CF 18 down, Lethbridge, Alberta.
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Epic indeed - I imagine he wishes he had NOT spoken to the journos
""I was feeling turbulence," he said. "My perception was that I had turbulence with a downdraft." - almost like a stall........................
"he watched with disbelief as the CF-18 plummeted to the ground and burst into a massive fireball." - who writes this stuff? As if he expected much else.........a bit like my Harrier ejection - yep, I was really surprise when it crashed 200 feet away from me.
"Soon, Bews felt that the jet was possessed by some other force - err - over here we call it 'gravity'.
It is always edifying to read an actual transcript of what he said and run it alongside this stuff.
""I was feeling turbulence," he said. "My perception was that I had turbulence with a downdraft." - almost like a stall........................
"he watched with disbelief as the CF-18 plummeted to the ground and burst into a massive fireball." - who writes this stuff? As if he expected much else.........a bit like my Harrier ejection - yep, I was really surprise when it crashed 200 feet away from me.
"Soon, Bews felt that the jet was possessed by some other force - err - over here we call it 'gravity'.
It is always edifying to read an actual transcript of what he said and run it alongside this stuff.
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Hmmm... "The winds were strong". "I felt turbulence and a downdraft".
115 KIAS... if he is flying into the wind and it drops speed... or with the wind and it picks up speed... then he is suddenly at well below 115 KIAS, and stalls.
115 KIAS... if he is flying into the wind and it drops speed... or with the wind and it picks up speed... then he is suddenly at well below 115 KIAS, and stalls.
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The CF-18 mishap pilot account confirms the obvious -- aircraft stall under controlled (but high risk) conditions.
No mention of any aircraft malfunctions, compressor-stalls, bird-strikes, cockpit warning lights/audio, etc.
Brief mention of turbulence, which the pilot considered commonplace under those circumstances.
Slow/Low pass at 115 knots & 25 degrees leaves no margin for error at that altitude. Normal F-18 Final Approach Speed is ~130 Knots.
Pilot seems bewildered as to why his aircraft fell out of the sky. He thinks he was flying at 115 Knots... perhaps that was the problem -- it would only take a very brief pilot distraction inside/outside the cockpit to drop to stall speed.
___________________
95 % of this video/interview focused on the ejection/pilot health... with little discussion on accident cause. Obviously a staged public-relations event by the RCAF PR office.
No mention of any aircraft malfunctions, compressor-stalls, bird-strikes, cockpit warning lights/audio, etc.
Brief mention of turbulence, which the pilot considered commonplace under those circumstances.
Slow/Low pass at 115 knots & 25 degrees leaves no margin for error at that altitude. Normal F-18 Final Approach Speed is ~130 Knots.
Pilot seems bewildered as to why his aircraft fell out of the sky. He thinks he was flying at 115 Knots... perhaps that was the problem -- it would only take a very brief pilot distraction inside/outside the cockpit to drop to stall speed.
___________________
95 % of this video/interview focused on the ejection/pilot health... with little discussion on accident cause. Obviously a staged public-relations event by the RCAF PR office.
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CF-18
See interim report at:
CF188738 Hornet... | Fighters | Reports - Investigation | DFS | Air Force | DND/CF
CF188738 Hornet... | Fighters | Reports - Investigation | DFS | Air Force | DND/CF
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From the Investigator:
During an airshow practice at Lethbridge County Airport, Hornet CF188738 experienced a loss of thrust from its right engine while conducting a high alpha pass at 300 ft above ground level (AGL). Unaware of the loss of thrust but feeling the aircraft sink, the pilot selected military power on both throttles to arrest the descent. The aircraft continued to sink and the pilot selected afterburner on both throttles. The aircraft immediately began to yaw right and continued to rapidly yaw/roll right, despite compensating control column and rudder pedal inputs. At approximately 150 feet AGL and about 90 degrees of right bank, the pilot ejected from the aircraft. The aircraft continued to yaw/roll right with its nose descending in a tight right descending corkscrew prior to hitting the ground nose first.
The ejection and seat-man separation worked flawlessly but the pilot was injured when he touched down firmly under a stable chute. After landing, the parachute shroud lines became entangled around the pilot’s left leg and the parachute re‑inflated before it could be released, causing him to be dragged several hundred meters. The pilot was able to release the remaining Koch fittings just as members of the Sky Hawks, the Canadian Forces parachute demonstration team, arrived on scene to provide assistance. First aid was administered to the pilot who was subsequently transported to the Regional Hospital.
Field examination of the engines did not reveal any anomalies. Both engines were sent to the Quality Engineering and Test Establishment for a detailed inspection. Concurrently, photogrammetric analysis is taking place to ascertain certain flight and engine parameters which could not be recovered from the Advanced Memory Unit and other recording devices. Finally, modeling and simulation has been undertaken to better understand the factors (e.g., throttle splits, altitude) affecting the aircraft’s recovery under various conditions.
