JPA - What will it do for you?
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Originally Posted by rej
From what I understand from my JPA briefing, the system has yet to have a provision for claiming days off in lieu of public holidays worked. Great to roll it out on 1 Apr when we have easter and 2 PHs in May; all those poor souls who will end up working will no doubt loose that time off (another erosion of the quality of life that we once experienced).
And for Southside who will, no doubt, add that some civvies also get stitched work over PHs - yup they do, but they also get double time pay!
And for Southside who will, no doubt, add that some civvies also get stitched work over PHs - yup they do, but they also get double time pay!
I Must have gone to another briefing as I don't think you understood the JPA brief very well. The system won't have to provide for PH's worked. You are entitled to your leave and when you take leave then you fill the box in and the leave will be taken off your chit. If you work a PH then you are not claiming that leave and therefore it is still there for you to take.
Nice coherant comment from TSM there. Is a swinging monkey a member of the RAF Regt ?
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Southside, do you trawl through the posts and disagree with every single one.
I would have thought that the chances are that that you were not at my briefing (many briefings/many units/probably not serving at the same location etc) and for the most I think that I did understand the information that was given (but there again Southside always knows more than the rest of us!!).
This is what we were briefed: you enter the start date of your leave, the end date of your leave and JPA automatically deducts the 'absence' days from your 30 days leave entitlement. Therefore, if you took a week off after Easter but you worked Good Friday and Easter Monday, the week should only 'cost' 3 days from your annual leave. However, from what I was briefed, there is no facility available to enter the breakdown of days taken like there is on the current RAF leave form and JPA will not know that you worked the two PHs. Hence, the system cannot cope with such instances.
Fortunately Grimweasel has given me good guidance - cheers mate.
and The Swinging Monkey is a good judge of character.
I would have thought that the chances are that that you were not at my briefing (many briefings/many units/probably not serving at the same location etc) and for the most I think that I did understand the information that was given (but there again Southside always knows more than the rest of us!!).
This is what we were briefed: you enter the start date of your leave, the end date of your leave and JPA automatically deducts the 'absence' days from your 30 days leave entitlement. Therefore, if you took a week off after Easter but you worked Good Friday and Easter Monday, the week should only 'cost' 3 days from your annual leave. However, from what I was briefed, there is no facility available to enter the breakdown of days taken like there is on the current RAF leave form and JPA will not know that you worked the two PHs. Hence, the system cannot cope with such instances.
Fortunately Grimweasel has given me good guidance - cheers mate.
and The Swinging Monkey is a good judge of character.
Last edited by rej; 28th Feb 2006 at 08:13.
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"This is what we were briefed: you enter the start date of your leave, the end date of your leave and JPA automatically deducts the 'absence' days from your 30 days leave entitlement. Therefore, if you took a week off after Easter but you worked Good Friday and Easter Monday, the week should only 'cost' 3 days from your annual leave. However, from what I was briefed, there is no facility available to enter the breakdown of days taken like there is on the current RAF leave form and JPA will not know that you worked the two PHs. Hence, the system cannot cope with such instances."
Presumably, the JPA computer will be regularly updated to recognise the PHs and other entitlements. So, if you work on the PHs (ie you do not include those dates within your stated leave span), the computer will credit your leave balance accordingly. Or, the computer credits you with your annual entitlement including PHs at the beginning of the Leave Year. Until I experience this system for myself I'm reluctant to be critical. If the briefing states that we only need to enter dates, and all is taken care of, then it gets my vote, at the moment.
Presumably, the JPA computer will be regularly updated to recognise the PHs and other entitlements. So, if you work on the PHs (ie you do not include those dates within your stated leave span), the computer will credit your leave balance accordingly. Or, the computer credits you with your annual entitlement including PHs at the beginning of the Leave Year. Until I experience this system for myself I'm reluctant to be critical. If the briefing states that we only need to enter dates, and all is taken care of, then it gets my vote, at the moment.
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I love the idea that under JPA rates will disappear. From now on you will pay for all meals out of your own pocket and claim actuals back from the reciepts. (and by the way you are required to keep said recipts for 6 yrs!). All meals will be in set time periods and have set allowance, (as in the mess), fly over these periods and land hungry/night fly and sleep through the day and you get nothing! And one final thing, you will all need individual reciepts.
The entire system is designed for salesmen who work 9-5. Genius.
The entire system is designed for salesmen who work 9-5. Genius.
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Will we still be able to get an advance of 'rates' to cover the 8 week detachments and then claim back at the end? Not everybody has the free income to cope with capped actuals and I would be weary of using 'my' money and then hoping that JPA pays it back.
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well, go and get one then. Go down to the UPO or whatever your unit office is called, fil the chit out and in very short notice you'll have a shiny new card in the post
As with the question of leave. Im assured that the computer will only register your leave. If you don't take leave then it wont regiseter it. You are entitled to your 36 days plus and if you dont get them then no computer is going to stop you marching out of the gate. It will take a long time for this thing to settle down and I for one will enjoy some of my lads having lots of leave and all because the PC says they haven't had it yet.
As with the question of leave. Im assured that the computer will only register your leave. If you don't take leave then it wont regiseter it. You are entitled to your 36 days plus and if you dont get them then no computer is going to stop you marching out of the gate. It will take a long time for this thing to settle down and I for one will enjoy some of my lads having lots of leave and all because the PC says they haven't had it yet.
