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-   -   What EK incidents resuted in firing (https://www.pprune.org/middle-east/603659-what-ek-incidents-resuted-firing.html)

JammedStab 30th Dec 2017 12:48

What EK incidents resuted in firing
 
I am disturbed to hear that guys from the recent JFK A380 incident have been fired instead of extra training. It seems excessive. I can understand if intentionally doing something that breaks the rules or if one damages the aircraft but this is not the case here.

I am curious what other incidents(with details of what happened) resulted in someone getting fired?

Airbubba 30th Dec 2017 13:04


Originally Posted by JammedStab (Post 10005425)
I am curious what other incidents(with details of what happened) resulted in someone getting fired?

You mean like Melbourne, Dubai, and Mauritius and Moscow?

donpizmeov 30th Dec 2017 15:09

You are wrong Re the MRU crew Bubba.

Airbubba 30th Dec 2017 17:48

Thanks for the correction, I'm glad to be wrong about those guys. :ok:

The idea of sacking crews to increase operational vigilance might not have the desired effect. As SOPS puts it:


Originally Posted by SOPS (Post 10003368)
I can see crews so busy trying to comply with procedures so the don't end up sacked, that instead of doing what they are meant to be doing, flying the aircraft, they end up making a mistake because they are so worried about making a mistake...you can see where Im going with this...

In fact, I wonder if the poor guys on 207 fell to the above scenario, so busy trying to follow a procedure, so worried by the fear factor ( or as I called it..the constant Background Radiation), that the fear of NOT following the procedure, led them to NOT flying the aircraft..with the result.

The place is a complete train wreck...


nakbin330 30th Dec 2017 20:20

Manchester.

Dropp the Pilot 30th Dec 2017 22:04

Taking selfies in CMB

Dropp the Pilot 30th Dec 2017 22:08

As a curiously timely example, one chap was fired for having an argument with customs about how much wine he could bring with him when returning to DXB from his layover. This was at the TBF before the TBF before the bouncy castle.

It may also hold the land speed record. If I recall correctly he was fired before crew transport dropped him at his residence that very evening.

SOPS 31st Dec 2017 01:20

I would say, basically, depending who you upset and how much wasta they have...almost anything has the potential to get you sacked..imho.

fliion 31st Dec 2017 01:44

It’s the Final Warnings from operational incidents that is also a real concern.

Multiple cases of guys been issued these and deciding it’s too risky to chance losing the Prov fund with another incident - so up and leave.

There are too many of these & the thread would be overloaded. It’s human error to make mistakes, but here is punishable by a deflating flawed mgt policy of punitive measures. The Co is effectively saying - we don’t want you here & the letter is the impetus for said victim to start interviewing.

The Augment firing (notwithstanding the appeal) is a real kick in the bollocz to all of the EK pilots who go out and for the vast majority do a great job. There is no reference in the B-FCTM (380 not sure) for an operational role from CM3 & 4 - yet now that seat is been held to an operational standard even though the GCAA is being deceived for FTL reasons, that said Augmenters are not on duty

This is absolutely a new and deflating low - and the effects are tangible amongst the boys & girls on-line.

sealear 31st Dec 2017 01:56

I agree re the augmenting role, and as someone who does a lot of ULR I find it extremely disturbing.

What happened in CMB with the selfies? With all the Instagram accounts these days it will hardly be surprising I'm sure.

Visual Procedures 31st Dec 2017 02:32

Pre insta, when the tigers were flying around and tensions were tighter..

A320 Skipper 31st Dec 2017 02:32

Is it really that easy to get fired in EK guys?
Was the pilot from the MAN app really fired for that video on Youtube? Also, can someone please be so kind to explain that is a final warning letter?
:confused:

givemewings 31st Dec 2017 03:57

Ironic now that they actively encourage the selfies... so long as you're one of their chosen ones of course.

Plenty of staff in various departments fired for doing what their own "social media stars" do every day :rolleyes:

As usual, inconsistency at its finest. Either pics on board are OK or they're not.

donpizmeov 31st Dec 2017 06:53

There was the famous sandwich incident.

SOPS 31st Dec 2017 07:33

The list is long and distinguished.

my salami 31st Dec 2017 12:24


Originally Posted by sluggums (Post 10006385)
No one gets fired, they, ahem... 'leave'.

Any by the way, the company cannot touch your provident fund that you've contractually earned. It's not theirs to take. Regardless of why you're leaving/dismissed. They play on people's ignorance of the rules.

Not really... You're only entitled to get your contribution back.

MS

BANANASBANANAS 31st Dec 2017 16:31

Whatever the finer points on Prov Fund entitlement are, a review of recent policy changes and (over)reaction to incidents forces me to conclude that Emirates is now actively trying to drive expats out without suffering the loss of company face that would come from it making pilots redundant. Being sacked or being 'resigned' or even genuine resignations are so much easier for the EK PR team to spin. If you resign over the age of 50 are you still considered to be 'retired' by EK HR? That was one of the gems they tried when they were last trying to hide the real numbers.

Why the company would choose to behave like this is open to a certain amount of debate but none of the likely reasons bode well for expats still here.

gearlever 31st Dec 2017 16:41

Any locals up front on EK-207?

kipper the dog 31st Dec 2017 17:04

No Gearlever, all western expats up front. To be fair to them, the local guys haven't been involved in any of the 8 or so incidents as far as I know. The last incident that involved one of them was when 521 went belly up.

gearlever 31st Dec 2017 17:14

Thx kipper. Proportions locals/ expats may have changed after I have left (2013).

Divertnow 1st Jan 2018 06:45


Originally Posted by kipper the dog (Post 10006593)
No Gearlever, all western expats up front. To be fair to them, the local guys haven't been involved in any of the 8 or so incidents as far as I know. The last incident that involved one of them was when 521 went belly up.

