Vulcan & Bucc. threads excellent. Anyone for the Javelin?
AF,
This sounds like the incident with XH614 - the pilot ended up with just one engine at one point. The number 1 engine went first, and despite no fire warning (the system was severed by the explosion) there was an orange glow. The no. 1 and no.2 engines were shut down (part of the fire drill, AIUI). About 15 seconds later, the no.3 engine failed. After a spot of very quick thinking, the captain decided to re-light no.2 engine, which came back after four attempts. XH614 landed past the threshold, and stopped 20 yds of the end of the runway. The captain was awarded an AFC.
This sounds like the incident with XH614 - the pilot ended up with just one engine at one point. The number 1 engine went first, and despite no fire warning (the system was severed by the explosion) there was an orange glow. The no. 1 and no.2 engines were shut down (part of the fire drill, AIUI). About 15 seconds later, the no.3 engine failed. After a spot of very quick thinking, the captain decided to re-light no.2 engine, which came back after four attempts. XH614 landed past the threshold, and stopped 20 yds of the end of the runway. The captain was awarded an AFC.
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Butterworth sept 1964, 15 Sqdn Victor B1a XA 941 had same problem. Was on the last Victor det B4 the Vulcans managed to arrive ( 6 weeks late!!!!!).
Came home Nov 64 , posted from Cottesmore to Honington, promptly got set back out on news years day , Gave me a nice 6 weeks in the Sun, Jan 65.
Talking about Javelins, again at Butterworth, 64 Sqdn had 6 on det. They weren’t the best of the fleet as they never managed to get more than 2 airborne at any time. However the Boss cracked the whip and the boys worked there b$lls off all weekend and managed not only to achieve 4 serviceable Aircraft but to launch 4 as well. (Tornado Wings pls note )
At the end of the trip they busted back into the cct tucked in tight 4 ship Echelon stb, looked great. (This will p$ss off the F86 wing!!!!!!)
Break left 2 sec intervals nice tight ccts, No 1 touches, puff of smoke from the gear, rolls out, No 2 touches down puff of smoke from the gear, then even bigger puff of smoke from left wheel, big bang hits our ears on Victor line. No 3 powers up from very short final, crash wagon sets out, No 2 leaves the runway to the left heading for the F86 line at a high rate of knots.
No 4 go's around. 3/4 land away.
Never saw 4 Javs airborne again
Came home Nov 64 , posted from Cottesmore to Honington, promptly got set back out on news years day , Gave me a nice 6 weeks in the Sun, Jan 65.
Talking about Javelins, again at Butterworth, 64 Sqdn had 6 on det. They weren’t the best of the fleet as they never managed to get more than 2 airborne at any time. However the Boss cracked the whip and the boys worked there b$lls off all weekend and managed not only to achieve 4 serviceable Aircraft but to launch 4 as well. (Tornado Wings pls note )
At the end of the trip they busted back into the cct tucked in tight 4 ship Echelon stb, looked great. (This will p$ss off the F86 wing!!!!!!)
Break left 2 sec intervals nice tight ccts, No 1 touches, puff of smoke from the gear, rolls out, No 2 touches down puff of smoke from the gear, then even bigger puff of smoke from left wheel, big bang hits our ears on Victor line. No 3 powers up from very short final, crash wagon sets out, No 2 leaves the runway to the left heading for the F86 line at a high rate of knots.
No 4 go's around. 3/4 land away.
Never saw 4 Javs airborne again
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Thanks for the replies, folks. Interesting stuff. On one occasion in my youth, I happened to be on the seafront at South Shields, in Durham, when I heard one of the strangest noises I have ever come across.
I turned and looked over the sea, and flying south to north, about a mile or so offshore, were six Javelins, cruising along in loose formation, and at a height of perhaps two or three thousand feet.
I watched them for several minutes until they went from view behind the headland, but they could still be heard for quite a while afterwards.
I assumed they were from R.A.F. Middleton St. George (now Teeside Airport) where I believe they were stationed at some time. Perhaps someone who was in the R.A.F. at that time might enlighten us.
The only other example I have ever seen flying was XH897, the Duxford machine, although at the time, it was still busy at Boscombe Down.
I actually saw it at the R.A.F. "At Home" Day at R.A.F. Coltishall, where it was on static display.
After the show had finished, we were walking back to where we were staying, a distance of about three miles, when XH897 took off, on its way home, passing directly over us, climbing steeply, and with a deafening roar.
I turned and looked over the sea, and flying south to north, about a mile or so offshore, were six Javelins, cruising along in loose formation, and at a height of perhaps two or three thousand feet.
I watched them for several minutes until they went from view behind the headland, but they could still be heard for quite a while afterwards.
I assumed they were from R.A.F. Middleton St. George (now Teeside Airport) where I believe they were stationed at some time. Perhaps someone who was in the R.A.F. at that time might enlighten us.
