Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Military Aviation
Reload this Page >

Future Carrier (Including Costs)

Military Aviation A forum for the professionals who fly military hardware. Also for the backroom boys and girls who support the flying and maintain the equipment, and without whom nothing would ever leave the ground. All armies, navies and air forces of the world equally welcome here.

Future Carrier (Including Costs)

Old 5th Oct 2018, 18:40
  #5261 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London, New York, Paris, Moscow.
Posts: 3,632
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by KenV
A digital camera with the kind of light sensitivity for such dark environment photos is sensitive down into the near infra red. So while your eye can't see the heat plume from the engine, the camera can.
Stealthy Huh!

Sorry. A demonstration of the traits designed into the platform for low observability under the overall mantle called stealth.
glad rag is offline  
Old 5th Oct 2018, 19:06
  #5262 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 682
Received 9 Likes on 5 Posts
Originally Posted by glad rag
Stealthy Huh!

Sorry. A demonstration of the traits designed into the platform for low observability under the overall mantle called stealth.
Blimey. There's an effin great radar reflector called an aircraft carrier around when it's doing that hovering trick. A bit of near IR in that regime is hardly an issue.

In forward flight during a mission, how would you provide the spec performance without a jet engine and a con-di nozzle?

Of the things people complain about with the F-35, the practical limitations of physics seems a strange one to add to the list.
hoodie is online now  
Old 5th Oct 2018, 19:42
  #5263 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: The sunny South
Posts: 819
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by glad rag
Stealthy Huh!

Sorry. A demonstration of the traits designed into the platform for low observability under the overall mantle called stealth.
At such close range, I suspect the visual bulk of the aircraft is a bit more of a giveaway to its presence than the exhaust plume. Low observability does not constitute invisibility.
FODPlod is offline  
Old 11th Oct 2018, 17:24
  #5264 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Southampton
Age: 54
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
New Visitors to the deck, expanding her repertoire:




This last one is what many have been waiting to see after the F-35Bs of course!
Obi Wan Russell is offline  
Old 11th Oct 2018, 18:12
  #5265 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: England
Posts: 343
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts
Originally Posted by hoodie
Blimey. There's an effin great radar reflector called an aircraft carrier around when it's doing that hovering trick. A bit of near IR in that regime is hardly an issue.

In forward flight during a mission, how would you provide the spec performance without a jet engine and a con-di nozzle?

Of the things people complain about with the F-35, the practical limitations of physics seems a strange one to add to the list.
Does the F35 have a con-di nozzle?
Buster15 is offline  
Old 11th Oct 2018, 18:56
  #5266 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 682
Received 9 Likes on 5 Posts
Yes.
The production F-35 design has a compact axisymmetric convergent/divergent nozzle for the STOVL version and a longer set of nozzle flaps for better performance on the CTOL and CV variants.
(The quote is from one of the photo captions at that link)
hoodie is online now  
Old 12th Oct 2018, 01:22
  #5267 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Nevada, USA
Posts: 1,597
Received 35 Likes on 24 Posts
RAFEngO74to09 is offline  
Old 13th Oct 2018, 00:33
  #5268 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Southampton
Age: 54
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Some more from the trials:



Obi Wan Russell is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2018, 12:48
  #5269 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
It seems that carriers are more vulnerable than ever when you take the new missile technologies that the Russians and Chinese have.
Lechon is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2018, 15:13
  #5270 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Everything’s more vulnerable than ever. Yawn.
orca is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2018, 15:54
  #5271 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Nevada, USA
Posts: 1,597
Received 35 Likes on 24 Posts
F-35B - First SRVL

First ever Shipborne Rolling Vertical Landing (SRVL) - F-35B trials on HMS Queen Elizabeth:

RAFEngO74to09 is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2018, 21:05
  #5272 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: cheshire
Posts: 245
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The thing that strikes me most about these PR pics is the amount of real estate (deckspace) we have. Seems completely disproportionate to our ability to fill it!

Potential to be more of a national embarrassment than a national asset?
andrewn is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2018, 21:25
  #5273 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 682
Received 9 Likes on 5 Posts
Is there anything about QEC or F-35B that people won't moan about? "It's too capable" is a new one.
hoodie is online now  
Old 14th Oct 2018, 22:24
  #5274 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hants
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by RAFEngO74to09
First ever Shipborne Rolling Vertical Landing (SRVL) - F-35B trials on HMS Queen Elizabeth
Nice one. 11 and a bit years after doing the SRVL demo on FS Charles de Gaulle with the* electric nozzly jet, someone's done it with an example of the intended electric nozzly jet onto (one of) the intended deck(s). Stopped much quicker this time! Well done to TJSF, the ITF and QNLZ!

*at the time ours was the only one.
NoHoverstop is offline  
Old 15th Oct 2018, 07:58
  #5275 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I listened to a rather good brief by a RAF Regiment Officer the other day in which he gave the stats that in WW2 the axis powers lost 18,000 aircraft to ground based attack and the figure for the US in Vietnam was 1,800.

I’ve no reason to doubt him - and the figures do give a new slant to the ‘carriers are so vulnerable’ argument. Seems the risks of the sea base as compared to those faced by non movable airfields might not be balanced the way some folk put forward.
orca is offline  
Old 15th Oct 2018, 12:29
  #5276 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 350/3 Compton
Age: 76
Posts: 777
Received 352 Likes on 86 Posts
I hold the record for the first ever CRVL, c 1045Z May1st 1982; I was not sure whether I could safely hover after taking one of Herr Rheinmetal's 20mm HE through my tail. Took a bit longer to stop than Wizzle though!

"I counted them all out and I counted them all back"

Mog
Mogwi is online now  
Old 20th Oct 2018, 13:43
  #5277 (permalink)  
Suspicion breeds confidence
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Gibraltar
Posts: 2,404
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 2 Posts
Mog, what was your approach speed and stopping distance for said manoeuvre? Sounds a bit hairy.
Navaleye is offline  
Old 21st Oct 2018, 16:40
  #5278 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 350/3 Compton
Age: 76
Posts: 777
Received 352 Likes on 86 Posts
Aye, 'twas a little tricky because the jumping bean's brakes were not very effective on a greasy deck. I stabilised at 50kts IAS with the ship doing around 20kts into wind, so c30kts ground speed. Touchdown was about 50' in and I stopped opposite Flyco, so about 300' of roll. Luckily the deck was pretty stable because any rolling moment would have meant the possibility of slipping overboard and an early bath.

Biggest problem was all the goofers on the flight deck who were all desperate to see the arrival. It was a bit like a football crowd with everyone moving a bit further forward to be able to see past their oppo. Flyco twigged though, and cleared them into the catwalk as I was short finals.

Hey-Ho!

Mog
Mogwi is online now  
Old 22nd Oct 2018, 07:12
  #5279 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 433
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I'm still amazed at how stable that thing is in the hover, compared with our previous trusty steed.
OK4Wire is offline  
Old 23rd Oct 2018, 09:27
  #5280 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 350/3 Compton
Age: 76
Posts: 777
Received 352 Likes on 86 Posts
Amazing what you can do with computers nowadays. It will never be able to do a "Farley climb" though!

Last edited by Mogwi; 23rd Oct 2018 at 11:37. Reason: Sp!
Mogwi is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.