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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

Old 25th Aug 2014, 19:41
  #5101 (permalink)  
 
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Not wanting to be a wet blanket, amigo, but for the money we are paying for this aircraft, that sumbitch needs to be able to dance the jig on final and grease it on anyway, regardless of cross wind. The reporting of the mundane sometimes rubs me the wrong way. Not really aimed at you, I hope you understand
I didn't take it personal, I understand, I know it is a PR release but thought it was a clip worth mentioning. There are plenty of folks (including on this thread) who moan about all things it hasn't done yet, but it seems more blocks are getting checked off....

Will it ever dance like a Harrier? Perhaps not, or as easy as JF made it seem .

I find the different modes interesting, and how each is designed to make things easier for the pilot, but as I said in an earlier post, I fear the day when the computer "thinks" it is in a certian mode, but the pilot or the controls or engine is thinking something else.
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Old 25th Aug 2014, 22:04
  #5102 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by sandiego89
There are plenty of folks (including on this thread) who moan about all things it hasn't done yet...
Folks have every right to 'moan' given the eye-watering cost of the programme, which may well become even more eye-watering given the F135 travails...
And as to 'things it hasn't done yet...', first flight was December 2006 so, coming up on 8 years of test flying and still restricted to the kind of flight envelope you'd expect of 30 year old, utterly knackered airframes which are due for retirement!

-RP
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 07:03
  #5103 (permalink)  
 
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RP,


You don't read the Daily Mail do you?


Just for comparison the first production Typhoon didn't fly until 9 years after the prototype.
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 07:53
  #5104 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by typerated View Post
RP,


You don't read the Daily Mail do you?


Just for comparison the first production Typhoon didn't fly until 9 years after the prototype.
Now that is a little disingenuous typerated...the Typhoon was 9 years between the prototypes first flight and the mature aircrafts operational acceptance. Even then the delays (54 months in total) were political, not mechanical.

How far is the F-35 from operational
acceptance?
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 08:52
  #5105 (permalink)  
 
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Hempy,


Next Year!


Pentagon: First F-35s Operational in 2015 | Defense News | defensenews.com


I am no fan at all of the F35 and its dramas but its progress is quite swift compared to Typhoon (even without the Germany delays). I think you are very kind to assume it was operational when the first production aircraft flew. Of course F35 is following a very different development/procurement path.
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 12:07
  #5106 (permalink)  
 
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TR - To be entirely accurate, "operational" in this case means one squadron of interim-standard aircraft, primarily capable of fixed- or relocatable-target attack and ill-equipped either for the operator's primary mission (CAS - no gun, 500/1000 lb bomb only, no Rover) or for counter-air (no gun, 2 x AMRAAM only, transonic).

That's if they make 2015, which is increasingly in doubt as the latest "one-off problem" () drags on.
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 13:12
  #5107 (permalink)  
 
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Quote by Hempy: the Typhoon was 9 years between the prototypes first flight and the mature aircrafts operational acceptance. Even then the delays (54 months in total) were political, not mechanical.
It will be interesting to see politically what happens when the US Congress returns from their vacation. One of the first items of business will be the budget. Without an overall budget another defense sequester cut will take place. The Congressional folks that review the proposed defense budget have made it clear they will not approve the USAF budget due to elimination of the A-10 Warthog. If this happens as advertised, it will put additional pressure on financing the F-35 program according to the Pentagon gurus. Should be an interesting month or two ahead, both technically and politically for the F-35.
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 14:24
  #5108 (permalink)  
 
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There is some interesting logic in what the USAF are saying, we need F35 to replace one for one all sorts of different types of aircraft, including A10s, then to fund the over budget F35 development costs we want to annoy Congress by suggesting that we will take out of service the A10, implicitly shrinking the USAF and its footprint in a number of states. There is an implication that they may want to expand aircraft numbers later, if the final procurement numbers for F35As are to be achieved.

Or is the USAF saying, not yet publicly, that the final procurement number is being reduced as there will not be so many squadrons to re equip and in any case the budget has been sequestrated again? So the unit price will continue to rise. Interesting times.
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 14:36
  #5109 (permalink)  
 
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If one had to make a logical decision based only on cost and effectiveness, would we keep this potential turkey. I guess not, but then only IMHO
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 17:51
  #5110 (permalink)  
 
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Another hint to get a move on with the F-35...
Flight Global - USAF grounds 82 F-16Ds due to new cracks

The US Air Force announced late on 19 August the grounding of 82 of 969 Lockheed Martin F-16s still in service after finding structural cracks.