Near stall out of Cochin?

Monarch Man 1st Jan 2018 08:30


Quote:
Originally Posted by kipper the dog View Post
No Gearlever, all western expats up front. To be fair to them, the local guys haven't been involved in any of the 8 or so incidents as far as I know. The last incident that involved one of them was when 521 went belly up.


Near stall out of Cochin?
No no habibi, it was a fault with the MCP, the heading bug was broken :E

777-200LR 1st Jan 2018 10:32

BANANASBANANAS,

The expat community haven’t exactly made it hard for it to look that way

Mach.888 1st Jan 2018 11:20


Originally Posted by sluggums (Post 10006385)
No one gets fired, they, ahem... 'leave'.

Any by the way, the company cannot touch your provident fund that you've contractually earned. It's not theirs to take. Regardless of why you're leaving/dismissed. They play on people's ignorance of the rules.

It’s clear , you have NO idea what you are talking about.

BANANASBANANAS 1st Jan 2018 12:07


Originally Posted by 777-200LR (Post 10007170)
BANANASBANANAS,

The expat community haven’t exactly made it hard for it to look that way

It might be the new year hangover but I am not understanding your point. Can you explain please. Not being difficult just don't understand.

sealear 1st Jan 2018 13:44

Read your contract guys it says entire provident fund (edit company contribution) is forfeit if dismissed by the company.

givemewings 1st Jan 2018 14:17

It's cute that anyone still thinks a contract is worth anything in the UAE. They can do whatever they like and sure you can fight them but you'll lose your money or your job/visa or both

harry the cod 1st Jan 2018 14:17

sealear

Please at least get the facts correct.

The A fund, ie the Company contribution, is the only one of the three that can be rightfully and legally retained by the Company in the event of dismissal. The B & C fund are kept by yourself regardless of how you leave employment.

It is NOT the entire fund.

Harry

givemewings 1st Jan 2018 14:18

I should specify, the contract from them to you is fluid.

Anything from you to them they will chase down and make you comply.

harry the cod 1st Jan 2018 14:27

givemewings

I also find it rather cute when people talk complete bollocks on these forums and are obviously clueless to the facts. The Provident fund is not 'contracted' in the UAE. It's an approved and regulated financial scheme based in the Isle of Man and run by Trustees completely independent of Emirates. The money that I contribute to the B & C fund has nothing to do with my employer and is not legally theirs to take. Period.

Harry

jack schidt 1st Jan 2018 15:48

Sadly 207 looks like we are going to lose some colleagues, that’s despite AIRLIVE reporting a year where no major passenger jets were lost due to accidents.

J

sealear 2nd Jan 2018 08:17

You're right Harry, I did mean the company contribution not your own contributions obviously. Written somewhere around the globe at some hour after some long flight 🙂

Cloud Bunny 2nd Jan 2018 08:36


Originally Posted by jack schidt (Post 10007392)
Sadly 207 looks like we are going to lose some colleagues, that’s despite AIRLIVE reporting a year where no major passenger jets were lost due to accidents.

J

Not sure about that - apparently one of them is working tomorrow. (So I’m told by a 380 mate of mine, I’ve not confirmed that with my own eyes)

Fuzuma 2nd Jan 2018 09:05

They’re all still rostered last time I checked, as well as a few others, who people have claimed have been fired.......would have to agree with cloud bunny

Talparc 2nd Jan 2018 09:47

it’s normal to be rostered as long as the appeal is on going.

givemewings 2nd Jan 2018 11:59

Harry re read I said nothing about provident funds I mentioned contracts. In general.

They can and will find ways around whatever they want to get around (including their own ERM, SOPs or anything else). Including paying you monies due when you leave, refunding medical expenses or a dozen other things. But they will squeeze you for every ruddy dirham on the way out.

Unlike some here I did actually work for EK.

pumpkin 2nd Jan 2018 12:09


Originally Posted by harry the cod (Post 10007328)
sealear

Please at least get the facts correct.

The A fund, ie the Company contribution, is the only one of the three that can be rightfully and legally retained by the Company in the event of dismissal. The B & C fund are kept by yourself regardless of how you leave employment.

It is NOT the entire fund.

Harry

According to Nick Foxton.. if he is to be believed.. and also Peter Shaw at Mondial, the Provident fund is under the trustees overseas and is in our names. The only way the company can take our A fund, is if EK can prove to the trustees that you did something really bad- such as purposely damage an airplane, assault someone etc- ie a real crime. Dismissal is not grounds for them to keep the A fund. Apparently if they did try this it could be appealed overseas and they would have a hard time proving why they could take this money from us.. as it actually is in our names. So.. does anyone actually KNOW someone who was fired and had their A fund revoked?

GMC1500 2nd Jan 2018 12:52

4 guys from my building were fired back in the old days when firing was rampant.
1. the CMB selfie FO
2. failed a drug test, and was a problem child in any case
3. failed the medical, colour blindness
4. apparently because of a poorly timed/worded email that offended some in the bouncy castle. Again, probably other issues behind that one.

halas 2nd Jan 2018 14:41

The 'A' Fund is an Ace Card the company holds up it's sleeve.

When they are tired of you, they place a resignation letter in front of you to sign.

Sign here and you keep your 'A' Fund.

No recourse. All further correspondence will not be entered into. You are gone.

halas (Literally)

fo4ever 2nd Jan 2018 18:55

Well, the MEL CAPT and FO were not fired but forced to resign with a kalashnikov in their backs by the little midget Mr TCAS.

I quess that 9 years later EK has not changed one bit!

VERY TROUBLING

Fly safe with EK


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