HMS Illustrious (Now incl photographs)
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: London
Posts: 2,916
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
HMS Illustrious (Now incl photographs)
I've been invited to spend a few days in HMS Illustrious and will be joining the ship in Oslo this afternoon.
If there are any Ppruners in the ship's company, I'd welcome the opportunity to meet.
Tudor Owen
If there are any Ppruners in the ship's company, I'd welcome the opportunity to meet.
Tudor Owen
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sitting on the toilet of Europe.... the UK
Posts: 264
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Come down to the Boiler room (Keep going down until cant go any further) Knock 3 times on the pipes to let me know it's you 
. Ensure you have your grow bag on back to front. We will have some Naval fun together
Mmmm fresh meat. What a lucky boy I am
. Ensure you have your grow bag on back to front. We will have some Naval fun together Mmmm fresh meat. What a lucky boy I am
Ignore the predictable asinine posts, which with any luck will be removed, let's hope you meet some real Ppruners, and thoroughly enjoy the trip.
Jack
PS But don't wear your "uniform" at Captain's Defaulters!
Jack
PS But don't wear your "uniform" at Captain's Defaulters!
Last edited by Union Jack; 28th Jun 2009 at 13:14.
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: North East England
Posts: 172
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just remember when going round the ship "25 HELPS"
Its the ladders that get you up and down and round the Invincibles. 2 Deck and 5 deck are the uninterruped decks, Hotel Echo Lima Papa and Sierra ladder chains go right through the ship.
Remember that and you'll get around old Lusty fine.
Its the ladders that get you up and down and round the Invincibles. 2 Deck and 5 deck are the uninterruped decks, Hotel Echo Lima Papa and Sierra ladder chains go right through the ship.
Remember that and you'll get around old Lusty fine.
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Down Under
Posts: 139
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Does anyone know why US aircraft carriers don't have a sloped ramp at the end of the runway like UK carriers?
If a Harrier were to take off from a US carrier, would it then have to be catapulted? Can it take off conventionally like an ordinary plane on the usual deck runway?
Can an F-14 or F-18 take off a US carrier deck without catapults? What if it used the whole length of the deck? Would the take-offs be better if it had a ski jump at the end without catapults? Just wondering.
If a Harrier were to take off from a US carrier, would it then have to be catapulted? Can it take off conventionally like an ordinary plane on the usual deck runway?
Can an F-14 or F-18 take off a US carrier deck without catapults? What if it used the whole length of the deck? Would the take-offs be better if it had a ski jump at the end without catapults? Just wondering.
Red On, Green On
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Between the woods and the water
Age: 24
Posts: 6,487
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
If a Harrier were to take off from a US carrier, would it then have to be catapulted? Can it take off conventionally like an ordinary plane on the usual deck runway?
Can an F-14 or F-18 take off a US carrier deck without catapults? What if it used the whole length of the deck? Would the take-offs be better if it had a ski jump at the end without catapults? Just wondering.
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Sydney
Age: 45
Posts: 243
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With a totally clear deck and no external stores and next to zero internal fuel a Hornet might not end up in the drink if you let it lose from the very rear of the ship. Maybe ad in a good strong headwind plus the carrier going as fast as possible. It is certainly not practical.
Harriers are not stressed for conventional carrier operations (ie, with catapults and arrestor wires). They have no launch bar and the nose gear would not be designed to handle such loads.
Harriers are not stressed for conventional carrier operations (ie, with catapults and arrestor wires). They have no launch bar and the nose gear would not be designed to handle such loads.
Last edited by dat581; 10th Jul 2009 at 07:20.
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: England
Posts: 488
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
USMC Harriers regularly take-off from the flight decks of US Navy ships without the aid of either a catapult or a ski-jump. However, rather than a large aircraft carrier, they are taken to sea aboard Wasp or Tarawa class amphibious assault ships, which are quite a bit bigger than the British carriers:
The US Navy -- Fact File
If it was necessary to operate Harriers from a large CVN, I guess that the normal landing area would be used for an unassisted short take-off run. Alternatively, launches could be made over the bow - but I would suspect that a centreline and some distance markers would be painted onto the deck to aid the take-off run.
I did hear that as there is a limiting speed at which the nosewheel can hit the ski-ramp, the latest generation of Harriers, with more powerful engines and a better wing, would be better off without it.
The US Navy -- Fact File
If it was necessary to operate Harriers from a large CVN, I guess that the normal landing area would be used for an unassisted short take-off run. Alternatively, launches could be made over the bow - but I would suspect that a centreline and some distance markers would be painted onto the deck to aid the take-off run.
I did hear that as there is a limiting speed at which the nosewheel can hit the ski-ramp, the latest generation of Harriers, with more powerful engines and a better wing, would be better off without it.
