Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Military Aviation
Reload this Page >

Gaining An R.A.F Pilots Brevet In WW II

Military Aviation A forum for the professionals who fly military hardware. Also for the backroom boys and girls who support the flying and maintain the equipment, and without whom nothing would ever leave the ground. All armies, navies and air forces of the world equally welcome here.

Gaining An R.A.F Pilots Brevet In WW II

Old 29th Aug 2018, 20:08
  #12201 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Herefordshire
Posts: 1,092
Received 4 Likes on 3 Posts
ex82watcher - I was at LATCC then and thought Jan was Czech. Vague memory of him wearing some sort of device either round his head or was it his neck? I think he had suffered some health issues - maybe a mild stroke? Always a very affable man, I wish I had found out more about him.

Last edited by Brian 48nav; 29th Aug 2018 at 20:09. Reason: missing capital leter
Brian 48nav is offline  
Old 29th Aug 2018, 20:29
  #12202 (permalink)  

OLD RED DAMASK
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Lancashire born. In Cebu now
Age: 70
Posts: 368
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Franek, thanks for the link for seeing Tadeusz Turek. He was a really nice guy. It is a great shame that there is no more history on his RAF career or his dedication to his ATC sqn as a Wing Commander. I often wonder how John got on with his career.
lasernigel is offline  
Old 29th Aug 2018, 21:03
  #12203 (permalink)  
Danny42C
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
MPN11,

ISTR you sent me the pic of the Leeming ATC Controllers in a PM about Dec, 2015, but Pprune has altered the PM Inbox format a lot recently: half of the ones I was keeping seem to have disappeared.

If it was you, and you.ve still got it, could you PM it again. please ? Jack Blocki was certainly on it (and me, of course !)

Just a shot in the dark ! Cheers, Danny.
 
Old 29th Aug 2018, 22:20
  #12204 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: east ESSEX
Posts: 4,575
Received 62 Likes on 37 Posts
Danny,sent you a PM..
sycamore is online now  
Old 29th Aug 2018, 23:14
  #12205 (permalink)  
ICM
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Bishops Stortford, UK
Age: 82
Posts: 460
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Brian: This is all a bit contemporary for a nominally WW2 thread, but I was on 72 Course, one of the last to go through Hullavington, I think. (Jan - Jul at HV, then Aug - Dec at Stradishall.)
ICM is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 00:46
  #12206 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Warsaw
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Danny
Frankly, I do not remember if Jack's mother was Brenda, but I will try to check. I know that he spend quite a few years in Cyprus, mostly sailing with his wife, and was there during Turkish invasion. I think he moved to the UK shortly before his death. I think I have an email to his son, I will look for it, and make him aware of the thread.

Nigel
Tad Turek, assuming it was him, I find him as F/O in RAFVR and no other Turek, had a very interesting career during the war. He flew eg. with No 317 Sqn on Spitfires, and No 309 Sqn on Mustangs. Most interesting period was his service with No 609 Sqn. He was one of few Polish airmen flying Typhoons, and he scored few kills on them, the most famous being St Valentine's day massacre in 1943, where he flew with S/L Lallemant. It seems he later became a school teacher.
Have a look at the photo, and see the video - he is sipping coffee.
609 Squadron Typhoon JP745 PR-L P/O. Turek

Guys
Jan Masat was a Czech indeed. No problem, I will make aware a Czech pal, he certainly would be interested.
I will try to write more tomorrow.
Best wishes
Franek
Franek Grabowski is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 08:10
  #12207 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: East Anglia
Posts: 757
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
ex82 watcher, Brian 48nav, Franek
Many thanks for the correction, amendments made.
FantomZorbin is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 10:52
  #12208 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Often in Jersey, but mainly in the past.
Age: 79
Posts: 7,760
Received 128 Likes on 57 Posts
Originally Posted by Danny42C
MPN11,
ISTR you sent me the pic of the Leeming ATC Controllers in a PM about Dec, 2015, but Pprune has altered the PM Inbox format a lot recently: half of the ones I was keeping seem to have disappeared.
If it was you, and you.ve still got it, could you PM it again. please ? Jack Blocki was certainly on it (and me, of course !)
Just a shot in the dark ! Cheers, Danny.
PM sent. Yes, Jack Blocki 3rd from left in front row. Picture seems extremely small ... I had to zoom AND use the magnifying glass!!

