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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

Old 27th Nov 2019, 21:06
  #12061 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Near the coast
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Airsound

I could never be considered an expert in F35 ops but I’m guessing the answer is to use the EJ seat. Just like every other single engine, carrier borne aircraft that was thus equipped.

For the F35 to have been spec’d with a single engine I feel sure that lots of clever people had to first be sure the engine was safe enough for that situation.

From my, Air Force, perspective carrier ops are inherently risky at any time. I don’t think the F35, of any variant, has ratcheted up the risk level in any appreciable way.

BV
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Old 28th Nov 2019, 00:37
  #12062 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2003
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airsound,

As this is the exact same criteria for the Sea Harrier, I expect it is planned for and handled in exactly the same way, as BV says, by ejecting promptly.
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Old 28th Nov 2019, 07:33
  #12063 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
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air sound, et al,
there is no concept of V1 in a single engined aircraft. With engine failure, the aircraft is ‘no go’ , whereas the pilot, in this instance, is ‘go’.

As I recall there was discussion, even a requirement for ‘auto eject’ for seaborne STOL aircraft. The late JF presented this in review and history of vertical flight, and indicated that Russian aircraft had the capability, and had used it.
Adopting this for takeoff would be an interesting challenge.

After an interesting ‘pax’ flight off the experimental ramp at Bedford, JF related to an incident where an overseas evaluation pilot forgot to rotate the nozzles at ramp exit - not quite an engine failure, but … .

Is prevention of this aspect automated in the F-35 ?
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Old 29th Nov 2019, 17:02
  #12064 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Originally Posted by safetypee View Post
air sound, et al,
After an interesting ‘pax’ flight off the experimental ramp at Bedford, JF related to an incident where an overseas evaluation pilot forgot to rotate the nozzles at ramp exit - not quite an engine failure, but … .

Is prevention of this aspect automated in the F-35 ?

Yes, several people (including me!) have forgotten the nozzles off the ramp. Actually it was no prob as long as you remained wings-level. It didn't half accelerate to wing-borne flight sharpish but picking a wing up would have been tricky.

More exciting was forgetting the flap; this resulted in a very close encounter with the oggin, a certain amount of spray, a change of long-johns and a heart attack for Wings.

Swing the lamp.

Mog
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Old 29th Nov 2019, 17:53
  #12065 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Down South
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Originally Posted by Mogwi View Post



Yes, several people (including me!) have forgotten the nozzles off the ramp. Actually it was no prob as long as you remained wings-level. It didn't half accelerate to wing-borne flight sharpish but picking a wing up would have been tricky.

More exciting was forgetting the flap; this resulted in a very close encounter with the oggin, a certain amount of spray, a change of long-johns and a heart attack for Wings.

Swing the lamp.

Mog
Sir,

Your endeavours in the South Atlantic were nothing short of legendary.

Thank you for your Service.
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Old 30th Nov 2019, 00:36
  #12066 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hants
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That particular "cognitive failure" has been designed out in in the sense that the F-35B has no nozzle lever. It has a throttle and a stick. The former is the means by which the pilot conveys to the aircraft a desire to go faster or slower, the latter does the uppy-downy-letfy-righty stuff (all relative to the pilot's seat, not necessarily relative to the surface of the planet). For ski-jumps, the aircraft detects that it's going up the ramp (there are some suitably unambiguous cues to the control software that this is what is happening) and behaves accordingly when it finds itself no longer supported by its wheels in a situation where it is briefly incapable of steady-state 1g flight.
Originally Posted by safetypee View Post
...
After an interesting ‘pax’ flight off the experimental ramp at Bedford, JF related to an incident where an overseas evaluation pilot forgot to rotate the nozzles at ramp exit - not quite an engine failure, but … .

Is prevention of this aspect automated in the F-35 ?

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Old 30th Nov 2019, 08:47
  #12067 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: UK
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NoHoverstop, #12068, informative and interesting.
Would such an ‘intelligent’ system (F-35) be able to differentiate between the aircraft flight path required from a level deck (still aircraft referenced) and that from a downwards pitching deck.

I have no operational experience of such matters, although around the developments many years ago.
A few rides during the expansive ski jumps at large angles, and in the systems Harrier, and simulation and discussions during the development of the control concept.
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