Blunderbuss

Taylor, the age limit is 23 for pilot and 26 for WSO. You've missed the boat I'm afraid.

not_so_sis

Also, if you do go fast jet do bad at Valley and you will end up flying choppers anyway. good luck!

Fray

eht01,

As the others said, all the info you need about what to expect at the FAT's is on here. Also check out rumration and the student room as they contain a load of information.

I sat my FAT's in December and things didn't go well for me at all so I am re-sitting this December. Like you are doing practise the Maths and maybe buy some flight aptitude software?

All the best,

Fray

"Taylor"

Blunderbus,
Are you sure? I've got the RAF careers book in front of me and it states Age 17.5 - 32 for a WSOp (Crewman), the age limit for WSOfficer is 25. I'm going to RIAT this weekend and i'll go and have a chat with the careers officers if there are some up there.

airborne_artist

Taylor - you and Blunderbus are talking about two different things:

You want WSOp (Non Commissioned Aircrew), age limit as you say. BB is talking about WSO - (Officer Aircrew, was Navigator).

However, in either case your colour perception is still an issue.

"Taylor"

Cheers "AA", seems i'm not deemed to get anywhere in the RAF as aircrew with my colourblindness issue. Looks like my feet are going to be staying firmly on the ground other than being ferried as pax.

eht01

Fray

Thanks for the advice, I was wondering, having only done the FATS a year ago, what area of Maths would you say was most promenant in the tests? i've studied everying I can, but it'd be nice to know if theres anywhere I need to Really concentrate on?

rleungz

Hello,

I've just got acouple of questions regarding a Weapon Systems Officer (Nav).

When training as a WSO is it true that you do abit of flying training?

Is the service of commission 6 years (On the RAF careers) or 12 years (SSC) by a 'blue' form I got from AFCO?

Once your service is near to the end is it possible for WSO to re-train as a commerical pilot? If so does any hours you did flying count to anything?

Sorry in advance if I have completely missed what a WSO actually does. Please enlighten me.

Regards
Ric

dmcleod

NINJADAN....

I completed flight screening in May this year. You dont need to know anything about flying whilst there. The basic course is really easy, it starts off very slowly. I did the advance course and we only did a few more aerobatics (inverted, slow roll and barrell roll) otherwise they are the same. Advance fly 5 times in the Cap10 where Basics only fly 3. Your first day they will give you a big book and they'll have a mass breifing with you. The book contains all the syllabus ie. straight and level, aerobatics, circuits etc. (Also in your rooms there are 2 whiteboards full of everything from past students)

I wouldn't bother about trying to fly he aircraft before you get there. You dont need to know to much about them, they do all the checks you just fly. Both aircraft are really easy to fly just remember to trim. One note is the CT4 has extremely firm rudder pedals gotta push real hard to make her turn whilst taxying.

The book will have all the power settings and attitudes to which you must fly, once you get there read the book over and over.

What you really need to know are all the other things for officer selection board ie. roles of ADF pilots and you must know all 3 services, unless you havent even stated a preference for them. You have to know everything back to front, absalutely everything, research famous battles and Australian aces aswell (Bluey Truscott is a good one). Print off as much info as you can, its very hard to print whilst there (defence rules).

People take laptops there is wireless internet cost you about $30 to hook it up. There are also 4 computers in Pilot Common Room which are available all day and up until 12 at night when the motion sensors kick in. There will be plenty of time to study. You do 1 or 2 flight max a day the rest you have to sit in the common room and wait for everyone to finish. There are also more mass breifs and the Navy do a breif aswell.

Also the heating and cooling is **** it didnt work half the time and its a very thin blanket.

And another tip state all your preferences as 5 for all services. Your end score (stainine) is multiplied by your preference so you will have better chance, they told us if your preference is under 3 you probablky wont get an offer. You can always decline the offer.

Goodluck. msg me if you have any other questions.

Mr C Hinecap

Ric
You have asked questions before, but most of your efforts have always been in the pursuit of commercial flying. Please be under no misunderstanding that the guys & girls who seek to fly in the RAF want to fly military aircraft in the RAF. Of course - they may have 'civ' in the back of their minds, but it should not be seen as an interesting alternative route to commercial flying. Also - you talked about OASC some 7 months ago - have you got a date yet?

Bill Sim

Hi folks.
Just joined the forum and need some help. I'm a 30 yr old SAC(T) Weapons Technician who is in the process of applying for NCA, however, my aspirations lie with commissioned Aircrew. I am aware that I am to old, but after reading the AP on Aircrew selection I have discovered that the Branch Sponsor can waiver things like age limits. Has anyone heard of this? I have spoken to the AFCO and to the OASC prep club on camp and they have all told me there is no chance Cranwell will look at me for pilot, and yet every fast jet jockey I talk to tell me just to apply for it anyway!!! This have left me in a dilema. Do I apply for a position I know I'm not eligable for, making it look like I have not researched the position for which I am applying? Or do I apply for NCA and explain where I would like my career to end up? In the meantime I am training to gain my JAR PPL in the hope that this may lend some weight to a decision to waiver my age. Can anyone shed some light on this as the AFCO and Cranwell or being less than helpful (which does not leave me with a warm fuzzy feeling!). Thanks for your time in reading my problem.