EDIT: Damn, can't attach image to PM!! Working on it ...

MPN11 is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 12:22
  #12209 (permalink)  
Danny42C
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
MPN11,

Thanks ! - that's the one, Jack Blocki is third from left, I am fourth from right. Fine body of men - and one very nice girl,

Franek,

Brenda (?) was Jack's wife, not his mother.

Nearly all dead now, I suppose.

Danny.

Last edited by Danny42C; 30th Aug 2018 at 12:26. Reason: Afterthought !
 
Old 30th Aug 2018, 12:48
  #12210 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: West Sussex
Age: 82
Posts: 4,737
Received 152 Likes on 54 Posts
Icare9:-
https://listakrzystka.pl/en/polskie-...-na-zachodzie/
Considering what they suffered, with Germany and then "friend" Russia carving up the Country, the Katyn massacre and the Warsaw Uprising, they really had a tough War.
And then not be allowed back to their Country and persecution by the Russians...
Many thanks for that link Icare9. Thanks to Franek I now know that Victor Fontes (actually Wiktor Cepiński-Flegel) was not a pilot as I thought but an Air Observer, later to become a Navigator of course. Also of interest was that he was born in Georgia and died at the young age of 66. His awards are given as 3xKW, ML, and ODRK. Could you please give us a translation Franek?

Quite agree about the duff hand the Poles were dealt with, Icare9. I think they were also denied a place in the London Victory Parade for fear of offending our Russian allies.
Chugalug2 is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 16:52
  #12211 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Warsaw
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Chugalug
Even more interestingly, Victor declared himself as Moslem. KW is Krzyż Walecznych, or Cross of Valour. I think it couldbe roughly compared to DFC/DFM. ML is MedalLotniczy or Air Medal. I have no idea what ODRK is, need to check.
The London parade was a little bit more complicated. The commie regime was invited, but ultimately refused. Then at the last moment Polish troops in the UK were asked, but in such a situation, obviously refused.

Re Brenda - sticky fingers, I thought of wife, but typed mother. Sorry.

F/L Artymiuk was Kazimierz Artymiuk, ex-305 Sqn Wellington pilot.

Most of the men are gone by now. I recall one being still alive, perhaps there is a handful of them.
Franek Grabowski is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 18:40
  #12212 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: West Sussex
Age: 82
Posts: 4,737
Received 152 Likes on 54 Posts
Interesting indeed, Franek. The only thing he told us was of his long and dangerous journey to Gib, and hence the UK and RAF, where he flew with BC. His English vocabulary was limited (understandably) in the 60s, and somewhat colourful as well! Now he turns out to be Moslem! The abbreviations on Icare's site are given here, including those of Victor's awards:-

https://listakrzystka.pl/en/zasady_w...#Wykaz_Skrotow

A DFC and two bars equivalent! Also the Polish Air Force Medal, and a Wounded in Action one. I presume those in the Polish Air Force in the UK were only entitled to Polish Awards, or were they allowed UK ones too? How did the CoC work, were they fully integrated into the RAF and subject to RAF Air Force Law, or was there a more complicated system in force?

Those immediate Post War years were not morally easy ones for the UK. In particular we handed back ex Red Army Cossacks to the USSR who faced almost certain death. At least there was a place for the Poles who remained with us in the UK Services. I seem to recall that a group of them, I guess ex Army Engineers, who well into retirement stuck together in teams clearing minefields and munitions in the UK. Dangerous work but they faced it together!
Chugalug2 is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 20:38
  #12213 (permalink)  

OLD RED DAMASK
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Lancashire born. In Cebu now
Age: 70
Posts: 368
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Franek Thank for the video link much appreciated. Hoping I can find his obituary somewhere.

