AAC Fri
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AAC Fri
Rumour has it that a new FRI is to be announced for the AAC (not sure if just for AH drivers) which may equate to around £100k after the tax man has had his chunk.
Not sure if the other 2 services are being included.
Anyone out there got anything to add on this?
Not sure if the other 2 services are being included.
Anyone out there got anything to add on this?
Last edited by northerntorque; 27th Feb 2008 at 08:39.
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How long is the return of service?
Will be interesting to see if throwing money at the issue will relieve the cronic problem we have at the moment and will have in the next couple of years.
I personally dont think it will as money is not the be-all and end-all solution. Good management and valuing the blokes is a good start.
How many AAC pilots are wandering off to either the light blue or civvy market in the next couple of years??? (hint; its not money driven)
How many of our fixed wing chaps are throwing their hand in? (I hear some will be doubling their money flying civvy for the other service due to them not being able to man a certain platform).
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Why would the AAC consider an FRI for Apache aircrew established to 120 people but only manned with 50 aircrew? Less than 50% manned, comitted to operations but not considered a pinch point trade! Another 32 by the end of the year would bring it up to 80 therefore 66% manning if it wasn't for the stampede for the door.
Sense of smell and coffee spring to mind!
Sense of smell and coffee spring to mind!
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I imagine that an FRI would have tempted a few pilots to stay on, lets face it, there won't be any one incentive that would appeal to everybody.
The AFPRB report suprised me too. I think the smoke and mirrors worked, DAAvn convinced everyone that the Corps is fully manned. The figures you quote are only half the story, QHI's are another. One of the two Attack Regiments only has two QHI's and it should have had eight, can't man that one so we cut the establishment, so now it's only five!
One of the two Attack Regiments doesn't have a Weapons officer, and why would they need one! The other one is about to be posted. No manning problems here though.
HEDP, the coffee smells good from my office!
The AFPRB report suprised me too. I think the smoke and mirrors worked, DAAvn convinced everyone that the Corps is fully manned. The figures you quote are only half the story, QHI's are another. One of the two Attack Regiments only has two QHI's and it should have had eight, can't man that one so we cut the establishment, so now it's only five!
One of the two Attack Regiments doesn't have a Weapons officer, and why would they need one! The other one is about to be posted. No manning problems here though.
HEDP, the coffee smells good from my office!
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How many of our fixed wing chaps are throwing their hand in? (I hear some will be doubling their money flying civvy for the other service due to them not being able to man a certain platform).
The rest of your paragraph was not too accurate though. 
I wish you all well. You are doing a sterling job in the sandpit. It is such a pity to see the same faces every time!
At least we have sent you a new plaything. Look after him please?
At least we have sent you a new plaything. Look after him please?
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Think wg13_dummy hits the nail on the head.....money is not everything.
However it is a good indicator as to the real value that is placed on people who serve in the AAC. Why for example are we still not told about progress on equal flying pay?...if this was a civvy company things would be sorted asap. That is unless there is a very good reason for us not to be paid the same?.
I understand that in todays enviroment of high op tempo and empty wallets unpleasant decisions have to be made....but...the lack of communication is scary!.
There are more things to do other than stay in the forces, if you are towards the end of your career then I can understand it would be foolish to leave with 3-4 years to push.....
I will have to wait around before I can leave, but leave I will ....
I dont think an exodus of people will have a catastrophic effect, it will just accelerate peoples careers behind those leaving...
Just a real shame nothing is seen to be being done.....
However it is a good indicator as to the real value that is placed on people who serve in the AAC. Why for example are we still not told about progress on equal flying pay?...if this was a civvy company things would be sorted asap. That is unless there is a very good reason for us not to be paid the same?.
I understand that in todays enviroment of high op tempo and empty wallets unpleasant decisions have to be made....but...the lack of communication is scary!.
There are more things to do other than stay in the forces, if you are towards the end of your career then I can understand it would be foolish to leave with 3-4 years to push.....
I will have to wait around before I can leave, but leave I will ....
I dont think an exodus of people will have a catastrophic effect, it will just accelerate peoples careers behind those leaving...
Just a real shame nothing is seen to be being done.....
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A comment was heard from a certain Hants HQ not too long ago I believe;
"NCOs should consider themselves lucky that they are able to fly. What are they whinging about?"
I think that pretty much sums up the level of commitment and loyalty required from both sides.
"NCOs should consider themselves lucky that they are able to fly. What are they whinging about?"
I think that pretty much sums up the level of commitment and loyalty required from both sides.