Last edited by Brain Potter; 6th Jul 2009 at 23:07.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sydney, AU
Posts: 117
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
USMC Harriers regularly take-off from the flight decks of US Navy ships without the aid of either a catapult or a ski-jump. However, rather than a large aircraft carrier, they are taken to sea aboard Wasp or Tarawa class amphibious assault ships, which are quite a bit bigger than the British carriers:
YouTube - AV8-B Harrier Launch
The Russians use ski-jumps too for their non catapulted Su 33's - They get airborne using butch power alone.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Murrysville,PA
Age: 45
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Seeing that harrier takeoff tells you nothing. It may not be fully loaded. The reason the harrier uses the "ski jump" is because of the payload increase. It can not takeoff vertically fully loaded. It comes down to either a longer runway or short runway with "ski jump".
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: London
Posts: 2,916
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
.
HMS Illustrious 28 June - 2 July 09
Pilots from 4 Sqn RAF embarked to gain/renew carrier currency
Harriers from Naval Strike Wing
Oslofjord
North Sea
Honourable Company of Air Pilots
From FlyCo
RN Lynx night flying - Midnight in the North Sea
Disembarking off the Scottish coast
(Some distortion - pic taken from Lynx.)
The four days passed very (too) quickly, but provided a fascinating insight into the operation of an aircraft carrier and its various roles in our maritime capability. The visit gave me a greater understanding of the role of an aircraft carrier in delivering air power wherever it is required.
Many thanks to Captain Ben Key RN, Cdr Mark Deller RN (Commander Air), all the ship's company and to the pilots of 4 Squadron RAF for taking the time to explain things to a civvy.
Tudor Owen
(Edit)
HMS Illustrious 28 June - 2 July 09
Pilots from 4 Sqn RAF embarked to gain/renew carrier currency
Harriers from Naval Strike Wing
Oslofjord
North Sea
Honourable Company of Air Pilots
From FlyCo
RN Lynx night flying - Midnight in the North Sea
Disembarking off the Scottish coast
(Some distortion - pic taken from Lynx.)
The four days passed very (too) quickly, but provided a fascinating insight into the operation of an aircraft carrier and its various roles in our maritime capability. The visit gave me a greater understanding of the role of an aircraft carrier in delivering air power wherever it is required.
Many thanks to Captain Ben Key RN, Cdr Mark Deller RN (Commander Air), all the ship's company and to the pilots of 4 Squadron RAF for taking the time to explain things to a civvy.
HMS Illustrious and 4 Squadron RAF are both Affiliated Units of the Guild of Air Pilots and Air Navigators
Tudor Owen
(Edit)
The Guild became the Honourable Company of Air Pilots in February 2014
Last edited by Flying Lawyer; 17th May 2015 at 08:07.
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: England
Posts: 488
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
m9,
The USMC Harriers operate off exactly the kind of deck shown in that video with a pretty usable war-load.
If you go to this site:
Aviation Videos & Airplane Videos | Patrick's Aviation
and search for a video called "Go Boom" you will see AV-8Bs operating from an LHA during GW2, carrying a variety of loads including large external tanks and 2 LGBs.
As I said before, I recall a Harrier pilot telling me that the CVS ski-jump speed limit has the effect of curtailing the launch speed and lowering the payload for a modern Harrier. I don't know if I remembered this correctly, or whether it is simply the extra length the USN LHAs that makes the difference, but those ships certainly seem capable operating Harriers at useful weights without a ski-jump.
The USMC Harriers operate off exactly the kind of deck shown in that video with a pretty usable war-load.
If you go to this site:
Aviation Videos & Airplane Videos | Patrick's Aviation
and search for a video called "Go Boom" you will see AV-8Bs operating from an LHA during GW2, carrying a variety of loads including large external tanks and 2 LGBs.
As I said before, I recall a Harrier pilot telling me that the CVS ski-jump speed limit has the effect of curtailing the launch speed and lowering the payload for a modern Harrier. I don't know if I remembered this correctly, or whether it is simply the extra length the USN LHAs that makes the difference, but those ships certainly seem capable operating Harriers at useful weights without a ski-jump.
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Somerset
Posts: 196
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nice shots FL, very clear
Glad you enjoyed it and got an appreciation of the challenges of embarked aviation although the weather looked very benign; imagine that now in High Seas with crappy viz. I find it odd looking at pictures of just GR Harriers on the deck and no FA2's as last time I was on we had a mixed bag. The GRs would take off from about the 250 line with the FA2's needing the entire deck to get airborne.
Glad you enjoyed it and got an appreciation of the challenges of embarked aviation although the weather looked very benign; imagine that now in High Seas with crappy viz. I find it odd looking at pictures of just GR Harriers on the deck and no FA2's as last time I was on we had a mixed bag. The GRs would take off from about the 250 line with the FA2's needing the entire deck to get airborne.
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: North East England
Posts: 172
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Known this ship in varous forms and parts of my life since November 1981 when I first saw her on sea trials to a fantastic weekend on board earlier this year.
If ever there was an example of smart procurement it is the Invincible Class.
I will be sad to see them go, but not sad that they did more than it said on the tin, time and time again.
If ever there was an example of smart procurement it is the Invincible Class.
I will be sad to see them go, but not sad that they did more than it said on the tin, time and time again.