Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Military Aviation
Reload this Page >

F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

Military Aviation A forum for the professionals who fly military hardware. Also for the backroom boys and girls who support the flying and maintain the equipment, and without whom nothing would ever leave the ground. All armies, navies and air forces of the world equally welcome here.

F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

Old 28th Jun 2015, 14:58
  #6361 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: England's green and pleasant land
Posts: 697
Would be interested to see:

1 - What the "deck run" was for the Tejas in the video.

2 - What its AUW was.

If it can launch with a representative weapons load from a non-catapulted 450ft deck run, then it's "impressive".

Last edited by MSOCS; 28th Jun 2015 at 17:16. Reason: sp
MSOCS is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2015, 16:25
  #6362 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,120
MSOCS,

You obviously haven't read the ROE. This aircraft is not F-35 so is therefore to be applauded for every advance it makes no matter how incremental and however many questions it creates. The two you cite aren't a bad starter...how does it stop might be another. (Hooks and wires are apparently dead easy to design, operate, catch and maintain so maybe not).

Nonetheless - great to see another nation serious about the sea base and all it brings. Better still to see a FRS MK51 (stand by to be corrected) sneak in!
orca is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2015, 17:24
  #6363 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: England's green and pleasant land
Posts: 697
I'd assumed that they'd completely nailed the stopping game.

That landing gear doesn't look very suitable for the job though.....but then who am I to dare make a comment on such things.

I guess I'll have to just stick to my comfy armchair, slippers, and opinions founded on media trawling and, "how flying was in my day"

God forbid I ever actually retire....
MSOCS is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2015, 20:34
  #6364 (permalink)  
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Peripatetic
Posts: 10,506
LCA Tejas - just about the only programme which makes the development of the F-35 seem short and uncomplicated........
ORAC is online now  
Old 28th Jun 2015, 21:21
  #6365 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 3,973


Sorry about the size of the photo, but it isn't mine and I can't resize. Nice looking hook though...

LJ
Lima Juliet is offline  
Old 28th Jun 2015, 21:46
  #6366 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 3,973
PS. I don't think the Indians are stupid. Why would they plough loads of cash into navalised Tejas when they have these for STOBAR ops from their carriers as well...

Lima Juliet is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2015, 11:47
  #6367 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Far West Wessex
Posts: 2,549
Maus92 - I don't think Saab Group is for sale.

Ownership

Orca - But we agree, don't we, that legacy fighters cannot exist in the threat environment currently fielded.

As the old joke has it, "What's with the 'we' , paleface?"

If you say that "fighters with rather creaky analog RWR and, at best, wheezy non-DRFM podded jammers are vulnerable to the current environment", I'm with you.

USAF F-16s are pretty much the GL model compared to most post-1995 exports, let alone a Sufa or the Singapore jets, and don't compare at all with non-U.S. competitors.

Typerated - The Boeing/Saab T-X is a new airplane. My personal opinion is that the JAS 39E/F would be an excellent fit for Guard and Reserve, which will otherwise see their numbers plummet because of F-35's CPFH; the expensive stealth-related stuff is not required for many missions. They'd also be excellent Aggressors against F-35s/F-22s. But it's not going to happen because nobody wants to see Guard/Reserve guys (age and treachery will prevail over youth and prowess) doing velociraptor tricks to the Academy kids in the stealth jets.

Last edited by LowObservable; 29th Jun 2015 at 16:18.
LowObservable is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2015, 12:44
  #6368 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Texas
Age: 61
Posts: 5,568
As drones haven't made anywhere near the impact they were supposed to
Orca, what do you mean by that? The USN is moving forward with work on that CV based strike drone thing.

As to what UAVs in general have done in the past 10 years ... I can't agree with your assessment, unless "supposed to" means something particular in this case.
Lonewolf_50 is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2015, 16:43
  #6369 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London, New York, Paris, Moscow.
Posts: 3,632
Originally Posted by MSOCS View Post
Would be interested to see:

1 - What the "deck run" was for the Tejas in the video.