3portdrift

Probably the only thing that is going to get you a place is if you ace the pilot aptitude tests at OASC. In order to do that you have to get to OASC and sit the tests. You are right in your suspicions that you probably won't get past the AFCO with Pilot/WSOp on your application. But try putting down Pilot/Admin/WSOp, then you should, if you are commissionable material, get yourself to OASC even if under the pretence of wanting to be an Admin O (or any other branch of your choice that you have the quals for). Even if you are made to remove Pilot at this stage all is not lost. OASC usually put everyone through all the aptitude tests, and there is a chance, especially if it is still on your list of choices, they will let you sit the aptitudes. The age limit is there because aptitudes deteriorate with age, but if you get scores like a 23 year old, then the branch sponsor might allow you in. I can't see the branch sponsor considering you without that sort of evidence.

And a PPL, civvie trained, is quite often considered a problem, not an advantage, it certainly does not indicate aptitude, so I wouldn't rely on anything from that.

Pontius Navigator

3P Drift is spot on.

You want pilot, a commission, or NCA. In a sense they are mutually exclusive. If you go in with these choices they will immediately peg you where they have a hole. NCA on chopers?

You wnat to focus on what you really want, that is pilot. That is probably unrealistic so your focus should shift to commission in a branch - flying! - then admin etc. I am not absolutely sure but I think they have gone away from only considering you for your stated choices.

You should also consider flighter control and ATC. Both are aptitude based careers.

Once you get to OASC is the time to say "I really, really want to be a pilot"

Then you have to have some pretty solid arguments why you want to be a pilot, why the air force wants you as a pilot and a convincing argument that you do not see this as a short cut to civil aviation.

Good luck.

jordanpolonijo

Having never been tested in this manner before nor having any experience of a cockpit, I wondered what the test for RAF/Fleet Air Arm Pilot officers entails?

Is it possible to revise or practice any techniques beforehand and/or would taking the GAPAN private test at the facility benefit me in any way shape or form.

Sometimes I think people "hype" these tests as opposed to remaining calm and confident as to their ability????

Many thanks guys..( any information will be much appreciated )

Pontius Navigator

I see you have found the OASC Sticky. Have you found the search function yet? I found 177 hits.

Bill Sim

Thanks for the advice 3P DRIFT and P-NAV. Taking your advice I am thinking of a case for my application. Whenever I have asked why 30 is to old I get told it is to do with return of service. I find this a bit false as the majority of aircrew I have spoken to tell me the average service from pilots is 12-15years (thus the introduction of FRI 2). At age 30 the service will get that and more from someone like myself. Moreover, after 15 years service from me I will be to old to be of any interest to the commercial industry, therefore my whole flying career will be with the service. A safe choice for the RAF in the case of retention. This is the case I am thinking of pitching. Any advice? I also would like to know how having a JAR PPL would be a disadvantage to my application? My thoughts were, if I could demonstrate the ability to undertake and complete flying training, it might make me look less of a risk. There is a full time flying course starting in october I am trying to get my name on. However if it won't help me I could save myself £4500!

Pontius Navigator

There will be an amortisation period of about 5-6 years. After that you could PVR so the 15 yrs is purely notional.

If that were true there would be few pilots here PVRing at age 40+

you need better.

Not a lot. If you read the sticky you will see that you gain a we bit of airmanship but equally can pick up bad habits. Retraining a PPL is not something that they want to do. Save your money. Focus on what you want - aircrew as NCA or a commission.

3portdrift

In my opinion, you are focussing on totally the wrong thing. There is no real issue about amortizing training costs etc, the RAF seems to be able to pretty much shuffle a persons terms of Service to suit their needs anyway. The issue is aptitude. A civilian PPL shows no relevant aptitude, beyond the first few weeks of basic flying training. Civilian flying training focusses on keeping you safe while flying around in a Cessna. From day 1 military flying training is focussed on developing the skills you need to fly a fast jet operationally (in incremental steps of course!). All a PPL will give you is a little more awareness and lots of bad habits.

The age limit is in place because the standard bell curve of aptitude falls away sharply in a person's late 20's. The only 'case' you can make is that you have the aptitude of someone below the age limit. To do that, you need to get yourself down to OASC under the pretence of wanting any branch, sit the tests, ace the tests and then ask for a Pilot place. Nothing else is likely to help. If no-one is going to let you apply for Pilot, put an application in for any Officer branch, then try to change when you have proved your 'case' by demonstrating the aptitudes down at OASC.

airborne_artist

If you want to get through OASC as officer aircrew I'd suggest a) gliding, not PPL (A) and b) spending proportionately more of your time developing your officer potential.

Pontius Navigator

Bill, the other question you will need to answer is why now? Why did you wait until you were 30? Your rank may be an issue too however we all know how promotion is not rapid in your trade.