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Had our JPA brief today.
Apart from the fact that I see this as yet another job to do, it pains me to say that some of the stuff here appears to be nonsense. I don't agree with the Capped Actuals thing, and when I asked what the actual amounts would be, the briefer was unable to tell me. He confirmed that we will be expected to produce receipts for items over £5, but that these would need to be retained for one year (not 6 years as someone suggested earlier). That being the case, I expect that my own claims will reach the cap, it's just that the items making up the amount may all be made up of items costing <£5.00!
Similarly, the issue of leave appears not to have been so badly thought out as suggested here. My own concern is for those who work shifts - will the system accept that a shift worker's weekend occurs on a Weds/Thurs? The answer was yes. You can put a stand-down day in perfectly legitimately - it's just that if you are not a SNCO or offr, you may need to have your boss approve it.
What I have most concern about is the ability of the Service to deliver the system as described. I am not convinced that the DII or various interim systems are up to supporting the software, and if this database works exactly as required, it will be a first for the Services!
Edited to add that I was also rather disturbed by the statement that people who are unable to provide recipts without good cause would be subject to disciplinary action ... this is going to present some significant problems and may make criminals of us all!
STH
Apart from the fact that I see this as yet another job to do, it pains me to say that some of the stuff here appears to be nonsense. I don't agree with the Capped Actuals thing, and when I asked what the actual amounts would be, the briefer was unable to tell me. He confirmed that we will be expected to produce receipts for items over £5, but that these would need to be retained for one year (not 6 years as someone suggested earlier). That being the case, I expect that my own claims will reach the cap, it's just that the items making up the amount may all be made up of items costing <£5.00!
Similarly, the issue of leave appears not to have been so badly thought out as suggested here. My own concern is for those who work shifts - will the system accept that a shift worker's weekend occurs on a Weds/Thurs? The answer was yes. You can put a stand-down day in perfectly legitimately - it's just that if you are not a SNCO or offr, you may need to have your boss approve it.
What I have most concern about is the ability of the Service to deliver the system as described. I am not convinced that the DII or various interim systems are up to supporting the software, and if this database works exactly as required, it will be a first for the Services!
Edited to add that I was also rather disturbed by the statement that people who are unable to provide recipts without good cause would be subject to disciplinary action ... this is going to present some significant problems and may make criminals of us all!
STH
STH
I agree, yet another job which, IMHO, will probably generate even more stress and jobs due to the teething problems. Seems to have been designed with a nice cosey little factory in mind where most people clock on and off at about the same time.
What about those away on long dets? Is there a way for them to access from the sand?
I vote we keep the current 'meat' interface. Not perfect but at least you know where they live.
I agree, yet another job which, IMHO, will probably generate even more stress and jobs due to the teething problems. Seems to have been designed with a nice cosey little factory in mind where most people clock on and off at about the same time.
What about those away on long dets? Is there a way for them to access from the sand?
I vote we keep the current 'meat' interface. Not perfect but at least you know where they live.
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Here we go then,
Suppose all your immediate superiors are detached, Chief, CSgt, FS, WO, et al. You happen to be the scroat back at base. The 2i/c/Boss is on leave. There are other senior people around, but due to the 'Flight' system of working on a squadron (that's Navy and RAF - not sure with Army) they do not have the JPA computer permissions to sort things for people not on their 'Flight' or whatever.
You want 2 days leave, so send an electronic request from a spare computer terminal you found loafing
Your immediate sup does not answer within 48 hours, so it gets passed to the next one. He's away, so you now get passed to next in line. He could not possibly get back to confirm your request as he is otherwise engaged somewhere else.
Can you go on leave as you want, without the electronic confirmation; or could, HERETIC, you ask nicely of the Chief, WO, Et al, down the corridor, if it would be OK?
Does the system account for line managers absence?
Suppose all your immediate superiors are detached, Chief, CSgt, FS, WO, et al. You happen to be the scroat back at base. The 2i/c/Boss is on leave. There are other senior people around, but due to the 'Flight' system of working on a squadron (that's Navy and RAF - not sure with Army) they do not have the JPA computer permissions to sort things for people not on their 'Flight' or whatever.
You want 2 days leave, so send an electronic request from a spare computer terminal you found loafing
Your immediate sup does not answer within 48 hours, so it gets passed to the next one. He's away, so you now get passed to next in line. He could not possibly get back to confirm your request as he is otherwise engaged somewhere else.Can you go on leave as you want, without the electronic confirmation; or could, HERETIC, you ask nicely of the Chief, WO, Et al, down the corridor, if it would be OK?
Does the system account for line managers absence?
Suppose all your immediate superiors are detached, Chief, CSgt, FS, WO, et al. You happen to be the scroat back at base. The 2i/c/Boss is on leave
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In actual fact, the only people who really know how this thing works are the Boffs who built it and the pussers who are tryng to sell it to us. Why not leave it a year and see if it works. You never know, this time next year we could all be singing the virtues of it and wondering how we ever coped without it.... (I doubt it somehow but at least lets give it a fair crack)
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Actuals
The actuals will be £21 per day if you have only booked B+B thorugh CHBS, however if you take the B+B plus evening meal then you will get £4.20, all these figures come from JSP 725