The only other example I have ever seen flying was XH897, the Duxford machine, although at the time, it was still busy at Boscombe Down.
I actually saw it at the R.A.F. "At Home" Day at R.A.F. Coltishall, where it was on static display.
After the show had finished, we were walking back to where we were staying, a distance of about three miles, when XH897 took off, on its way home, passing directly over us, climbing steeply, and with a deafening roar.
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Yes there were Javelins at Middleton St George. I remember one day when I was an Air Cadet - so it was between 1961 and 1963 - I was in a train travelling from Thornaby to Darlington and as we passed M St G I admired the two immaculate lines of Javelins and Lightnings. Fighter Command had a penchant for lining their squadrons up in straight lines to make it easier for an enemy to strafe them - it was the gentlemanly thing to do and unlike bomber crews, fighter pilots were gentlemen. Suddenly one of the Javelins sank to the ground, pole axed. There being no sign of any Migs in the circuit I assume it was an unfortunate rigger who had somehow selected the gear up. Fighter Command were also very good at stiffening their upper lips so we never did find out what happened.
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I must put my hand up to having been ground crew (Air Wireless Mech) on Javs back in the late 50's early 60's, both at West Raynham and at No1 GWTS at Valley.
The access panel in the belly was always the first thing off and the last thing on, and lying under that beast with the engines running tightening lord knows how many Zeus fasteners...... It was before health and safety and ear defenders and all that stuff.
I recall a time just prior to the AOC's annual visit. We were all too busy doing 'mending' to clean and polish said a'c, so the shiny ar$e$ were promoted to working on them. A certain clerck type bod was busy using miles of 'WadPol' on one aircraft, in danger of removing the paint off the upper wing surface as the thing was being refueled. The u'c oleos had a habit of 'sticking' and did not settle down slowly as the weight increased. Rather, they went down in great jerks, and us regular aircraftsmen would allow for this by not standing up under the thing during this process. The lad on the wing however shot to his feet and quite literally ran off the wingtip, shouting 'the things collapsing'. Needless to say, the only things collapsing were us, in fits of laughter.
Another time was when one came back off a sortie having just been fitted with new brakes. It was not unusual in these circumstances to see flames licking up from the hubs, something to do with the 'tropical proof coating' I believe. We used to just watch, and only intervene if the flames did not seem to be dying down. A shiny ar$e, waiting for transport round the airfield, saw the flames, rushed over and fired a CO2 extinguisher at the wheel. No-one was injured by the exploding wheel hub, as you may well imagine the effect of cold gas on hot hubs.... We used to use powder extinguisher on brake fired for this very reason.
Bit pi$$ed off at Valley, it was across the water and they spoke in strange tongue, but we did not get overseas pay
Nice site here for the Jav anyway:-
http://www.btinternet.com/~javelin/
TJ
The access panel in the belly was always the first thing off and the last thing on, and lying under that beast with the engines running tightening lord knows how many Zeus fasteners...... It was before health and safety and ear defenders and all that stuff.
I recall a time just prior to the AOC's annual visit. We were all too busy doing 'mending' to clean and polish said a'c, so the shiny ar$e$ were promoted to working on them. A certain clerck type bod was busy using miles of 'WadPol' on one aircraft, in danger of removing the paint off the upper wing surface as the thing was being refueled. The u'c oleos had a habit of 'sticking' and did not settle down slowly as the weight increased. Rather, they went down in great jerks, and us regular aircraftsmen would allow for this by not standing up under the thing during this process. The lad on the wing however shot to his feet and quite literally ran off the wingtip, shouting 'the things collapsing'. Needless to say, the only things collapsing were us, in fits of laughter.
Another time was when one came back off a sortie having just been fitted with new brakes. It was not unusual in these circumstances to see flames licking up from the hubs, something to do with the 'tropical proof coating' I believe. We used to just watch, and only intervene if the flames did not seem to be dying down. A shiny ar$e, waiting for transport round the airfield, saw the flames, rushed over and fired a CO2 extinguisher at the wheel. No-one was injured by the exploding wheel hub, as you may well imagine the effect of cold gas on hot hubs.... We used to use powder extinguisher on brake fired for this very reason.
Bit pi$$ed off at Valley, it was across the water and they spoke in strange tongue, but we did not get overseas pay
Nice site here for the Jav anyway:-
http://www.btinternet.com/~javelin/
TJ
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Attended a lecture by Brian Grant a couple of weeks ago who is the red bull sea vixon display pilot.
As a young RAF pilot he flew Javelins from Leeming and recounted tales of his interesting and varied career. Centreline closure was mentioned with the solution being carborundum paste being applied to the blade tips. He also mentioned that at Leeming it was often the case that a crosswind would be present. As the Javelin had toe brakes it could be tricky to apply even braking without moving the rudder so the first thing to do on landing was to apply the control lock situated between the throttle which locked rudder bar allowing toe brakes to be used.
