Nimrod Anyone?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 123
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nimrod Anyone?
Losing this capability will, no doubt, cost lives in the future.
Air Sea Rescue Mission: Nimrod Scrambled To Help Injured Fisherman Off Coast Of Scilly Isles | UK News | Sky News
Air Sea Rescue Mission: Nimrod Scrambled To Help Injured Fisherman Off Coast Of Scilly Isles | UK News | Sky News
Last edited by navibrator; 22nd Jan 2010 at 15:16.
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 154
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Although this was a fairly simple task for the Nimrod, I am surprised it's on Sky but not the MOD or RAF websites, I guess positive Nimrod stories don't appeal to the powers to be. I hope they prove me wrong.
Last edited by Hoots; 22nd Jan 2010 at 20:00.
As one a while retired, my reading of all the threads was that in this context "Nimrod = capability", and that fill-ins from, say, the (overstretched) Hercules force pending the MRA 4 wiould really not cut the mustard. I would be happy to be reassured otherwise.
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Where the heart belongs
Age: 55
Posts: 413
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes
on
2 Posts
We are not losing the capability. Just the Nimrod.
The Sea King is only good for 200 miles. I wouldn't want to be in the water past that.
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: In the State of Denial
Posts: 1,077
Likes: 0
Received 146 Likes
on
28 Posts
The C130 will not be holding SAR standby, it's only taking on the role for the Falklands, so I guess the bit of sea between 30 West & 200 miles off the coast (ie: quite alot) will be a literal & metaphorical 'capability gap' until the MRA4 arrives.
Unless anyone else can think of any other suitable platform?
Unless anyone else can think of any other suitable platform?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 123
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We are not losing the capability. Just the Nimrod.
I think you are not understanding the issue. The helicopter would not have been able to operate at the distance without the Nimrod. There is no other alternative Maritime Patrol Aircraft that could find and steer the helicopter to the vessel. Remember the Fastnet Race a few years back - what would that have been like without that long range search capability?
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: dundee
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A ship go's down a few hundred miles out, what do you send up to look for it if there's no nimrod, oh I know we freeze time until the MR4 is ready. Oh and what will follow the Red Arrows and other things across the pond.
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: sw
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Having been sat out there the other day it was very nice to have a friendly pair of eyes and ears above! Cheers guys. Oh well, back to the old tail chasing again then I guess. Shame we dont have a seconds crew any more...
We are not losing the capability. Just the Nimrod.
Bit like Tiger Woods having the 'capability' to remain competitive in golf when his driver, 1-4 irons, 6-9 irons, putter and sand wedge have been removed from his bag!
Bit like Tiger Woods having the 'capability' to remain competitive in golf when his driver, 1-4 irons, 6-9 irons, putter and sand wedge have been removed from his bag!
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Think back, it was more or less an SOP SAROP. But thinking back from here, you wonder why there was not the odd medal dished out; perhaps because they made it seem so easy.
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 80
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The C130 will not be holding SAR standby, it's only taking on the role for the Falklands, so I guess the bit of sea between 30 West & 200 miles off the coast (ie: quite alot) will be a literal & metaphorical 'capability gap' until the MRA4 arrives.
Unless anyone else can think of any other suitable platform?
Unless anyone else can think of any other suitable platform?
S
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Falmouth
Posts: 1,651
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So what do we have to reach the edges of our area of responability?
Confused
Now I am confused
What has 1312 Flt been doing for the last 20 odd years then. Does this 'taking on' imply that we were not really doing it before or that it's new for the C130J?
I seem to recall that in a previous time on C130Ks during one of my visits 'down there' we adopted the callsign Rescue XX and popped around 200 miles west, found the correct fishing fleet on radar, vis ident the particular vessel, talked to it on Maritime VHF-FM, directed the Sea King to the correct vessel, and generally floated round as top cover whilst an injured Argentian sailor was picked up and flown to Stanley.
Is this the capability we are talking about as I believe it has been done on numerous occasions?