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Gents,
As wing 13_dummy has said money is not everything. And that's why I take my hat off to the AAC. I have spent 12 years as a Puma Loadie working with the AAC in several operational theatres. Whilst, understandably there has been angst about single service policy I have rarely heard AAC pilots moaning about pay, FRIs etc. Its a pity the same cannot be said amongst lots of money grabbing green eyed RAF types. I wish to extend my support to the AAC perhaps seeing many of you in light blue in the future and wishing the rest luck wherever you go.
As some one said in a previous post, 10 years for the AAC, is that realistic? or more 10 years for RAF SH????
As wing 13_dummy has said money is not everything. And that's why I take my hat off to the AAC. I have spent 12 years as a Puma Loadie working with the AAC in several operational theatres. Whilst, understandably there has been angst about single service policy I have rarely heard AAC pilots moaning about pay, FRIs etc. Its a pity the same cannot be said amongst lots of money grabbing green eyed RAF types. I wish to extend my support to the AAC perhaps seeing many of you in light blue in the future and wishing the rest luck wherever you go.
As some one said in a previous post, 10 years for the AAC, is that realistic? or more 10 years for RAF SH????
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I love it!...
Can believe such comments!
When we have pissed off all the SNCO's and all the junior officers are given OJARS for being OC pubs only then will we realise things are / were bad!.
Some might say its a masterplan to get rid of SNCO aircrew.....I personally think its to do with the out of touch and myopic attitude that prevails in our upper echelons.
Can believe such comments!
When we have pissed off all the SNCO's and all the junior officers are given OJARS for being OC pubs only then will we realise things are / were bad!.
Some might say its a masterplan to get rid of SNCO aircrew.....I personally think its to do with the out of touch and myopic attitude that prevails in our upper echelons.
A comment was heard from a certain Hants HQ not too long ago I believe;
"NCOs should consider themselves lucky that they are able to fly. What are they whinging about?"
I think that pretty much sums up the level of commitment and loyalty required from both sides.
"NCOs should consider themselves lucky that they are able to fly. What are they whinging about?"
I think that pretty much sums up the level of commitment and loyalty required from both sides.
Correct we can fly and will do so quite happily in Civvy Street or by transferring.......
Some might say its a masterplan to get rid of SNCO aircrew.....I personally think its to do with the out of touch and myopic attitude that prevails in our upper echelons.
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What do you expect if it takes 2 + years for a graduate officer to get through training. Arrives in Sqn as a Captain with no man management training. Gets no man management training with the Sqn,Regt,or the corps.
Has to move on within 3 years so as not to career fowl him/herself. The next time one sees them after various courses, juinior staff jobs is in a position which requires management skills. With no management skills.
Now at a level where brownnosing immediate boss is required to climb the greasy pole. Onward and upward.
This is not a work place that encourages the frank and honest discussion of problems. It is rotten to the core ( no pun intended ). The only reason the AAC survives is through its non commissioned officers providing continuity.
From an ex rodney
Has to move on within 3 years so as not to career fowl him/herself. The next time one sees them after various courses, juinior staff jobs is in a position which requires management skills. With no management skills.
Now at a level where brownnosing immediate boss is required to climb the greasy pole. Onward and upward.
This is not a work place that encourages the frank and honest discussion of problems. It is rotten to the core ( no pun intended ). The only reason the AAC survives is through its non commissioned officers providing continuity.
From an ex rodney
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It will be interesting to see what the future does hold for the AAC. Will JHC be all consuming? NCO pilot cross-pollenation? Not sure that will happen. Can't see too many Flt Lts being too happy at being a co-pilot for a Sgt aircraft commander in a Chinook. Certainly given the reasonably high resignation rate of AH officers if it wasn't for the NCO's the capability would struggle. Not that it's not doing already judging by some of the manpower % quotes earlier. Oddly enough, it was a 100% NCO crew that carried out the Jugroom Fort rescue earlier last year. That's not to say that had both aircraft been crewed by commissioned dudes that the same decision would have been taken. The mission commander is now commissioned but that's irrelevant. I gather he was debating jumping ship to the blue suits at one stage but has maintained his allegiance. I wouldn't have thought that his decision to stay was based on a potential windfall.
Hats off and respect still go to those maniacs that crew the Chinooks that have to cruise in and land under immense fire when going into places such as Musa Q, et al. Now you do deserve your flying pay and operational bonus. I would load my PAX premiums though.
Hats off and respect still go to those maniacs that crew the Chinooks that have to cruise in and land under immense fire when going into places such as Musa Q, et al. Now you do deserve your flying pay and operational bonus. I would load my PAX premiums though.