As a young RAF pilot he flew Javelins from Leeming and recounted tales of his interesting and varied career. Centreline closure was mentioned with the solution being carborundum paste being applied to the blade tips. He also mentioned that at Leeming it was often the case that a crosswind would be present. As the Javelin had toe brakes it could be tricky to apply even braking without moving the rudder so the first thing to do on landing was to apply the control lock situated between the throttle which locked rudder bar allowing toe brakes to be used.
We actually have two Javelins at Leeming at the mo... The gate guard near the Mess, and one with blacked-out windows next to the wash-bay, which I believe belongs to Elvington. We also have a knackered F4 in faded 29 Sqn colours down by the wash bay, keeping the Javelin company.
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<anorak> I think that's Leeming's second gate guard Javelin. There was one there in 79, but that one may have been scrapped as XA634 (the present one) was at Colerne until the museum closed. </anorak>
Last edited by airborne_artist; 9th Feb 2006 at 15:18.
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Orionsbelt, halleluja. You are the first person I have heard from that actually said the Vulcans got there <<Butterworth sept 1964, 15 Sqdn Victor B1a XA 941 had same problem. Was on the last Victor det B4 the Vulcans managed to arrive ( 6 weeks late!!!!!). Came home Nov 64 >>
The whole issue is shrouded in mystery and confusion but we were not 6 weeks late. I concede that the powers that be may have promised you relief 6 weeks earlier but that is different.
I joined the sqn on Jun 64 and the sqn was due to relieve you at the end of Sep 64. We were to leave on 23 Sep. In the event Confrontation flared up and 55/57 at Tengah were extended. At the same time we were rushed out on 8 Sep and thereafter the staffs go cold feet. We arrived at Aden the next day and then held for 5 days before moving forward to Gan. We held there a further 9 days as the FEAF base loading to too high and the air threat was high. We then started to rotate through Butterworth, one aircraft at a time to rearm. We eventually arrived at Butterworth at the begining of October.
PM me, and I can send you my article.
The whole issue is shrouded in mystery and confusion but we were not 6 weeks late. I concede that the powers that be may have promised you relief 6 weeks earlier but that is different.
I joined the sqn on Jun 64 and the sqn was due to relieve you at the end of Sep 64. We were to leave on 23 Sep. In the event Confrontation flared up and 55/57 at Tengah were extended. At the same time we were rushed out on 8 Sep and thereafter the staffs go cold feet. We arrived at Aden the next day and then held for 5 days before moving forward to Gan. We held there a further 9 days as the FEAF base loading to too high and the air threat was high. We then started to rotate through Butterworth, one aircraft at a time to rearm. We eventually arrived at Butterworth at the begining of October.
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Anyone know what happened to the RAF Manston Gate Guard Javelin - It was still there when I left in 1982.
Probably scrapped I guess.. but, if anyone knows for sure.. Fire away!
Probably scrapped I guess.. but, if anyone knows for sure.. Fire away!
Don't know about London Kent Manston, but the civil aerodrome at Staverton Cheltenham Gloucestershire Intergalactic currently has a nicely maintained Jav as gate guard!
Sort of on-topic
We were called into the office in the early 60's to 'deal with' a reported bail-out by a Jav crew en-route to the Far East. IIRC, the pilot was killed and the Nav (Tony Melton?) was, eventually, picked up by a Pakistani Grumman Goose pilot from a river.
We later met this pilot at an overnight in Burma, still with his Goose - fascinating !
We were called into the office in the early 60's to 'deal with' a reported bail-out by a Jav crew en-route to the Far East. IIRC, the pilot was killed and the Nav (Tony Melton?) was, eventually, picked up by a Pakistani Grumman Goose pilot from a river.
We later met this pilot at an overnight in Burma, still with his Goose - fascinating !
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[a reported bail-out by a Jav crew en-route to the Far East]
This was an early instance of centreline closure, I was in close formation (IMC) when the failure happened. We were delivering Javelins by ferrying, rather than flight refuelling, to Singapore when 60 Sqn's Meteor 14s were being replaced. Our "convoy" wasn't the most successful, we left Waterbeach with 6 aircraft and arrived at Tengah two weeks later with 4. Tony Melton's pilot, Ted Owen, was the single casualty, though, the first aircraft lost was on the ground at Luqa when it suffered a fairly spectacular (AVPIN inspired) failure during a ground run following an engine starter change.
This was an early instance of centreline closure, I was in close formation (IMC) when the failure happened. We were delivering Javelins by ferrying, rather than flight refuelling, to Singapore when 60 Sqn's Meteor 14s were being replaced. Our "convoy" wasn't the most successful, we left Waterbeach with 6 aircraft and arrived at Tengah two weeks later with 4. Tony Melton's pilot, Ted Owen, was the single casualty, though, the first aircraft lost was on the ground at Luqa when it suffered a fairly spectacular (AVPIN inspired) failure during a ground run following an engine starter change.