The grounding, which involves only the two-seat F-16D, could be lifted to allow aircraft to fly a limited number of flight hours with a temporary fix, the air force says.

Engineers are still analysing options for a permanent repair, the air force says.

The cracks, which were discovered in post-flight inspections, damage the canopy sill longerons in a space between the front and rear pilot seats, the air force says.

Longeron cracking caused a Boeing F-15C to disintegrate in flight in Novemeber 2007. That event triggered a grounding, fleet-wide inspection and lengthy repair.

The grounding underscores the air force’s aging inventory of fighters, as the service waits for the delayed entry and production ramp of the Lockheed F-35A. The 157 F-16Ds still in service are 24 years-old on average with 5,500 flight hours.

Lockheed is already performing a cycle of structural fatigue testing on an F-16 Block 30, which is unrelated to the inspections that discovered the canopy sill longeron cracks.

The fatigue tests are aimed at determining what structural modifications are necessary to extend the life of hundreds of F-16s by 10-15 years, depending on how long it takes for the F-35A to start replacing the fleet.
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 19:23
  #5111 (permalink)  
 
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They knew about that already. Good idea about getting on with the F-35. I wish they could.
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 21:43
  #5112 (permalink)  
 
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Norway set to receive first drag-chute equipped F-35 - 8/22/2014 - Flight Global

-RP
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Old 26th Aug 2014, 22:46
  #5113 (permalink)  
 
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LL - $90 billion plus has already been spent on getting on with the F-35. If it had been successful the AF would be replacing F-16s at a rate of >100/year and these older C/Ds would have been retired.
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Old 27th Aug 2014, 05:13
  #5114 (permalink)  
 
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F-35 Cancelled, then what ?

............

Last edited by Radix; 18th Mar 2016 at 01:04.
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Old 29th Aug 2014, 05:32
  #5115 (permalink)  
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USAF Chief: Pratt Close To Developing F-35 Engine Fix

So they're close to performing a test of a potential fix to the problem - though they're still not sure if it's a design or manufacturing problem.

Only definite statement to be found in there is: "“We are very concerned, because it is a developmental program still, and we do not want it to ever happen again,” Welsh said........
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Old 29th Aug 2014, 05:38
  #5116 (permalink)  
 
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In February this year they declared that the "latency problem" was a "non-issue" and "never as bad as feared".
Additionally, problems with jitter had been solved and what little latency was there had been reduced further.

F-35 Test Pilots Will Begin Flying ?Gen? Helmet Display | Aviation International News
The helmet system’s latency, or response time at importing DAS imagery–measured in milliseconds–was not the problem testers thought it would be, Kelly said. Pilots just hadn’t had the opportunity to use the DAS sensor array during flight testing. “Initially there was concern about the latency of the DAS and what that might look like,” he said. “But we were able to do some testing in the spring and summer of 2013 where we looked at a bunch of different tasks [and] some formation flying and, across-the-board, we found there was really no issue with the latency.”
And in July this year the helmet was declared ready for service.
?Magic Helmet? for F-35 ready for delivery | Ars Technica
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Old 29th Aug 2014, 08:58
  #5117 (permalink)  
 
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..........

Last edited by Radix; 18th Mar 2016 at 01:13.
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Old 29th Aug 2014, 11:48
  #5118 (permalink)  
 
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You can always fix the rubbing by opening out the clearances. Simples. But you take a hit on efficiency and performance, unless you raise temperatures and suffer on durability and thermal issues.
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Old 29th Aug 2014, 20:13
  #5119 (permalink)  
 
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All said and done ... the F-35 Sim looks like fun



F-35 Lightning II Training Systems · Lockheed Martin

I've already stuck it on my 2014 Christmas List ... I reckon there's enough room in my garage ... Might need to up-rate the power supply though

What no 3D mini worlds and gantry mounted cameras
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Old 29th Aug 2014, 20:26
  #5120 (permalink)  
 
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^ I hope the Airforce did not pay $millions for that sim. You can get it for free on the iPhone :-) https://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/mode...639358230?mt=8
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