talking to Turkey (?)
I'm not sure the Germans/ French are sitting on their hands either. Even the frigg'n Iranians are developping a light stealth fighter. The Brazilians will come out if they can make money, Russia and China are steadily progressing. The Japanese are starting to loose their patience begging for F22s.
I'm just not sure the JSF is the answer to all requirements.
Sooner then we think/ hope a J-31 might land on a carrier & we can all be surprised again.
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 98
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As has been pointed out ad nauseum the Aussies have no seperate 'interceptor' program. I don't see why the chart applies to the F35? It's a strike fighter not an interceptor and I doubt anybody is dumb enough to try and use one as such. The F35 is being bought to replace F16, F18, A10 type aircraft which seems to be where it's KUR's are pitched. It's fairly clear that there has been some requirements creep with some of the stuff it's now expected to do and I suspect kinematically it'll probably be only just functional at them. But overall it's the first truly integrated military jet and I think the avionics and sensor fusion will be a winner. As for the performance side of it I'm almost certain like every other jet there will be multiple revisions to get it where it needs to be once it goes operational.
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Hertfordshire
Age: 74
Posts: 133
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
...the F35 [is] a strike fighter not an interceptor and I doubt anybody is dumb enough to try and use one as such.
I understand your point but if F35 in one of its guises is to replace F16, [F15?] F18, at least partially, and AV8B, it will be called upon for air defence duties to some extent. This may not have been its primary function but it will have to get adequate at it at the very least.
LF
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Waiting to return to the Loire.
Age: 54
Posts: 386
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I had momentarily forgotten that the F-16 was one of the fleets scheduled to be assimilated by the Borg / replaced by the F-35.
If that is the case, it will need to be as effective at the 'Fighter' bit as it is at the 'Strike' element.
And as for replacing the A-10? I think not..!
If that is the case, it will need to be as effective at the 'Fighter' bit as it is at the 'Strike' element.
And as for replacing the A-10? I think not..!
And as for replacing the A-10? I think not..!
I seem to recall attempts just before Op Desert Storm to get the A-10 retired, all efforts coming from the USAF side, not the Army. (Nor the Marines).
The Warthog flies yet, and is a favorite of ground commanders.