The C130 will not be holding SAR standby, it's only taking on the role for the Falklands,
I seem to recall that in a previous time on C130Ks during one of my visits 'down there' we adopted the callsign Rescue XX and popped around 200 miles west, found the correct fishing fleet on radar, vis ident the particular vessel, talked to it on Maritime VHF-FM, directed the Sea King to the correct vessel, and generally floated round as top cover whilst an injured Argentian sailor was picked up and flown to Stanley.
Is this the capability we are talking about as I believe it has been done on numerous occasions?
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: The Shed
Posts: 195
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I daresay the reason the Govt are happy to 'gap' the capability provided by Nimrod MR2 is because they know the majority of Joe Public, like some contributors to this thread, have no idea exactly what that capability is and therefore will not miss it.
Sure you can use Albert for top cover and E3 for On Scene Commander (OSC) but unless I'm much mistaken only the Nimrod has the ability to search for survivors, offer top cover and collision avoidance to rescue helo's and act as OSC to control multiple assets during the same major incident.
With a dedicated maritime search radar, AIS, EO/IR camera, multiple V/U and HF comms boxes, PLB location and homing eqpt and a vast bomb bay for ASR eqpt, the Nimrod MR2 really has it all. More importantly, it has a large crew who regularly practice SAR procedures both in the air and simulator. Top cover for helo's can be fairly routine (sometimes not) but I can assure you a major incident requires training, flexibility, and a good working knowledge of maritime SAR assets, Coastguard procedures and what ships can and cannot do. In short it's not something you can just pitch up to and hope for the best.
The Nimrod force has become used to the phrase 'we'll take it on risk' in recent years. I guess a common perception is that major incidents happen once in a blue moon, if at all. I just checked my log book and in the last 6 years I've been scrambled on 8 top cover and search missions and 3 major incidents all of which were headline news. That's just been my crew, there have been more.
However, based on those figures and this Govt's obsession with the manipulation of statistics, that makes it one major incident every 2 years.
Which, happily enough, is the gap between MR2 OSD and MRA4 ISD. Seemples.
Sure you can use Albert for top cover and E3 for On Scene Commander (OSC) but unless I'm much mistaken only the Nimrod has the ability to search for survivors, offer top cover and collision avoidance to rescue helo's and act as OSC to control multiple assets during the same major incident.
With a dedicated maritime search radar, AIS, EO/IR camera, multiple V/U and HF comms boxes, PLB location and homing eqpt and a vast bomb bay for ASR eqpt, the Nimrod MR2 really has it all. More importantly, it has a large crew who regularly practice SAR procedures both in the air and simulator. Top cover for helo's can be fairly routine (sometimes not) but I can assure you a major incident requires training, flexibility, and a good working knowledge of maritime SAR assets, Coastguard procedures and what ships can and cannot do. In short it's not something you can just pitch up to and hope for the best.
The Nimrod force has become used to the phrase 'we'll take it on risk' in recent years. I guess a common perception is that major incidents happen once in a blue moon, if at all. I just checked my log book and in the last 6 years I've been scrambled on 8 top cover and search missions and 3 major incidents all of which were headline news. That's just been my crew, there have been more.
However, based on those figures and this Govt's obsession with the manipulation of statistics, that makes it one major incident every 2 years.
Which, happily enough, is the gap between MR2 OSD and MRA4 ISD. Seemples.
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Scotland
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Most of you here know but lets not forget the other much more important stuff the MR2 does that the cheque book signers have forgotten too. Half of these same people possibly don't know what ISK contributes (or did) and have no idea what we're throwing away - time will certainly tell.....
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Here's an idea.
HM Coastguard not part of defence budget ?
Boost their budgets, get them some capable platforms, Surplus RAF pilots apply for /offered jobs. Air force manning reduced, Money not spent on military, politicians happy.
Job still being done by professionals who care.
HM Coastguard not part of defence budget ?
Boost their budgets, get them some capable platforms, Surplus RAF pilots apply for /offered jobs. Air force manning reduced, Money not spent on military, politicians happy.
Job still being done by professionals who care.