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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

Old 8th Mar 2018, 12:41
  #11181 (permalink)  
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I’m sure the USN will be happy to accept the F-35C, they just won’t commit their budget to them but spend it on other items. If the House and/or Senate want to add 12 or. Ore as a budget supplemental each year, I’m sure they’ll find a use for them....
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Old 8th Mar 2018, 14:26
  #11182 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
I’m sure the USN will be happy to accept the F-35C, they just won’t commit their budget to them but spend it on other items. If the House and/or Senate want to add 12 or. Ore as a budget supplemental each year, I’m sure they’ll find a use for them....

If only analysis of the USN budget materials for F35C since FY2016 supported that contention....
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Old 9th Mar 2018, 10:04
  #11183 (permalink)  
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I believe that’s an additional $16B, of which the UK, as the only Tier 1 partner, will pick the lion’s share of $3.7B.....

U.S. F-35 fighter modernization could cost $16 billion through 2024
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Old 9th Mar 2018, 10:28
  #11184 (permalink)  
 
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From Janes...............

Key Points

  • The Pentagon is facing a major potential F-35 Block 4/C2D2 cost increase
  • This could add between USD6.9 billion and USD12.5 billion more to the Pentagon’s most expensive platform
The Pentagon is facing a cost increase for what was known as Block 4 modernisation of the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) ranging between USD6.9 billion and USD12.5 billion, according to a key lawmaker and a Defense Department official.

The Government Accountability Office (GAO) in August tabbed at over USD3.9 billion the research, development, test, and evaluation (RDT&E) funding needed for F-35 Block 4 modernisation, now known as Continuous Capability Development and Delivery (C2D2), through fiscal year 2022 (FY 2022). During a 7 March 2018 House Armed Services (HASC) tactical air and land forces subcommittee hearing, F-35 program executive officer Admiral Mat Winter said C2D2 would cost USD10.8 billion through FY 2024.

Subcommittee Ranking Member Niki Tsongas of Massachusetts said the total cost for C2D2 could reach USD16.4 billion through FY 2024 – USD11 billion for development and USD5.4 billion in procurement. Tsongas believed this figure greatly exceeded any cost figures previously provided to Congress.

GAO said in August that Block 4 would be carried out in four increments – 4.1, 4.2, 4.3, and 4.4. Block 4.1 is primarily software, as well as some new capabilities and correct deficiencies of nine capabilities carried over from the current development programme, such as the prognostics health management system down-link and communication capabilities. GAO said programme officials expected increments 4.1 and 4.3 to be primarily software updates while increments 4.2 and 4.4 would consist of more significant hardware changes.
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Old 9th Mar 2018, 18:58
  #11185 (permalink)  
 
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So, once again, the facts run counter to the fiction...
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Old 13th Mar 2018, 16:22
  #11186 (permalink)  
 
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F-35 Parts Shortage Threatens To Hold Up Pilot Training

On Aviation Week - F-35 Parts Shortage Threatens To Hold Up Pilot Training

Snip:-
Compounding the problem, the GAO found that the F-35 enterprise does not have enough capacity to repair components “in a timely manner,” because the establishment of repair capabilities at the military depots is six years behind schedule. These capabilities were planned to be completed by 2016, but some capabilities have now been delayed until 2022, according to the watchdog.
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Old 13th Mar 2018, 20:45
  #11187 (permalink)  
 
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Editorial in. Times today saying it looks like foreign customers are being held over a barrel on costs and that this is "unfriendly"....

First straw in the wind .........
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Old 14th Mar 2018, 02:07
  #11188 (permalink)  
 
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HH,
Editorial in. Times today saying it looks like foreign customers are being held over a barrel on costs and that this is "unfriendly"....

First straw in the wind .........
Realism is finally setting in...
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Old 14th Mar 2018, 11:56
  #11189 (permalink)  
 
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Very little of this could not have been foreseen ten years ago, when the signs that the program was out of control, with a ludicrously optimistic schedule, were emerging. That was also when Stillion and Perdue warned that the F-35 could not be expected to dominate the A2A fight of the near future. Eight years ago the SAR warned us about O&S costs.

And here we are.
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Old 14th Mar 2018, 13:34
  #11190 (permalink)  
 
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"Stillion and Perdue warned that the F-35"
Now that was brave of you, I wouldn't have posted this. It is a long and tragic story, finishing with Stillion telling RepSim/APA etc. to never contact him again.
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Old 14th Mar 2018, 15:32
  #11191 (permalink)  
 
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Is there a financial case for now saying all bets are off, cancelling the UK order and telling the contractors to go whistle?

I would happily see one of the UK carriers sold off and the other kept as a helicopter platform.
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Old 14th Mar 2018, 15:34
  #11192 (permalink)  
 
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Brave man!!

WEBF and his mates will round to see you sharpish.................
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Old 14th Mar 2018, 23:03
  #11193 (permalink)  
 
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Did it come across wrong? It's a common expression here. Stillion was lead astray by repSim/APA and embarrassed himself with the misinformation, that took several years to overcome. To say that he was unhappy with repSim/APA is an understatement
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 09:17
  #11194 (permalink)  
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Luftwaffe chief dismissed over F-35 support

The Chief of the Luftwaffe is to leave his position in large part due to his support for a German procurement of the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter (JSF), Jane’s has learned.

Lieutenant General Karl Müllner will leave his position by the end of May, with the news of his retirement breaking just two days after Germany’s defence secretary, Ursula von der Leyen, was sworn in for another term.

Jane’s understands that Gen Müllner’s outspoken public support for the JSF as a successor to the German Tornado fleet was pivotal in the decision for his early retirement. “The Luftwaffe considers the F-35’s capability as the benchmark for the selection process for the Tornado replacement, and I think I have expressed myself clearly enough as to what the favourite of the air force is,” Gen Müllner told Jane’s and other media in November 2017.

The Chief of the Luftwaffe’s active support of the JSF clashes with current Ministry of Defence planning, which prefers a successor solution involving the Eurofighter Typhoon.
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 10:31
  #11195 (permalink)  
 
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Wow!!!

That will get the attention of SO's everywhere.....

Expect some serious caution going forward.....
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 10:58
  #11196 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Luftwaffe chief dismissed over F-35 support

The Chief of the Luftwaffe’s active support of the JSF clashes with current Ministry of Defence planning, which prefers a successor solution involving the Eurofighter Typhoon.
Makes some sense to follow the UK policy of replacing the Tornado A2G role with Typhoon. They clearly are not currently able to logistically support their jets let alone the complex F35. The major issue though would be their nuclear requirement which Typhoon is not capable.
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 13:25
  #11197 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Heathrow Harry View Post
Wow!!!

That will get the attention of SO's everywhere.....

Expect some serious caution going forward.....
Expect some serious political lobbying from the vested interests more like!!
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 18:21
  #11198 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by glad rag View Post
Expect some serious political lobbying from the vested interests more like!!
Yes - and it will all go on the bill....................
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Old 17th Mar 2018, 19:49
  #11199 (permalink)  
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They managed to clear the A-4, F-104 and Jaguar to carry the B-61; I don’t imagine it would take great effort to clear the Typhoon if the US really wanted the GAF to hold on to the role.
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 15:48
  #11200 (permalink)  
 
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@ORAC I am not convinced that the expense and effort of adding tactical nukes to tactical aircraft will be deemed to be worth it. Delivering that payload (Lord save us if it comes to that) is probably best left to other platforms, and I suspect that the cruise missile will be the delivery platform of choice: but I really hope it doesn't come to that.
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