The investigation will be focussing on the loss of thrust experienced by the right-hand engine, the factors that precluded an in-flight recovery of the aircraft, and CF-18 demonstration pilot training.
During an airshow practice at Lethbridge County Airport, Hornet CF188738 experienced a loss of thrust from its right engine while conducting a high alpha pass at 300 ft above ground level (AGL). Unaware of the loss of thrust but feeling the aircraft sink, the pilot selected military power on both throttles to arrest the descent. The aircraft continued to sink and the pilot selected afterburner on both throttles. The aircraft immediately began to yaw right and continued to rapidly yaw/roll right, despite compensating control column and rudder pedal inputs. At approximately 150 feet AGL and about 90 degrees of right bank, the pilot ejected from the aircraft. The aircraft continued to yaw/roll right with its nose descending in a tight right descending corkscrew prior to hitting the ground nose first.
The ejection and seat-man separation worked flawlessly but the pilot was injured when he touched down firmly under a stable chute. After landing, the parachute shroud lines became entangled around the pilot’s left leg and the parachute re‑inflated before it could be released, causing him to be dragged several hundred meters. The pilot was able to release the remaining Koch fittings just as members of the Sky Hawks, the Canadian Forces parachute demonstration team, arrived on scene to provide assistance. First aid was administered to the pilot who was subsequently transported to the Regional Hospital.
Field examination of the engines did not reveal any anomalies. Both engines were sent to the Quality Engineering and Test Establishment for a detailed inspection. Concurrently, photogrammetric analysis is taking place to ascertain certain flight and engine parameters which could not be recovered from the Advanced Memory Unit and other recording devices. Finally, modeling and simulation has been undertaken to better understand the factors (e.g., throttle splits, altitude) affecting the aircraft’s recovery under various conditions.
The investigation will be focussing on the loss of thrust experienced by the right-hand engine, the factors that precluded an in-flight recovery of the aircraft, and CF-18 demonstration pilot training.
So the final report is pending a report from the Quality Engineering and Test Establishment on its examination of the engines before it can be written.
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...there should be a "Final" report issued sometime this century; not sure what the RCAF calls it, formally.
That October 2010 report is merely an interim/preliminary investigation report... outlining the facts to date -- and the direction of the remaining full investigation.
Final reports usually state the 'primary cause' of the mishap investigated.
10 months seems excessive for the investigation... when the pilot survived in good condition, wreckage was readily accessible, and there's video of the incident. Sixty days used to be the USAF standard for Class A mishaps.
That October 2010 report is merely an interim/preliminary investigation report... outlining the facts to date -- and the direction of the remaining full investigation.
Final reports usually state the 'primary cause' of the mishap investigated.
10 months seems excessive for the investigation... when the pilot survived in good condition, wreckage was readily accessible, and there's video of the incident. Sixty days used to be the USAF standard for Class A mishaps.
Last edited by DelaneyT; 2nd Jun 2011 at 01:26. Reason: further comment
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All rumour of course {-- Just This Once}
...well, rather odd that rumour is the only thing available to Canadian citizens, after a 10 month formal investigation. As a minimum, another brief interim report should have been issued, summarizing the status of the investigation & expected completion date.
Why the official silence and secrecy ?
At this late stage of a relatively straightforward mishap investigation... 99% of the available facts have likely been collected & analyzed. Either those facts are inconclusive... or the RCAF brass doesn't like the conclusions that those facts point to.
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..was every one's presumption given the evidence to hand. However, I understand that the initial investigation could find nothing wrong with the engine or associated systems! --Just This Once
If there's nothing found wrong with the engines or aircraft -- what other possible cause could there be for an aircraft to fall out of the sky ?
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The scuttle around the F/A-18 community is that everything on the aircraft is allegedly ok and they could not find a definitive reason for the engine 'shutdown'. The various OEMs are pointing at each other and the investigation is/was barely moving forward. The recent leverage applied by the US Navy looks to have helped and things are apparently moving, but no rumours have leaked as to the cause.
All rumour of course.
All rumour of course.
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...over a year now since this CF-18 crash -- and still no 'final' investigation report released publicly. The Canadian Air Forces (CAF) call their final mishap investigation reports-- a "Final Safety Investigation Report" (FSIR)
Interesting that another CF-18 crash in Nov 2010 also had extensive delays in public release of its initial safety report.
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...l?#post6605109
...seems to be a trend here on how CAF handles adverse public relations information concerning aircraft crashes (?)
Is anybody here familiar with the longer term history of Canadian Air Forces safety investigation board processes & results ?
Interesting that another CF-18 crash in Nov 2010 also had extensive delays in public release of its initial safety report.
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...l?#post6605109
...seems to be a trend here on how CAF handles adverse public relations information concerning aircraft crashes (?)
Is anybody here familiar with the longer term history of Canadian Air Forces safety investigation board processes & results ?