Seems to have be blessed with the ability to survive. http://Tadeusz Turek

Last edited by lasernigel; 30th Aug 2018 at 20:44. Reason: Addition
lasernigel is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 21:07
  #12214 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Aberdeenshire
Age: 76
Posts: 67
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
There are 8 Polish Pilots buried in Sleepyhillock cemetery, Montrose. 7 of those were with 8 FTS, all in 1941. One of these was killed in a mid air collision, and crashed a couple of hundred yards from my Grandparents house. Well before my time, but I remember them talking about it. The 8th was killed in 1944 while with 307 Sqdn.

Link here https://www.cwgc.org/find/find-war-d...literal=Polish
OffshoreSLF is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2018, 22:31
  #12215 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Warsaw
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Nigel
Here you are some more reading on Turek. He died in 1993 in Warrington. There is an ongoing research on the Polish AF, so there is a good chance someone tackles his story, especially as it was quite unusual.
https://www.yumpu.com/en/document/vi...iary-air-force
PS Sorry, St Valentine's was Polek not Turek, but as you can read, he got some as well.


Chugalug
As I said it is a rough comparison. The Polish award system was simple. You could get four CVs, the fifth meant a Silver Cross of VM. Each class of VM could have been awarded only once. Classes varied due to level of command, the silver one was for everyone, and then the one had to be a commander of bigger and bigger units. Polish airmen could get foreign awards, following agreement of the Polish command. Several got British awards, for example Skalski had DSO and DFC & two bars, this apart of Polish Gold & Silver Crosses VM and CV & three bars not to mention minor awards. As to the system, generally PAF had control over personnel matters, awards, major offences. Rank system was complicated, as Poles had two sets of ranks, Polish, badges worn on collars, and RAF ones, on sleeves. Operationally PAF was subordinated to RAF, this was logical, as PAF was too small force to work independently. Sometimes it causes a mess.
In regard of post-war period, not everyone shared views of Attlee, but on the other hand Britons seemed to have little understanding what Soviets are. Some understood that well, however. A long story!

SLF
There is a pretty good coverage of Polish burials on the Polish internet, and a few years ago there was a book published (in Polish) covering all flying deaths of Polish airmen 1939-1945. There was also one less detailed covering all AF deaths, and in 1952 a list of all deaths of Polish Army 1940-1947 has been published. As to Szempliński, he was killed in a crash in bad weather in a Mosquito, together with RAF navigator, Frank Tillman. Tillman was buried next to him, I think.
Franek Grabowski is offline  
Old 31st Aug 2018, 01:01
  #12216 (permalink)  
pzu
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: N Yorkshire, UK
Age: 76
Posts: 484
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Well there could be hope for me yet!!!

At 200/hr as opposed to 2750/hr, there could be hope for me yet!!! BUT I doubt Id fit in!!!

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/the-...eaving-ground/

PZU - Out of Africa (Retired)
pzu is offline  
Old 31st Aug 2018, 03:38
  #12217 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,913
Received 2 Likes on 1 Post
Jack Blocki

Danny,

You were asking earlier about Jack Blocki's wife. Her name was Hilda. I remember them both well and they were a lovely couple. They were our neighbours in married quarters in Cyprus in the early 1970s, when Jack and I both worked at JATCC Nicosia.
spekesoftly is offline  
Old 31st Aug 2018, 14:03
  #12218 (permalink)  
Danny42C
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
spekesoftly (#12218).

Hilda ! - of course ! - it was on the tip of my tongue !

Odd thing, on the photo (#12209 - "Twenty two men and a girl !"), there are only two pilots, Jack and I.

(Liverpudlian) Danny.
 
Old 31st Aug 2018, 15:06
  #12219 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Location: Location!
Posts: 2,284
Received 29 Likes on 23 Posts
Originally Posted by Danny42C
spekesoftly (#12218).

Hilda ! - of course ! - it was on the tip of my tongue !

Odd thing, on the photo (#12209 - "Twenty two men and a girl !"), there are only two pilots, Jack and I.

(Liverpudlian) Danny.
I see what you did there, Danny....

Jack

PS A "Scouser" the other day, but now a "Liverpudlian"?
Union Jack is offline  
Old 31st Aug 2018, 17:01
  #12220 (permalink)  
Danny42C
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Jack,

Same difference ! Danny,
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.