2 - What its AUW was.

If it can launch with a representative weapons load from a non-catapulted 450ft deck run, then it's "impressive".
I was referring to the indigenous nature of the project as being impressive as was commented on later in the the tread.
glad rag is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2015, 17:49
  #6370 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: England's green and pleasant land
Posts: 697
Thanks for clarifying gr
MSOCS is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2015, 20:46
  #6371 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Frensham Surrey 51.143734 -0.79448986 SU 84426 38972
Age: 56
Posts: 246
I can't comment on the veracity of anything reported here but it might be of interest to some.

"A test pilot has some very, very bad news about the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter. The pricey new stealth jet canít turn or climb fast enough to hit an enemy plane during a dogfight or to dodge the enemyís own gunfire, the pilot reported following a day of mock air battles back in January."

More here: https://medium.com/war-is-boring/tes...eid=bbff1c7303
Wokkafans is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2015, 21:45
  #6372 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Far West Wessex
Posts: 2,549
Now a matter of authenticating the original document...

But this is the proverbial other shoe from this story...

F-35 Tested Against F-16 In Basic Fighter Maneuvers | Defense content from Aviation Week

...which left everyone wondering who came off best in those encounters.
LowObservable is offline  
Old 29th Jun 2015, 23:20
  #6373 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Leicestershire, England
Posts: 1,168
The F-35 Joint Strike Fighter has been flown in air-to-air combat maneuvers against F-16s for the first time and, based on the results of these and earlier flight-envelope evaluations, test pilots say the aircraft can be cleared for greater agility as a growth option.
I think that one sentence pretty much says what the outcome of ACM with the F-16's was...

-RP
Rhino power is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2015, 03:55
  #6374 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Annapolis
Posts: 109
F-35's got a slow nose; not good. The fanboys will respond with the *fact* that F-35's superior SA will render dogfighting obsolete. Uh huh.
Maus92 is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2015, 06:54
  #6375 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: SAUDI
Posts: 262
You mean dogfighting isnít already obsolete
finestkind is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2015, 10:14
  #6376 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Leicestershire, England
Posts: 1,168
Originally Posted by finestkind View Post
You mean dogfighting isn’t already obsolete
Just because it's not been used for a while does not render it obsolete. There's always a chance where plinking away with BVR rockets won't be possible/acceptable...

-RP

Last edited by Rhino power; 30th Jun 2015 at 12:28.
Rhino power is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2015, 10:16
  #6377 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Sydney
Age: 41
Posts: 244
The biggest face palm moment from this latest report is that the helmet stops the pilot from turning his head around quickly or at all since the width of the canopy is too narrow. Can't believe that one.
dat581 is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2015, 10:50
  #6378 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Next to Ross and Demelza
Age: 49
Posts: 985
Hum... does anybody remember when a pair of F-15s from Lakenheath bounced a pair of early Typhoons from the Case White trials at Warton, and promptly found themselves squarely in the Tiffies' gunsights? It was trumpeted by BAE and the RAF at the time in exactly the way that the results from this evaluation aren't. I would agree that the article hides behind so much technobabble that it seems that the outcome of the evaluation is quietly pushed down the back of the settee.
Martin the Martian is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2015, 16:24
  #6379 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The Roman Empire
Posts: 2,334
I came across this while looking for something else on the net, I don't know if it's already been posted here, and of course the accuracy of the content will no doubt be the subject of debate, still....

The F-35 Can't Beat The Plane It's Replacing In A Dogfight: Report

I also have no particular axe to grind with the F-35 one way or the other....
Biggus is offline  
Old 30th Jun 2015, 19:43
  #6380 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Montenegro
Age: 38
Posts: 285
it's not designed to be good in dogfight, therefor it's not good in dogfight, easy
AreOut is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.