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Snow Clearance

Old 24th Nov 2021, 12:13
  #121 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Charlotte Bailey View Post
So you used a Vampire as a snow-killer? Was it stationary at the time? Was there a risk it would melt a hole in the runway underneath the snow and ice?
The MRDs (as shown in Davef68's photo) would damage the runway if you were stationary and the engines were not on idle.
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Old 24th Nov 2021, 12:13
  #122 (permalink)  
 
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Ha Ha, I remember trundling round Lossiemouth in that Leyland/Gloster aberration during the winter of '79-'80.
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Old 24th Nov 2021, 21:33
  #123 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Charlotte Bailey View Post
You used Vampires to clear snow?!
I've used a Lynx.
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Old 24th Nov 2021, 22:20
  #124 (permalink)  
 
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I’ve used a shovel
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Old 24th Nov 2021, 22:22
  #125 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2021
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I was scraping ice off the wings off a Yak-3 very early yesterday morning with a credit card. Thankfully we didn't have to do the runway too.
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Old 24th Nov 2021, 23:53
  #126 (permalink)  
 
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Do R.A.F.airfields give braking action on contaminated runways? I was very much involved in contaminated runway performance calculations for the Nimrod in the late 70's ( dates me)
When I moved to civilian flying, airfields used a mu meter to give braking action on contaminated runways, but stopped doing so in the early 2000's. Apparently the readings could be inaccurate, and either the lawyers were afraid the airfield operator could be sued or the CAA rulled agaist their use in contamination. It all came down to "Captain's assessment".
Not long before I retired in 2005, I was assured by ATC at a well known airfield that the runway was now cleared of snow. I arranged to start boarding the pax, but in the meantime insisted that ATC take me out to check the runway for myself. Got to the "cleared" runway, got out of the Landrover, and if I had not still been holding onto the door, I would have gone flat on my ass. It was clear of snow, but was like a skating rink. Back to the aircraft, tell pax I am cancelling the flight, and drive home. Very carefully.
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 00:56
  #127 (permalink)  
 
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I do remember sitting burning and turning in a Bulldog at the end of the runway of a top secret West Midlands airfield on a very cold Winterís morn watching SATCO measuring the coefficient of friction of the runway by speeding down it and vigorously applying the handbrake of a service Cavalier while trying to reverse direction.
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 09:12
  #128 (permalink)  

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oxenos; thanks for the mu meter update. I stopped flying on '04, when it was still in use. You gen saves me writing about things that don't happen any more, and coming across a a boring old f*rt
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 09:39
  #129 (permalink)  
 
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I was NCO i/c MRD at Wittering in 1974. When getting them both ready for the winter, one developed a rev counter fault. No technical information available, so I referred back to my apprentice training notes (LTNs - remember them?) to find a typical circuit diagram. Fixed it.

I have mixed feelings about working on them, being left to my own devices it was good fun but by the nature of the timing it was also b***y cold.
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 10:01
  #130 (permalink)  
 
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I remember a particularly cold snowy winter when most of the UK airports had shut down because of snow, but one remained open, even I thought it was dubious at best.

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Old 25th Nov 2021, 12:01
  #131 (permalink)  
 
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Herod, you are far from being the first to call me a boring old fart. But without us B.O.F.s PPRuNe would hardly exist.
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 14:27
  #132 (permalink)  
 
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I was involved in one of the Mu meter trials in the early 1970s with a Vulcan at Waddington. We had a simple recorder fitted for the trial. The “test” runway section was ~2000’ in length and about the same distance into the runway. The Mu meter readings were taken and we then landed and rolled through the test section without braking inserting an event marker on entry and exit. Rolled to the end, taxied round and repeated the exercise but this time applied the brakes “firmly” on entry. Got airborne again (leaving the gear down) and waited whilst a couple of bowsers made the test section thoroughly wet, we were told it simulated a heavy rain shower. We then repeated the sequence with the wet runway surface. The predictable result was that the aircraft required a brake change afterwards.

I never heard what the results of the trial were or whether or not it was of any value. I did hear however; can anyone confirm this?; that it was repeated at Scampton where the runway friction course was of a different type. A Victor was co-opted for thie occasion and it duly arrived, did the roll through then the braked run. Unfortunately the braking was a bit enthusiastic and it stopped within the test section where it remained until the multiple tyre change was completed.

Looking back, there was so much that could have gone wrong but we were briefed to get in with it!

YS

Last edited by Yellow Sun; 26th Nov 2021 at 16:03.
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 15:38
  #133 (permalink)  
 
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Doesn't look like they have problems here, though it does look like they have to cut grooves in the ice first.

Antarctica landing

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Old 25th Nov 2021, 16:30
  #134 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post
Iíve used a shovel
Snow clearing? - Pah, we didn't need no snow clearing!




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Old 25th Nov 2021, 16:31
  #135 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Saintsman View Post
Doesn't look like they have problems here, though it does look like they have to cut grooves in the ice first.

Antarctica landing
Those grooves appear to be the same as I find on a freshly groomed piste. Perhaps left by the same sort of piste basher?
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 17:05
  #136 (permalink)  
 
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Snow clearance does not always mean remove ALL contamination. Pictures from a previous life, types date them somewhat.


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Old 25th Nov 2021, 17:26
  #137 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by superplum View Post
Snow clearing? - Pah, we didn't need no snow clearing!


Of course not, Jags need the minimum amount of friction to get airborne
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 17:48
  #138 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by superplum View Post
Snow clearing? - Pah, we didn't need no snow clearing!


It's all well and good posting a picture of a Jaguar taking off in Norway, but it started its take off roll in Sweden
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 17:55
  #139 (permalink)  

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oxenos; You misread me. I wasn't calling you a B.O.F., but thanking you for stopping me from talking about mu meters when they haven't been used for years. No offence was intended.
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 22:47
  #140 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
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No offence was intended.
And none taken, of course.
I believe mu meters are still used, but only to check that braking action has not been degraded by oil and rubber deposits.
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