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Is anybody here familiar with the longer term history of Canadian Air Forces safety investigation board processes & results ?
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...Yes I am. What are you hunting for?
What's the typical timeline for CAF investigation/report on an aircraft loss or major mishap ? (.. how long does it usually take CAF to figure out what happened & issue a public, summary report ?)
How are CAF investigation/safety boards formed ? (..is there a professional investigation team always at the ready, or are they assembled ad hoc for each incident... from the ranks ?)
Who makes the final decision on public release of CAF safety investigation reports ? What is the report review process ?
What's the general reputation of past CAF safety investigation boards for objectivity & timeliness ?
Thanks
_________
[P.S.]: on the Nov 2010/Cold Lake CF-18 loss -- do you consider it odd that CAF withheld public release of the initial safety report for 6 months... waiting until a 3-day national holiday weekend in the quiet summer months... to release that brief, routine report ?
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on the Nov 2010/Cold Lake CF-18 loss -- do you consider it odd that CAF withheld public release of the initial safety report for 6 months... waiting until a 3-day national holiday weekend in the quiet summer months... to release that brief, routine report ?
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Originally Posted by saudipc-9
Quote DelanyT:
Is anybody here familiar with the longer term history of Canadian Air Forces safety investigation board processes & results ?
Yes I am. What are you hunting for?
Is anybody here familiar with the longer term history of Canadian Air Forces safety investigation board processes & results ?
Yes I am. What are you hunting for?
He doesn't want to hear anything which disproves a conspiracy.
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Final report CF188738 Hornet... | Fighters | Reports - Investigation | DFS | RCAF | DND/CF
Epilogue:
During an air show practice at Lethbridge County Airport, CF188738 experienced a loss of thrust from its right engine while conducting a high angle of attack (AOA) pass at 300 feet (ft) above ground level (AGL). Unaware of the problem but feeling the aircraft sink slightly, the pilot selected maximum afterburner on both throttles in order to overshoot from the manoeuvre. The aircraft immediately started to yaw right and continued to rapidly yaw/roll right despite compensating control column and rudder pedal inputs.
With the aircraft at approximately 150 ft AGL and about 90 degrees of right bank, the pilot ejected from the aircraft. The aircraft continued in a tight descending corkscrew to the right prior to hitting the ground nose first.
The ejection system worked flawlessly, but the pilot was injured when he landed firmly under a fully inflated parachute.
The investigation revealed a number of factors that contributed to this occurrence. The engine malfunction was likely the result of a stuck ratio boost piston in the right engine main fuel control (MFC) that prevented the engine from advancing above flight idle when maximum afterburner was selected. The large thrust imbalance between the left and the right engines caused the aircraft to depart controlled flight and the aircraft was unrecoverable within the altitude available. The subtle nature of the engine malfunction that was not detected by the pilot when the overshoot was attempted.
In response to this occurrence, the Royal Canadian Air Force (RCAF) expedited the implementation of a program to upgrade all CF188 MFCs. Additionally, the RCAF made changes to the conduct of the CF188 air show routine by increasing the high AOA pass altitude from 300 feet AGL to 500 feet AGL, improving the air show training program and ensuring that both engines of the CF188 air show aircraft have upgraded MFCs.
Epilogue:
During an air show practice at Lethbridge County Airport, CF188738 experienced a loss of thrust from its right engine while conducting a high angle of attack (AOA) pass at 300 feet (ft) above ground level (AGL). Unaware of the problem but feeling the aircraft sink slightly, the pilot selected maximum afterburner on both throttles in order to overshoot from the manoeuvre. The aircraft immediately started to yaw right and continued to rapidly yaw/roll right despite compensating control column and rudder pedal inputs.
With the aircraft at approximately 150 ft AGL and about 90 degrees of right bank, the pilot ejected from the aircraft. The aircraft continued in a tight descending corkscrew to the right prior to hitting the ground nose first.
The ejection system worked flawlessly, but the pilot was injured when he landed firmly under a fully inflated parachute.
The investigation revealed a number of factors that contributed to this occurrence. The engine malfunction was likely the result of a stuck ratio boost piston in the right engine main fuel control (MFC) that prevented the engine from advancing above flight idle when maximum afterburner was selected. The large thrust imbalance between the left and the right engines caused the aircraft to depart controlled flight and the aircraft was unrecoverable within the altitude available. The subtle nature of the engine malfunction that was not detected by the pilot when the overshoot was attempted.
In response to this occurrence, the Royal Canadian Air Force (RCAF) expedited the implementation of a program to upgrade all CF188 MFCs. Additionally, the RCAF made changes to the conduct of the CF188 air show routine by increasing the high AOA pass altitude from 300 feet AGL to 500 feet AGL, improving the air show training program and ensuring that both engines of the CF188 air show aircraft have upgraded MFCs.
