As a final response to 8way and wknight. I have found many people to be fairly insecure about their decisions to be here. Me included sometimes. Often this results in overstating the good points about EK and turning a blind eye to the down side. The good points about EK are very good, and the bad points can be very bad, if they affect you directly. For those of us already here, it makes no difference, and i have no beef with anyone who has chosen to come here. After all I did too! This thread is all about giving advice to anyone thinking of coming.

Additionally, I try my best not to get personal about those who have differing opinions, I just try to provide a balance to many of the one sided posts here. It doesn't do anyone any good to just be told the good points. Any thinking person needs to get the whole picture and make his own decision. Remember 8 way, not everyone is from the UK. Some people like where they live, and need to know what they are getting into if they choose to leave home and come to the desert. Not to mention that for many of us there are other people involved in the decision. Not everyone involved cares about shiny new aircraft and good rosters. Some have an interest in schooling, safety on the roads, security, and a miriad of other non aviation related issues.

And that is my last word on this thread.


Cop u later

The Rev

Real shame REV.

The blokes I know who have been interviewed lately have been very grateful for your words of advice. They have spoken of some of these issues at the interview, and made the time to contact schools etc while here to find out the chances of getting kids into classes etc. Because of your advice they have had a better base from which to make a pretty big decision.

It is a shame that some people can not see the difference between moaning and a balanced view.

Don

Rev,

Thanks for the reply. 6000 hrs is along way yet. I was thinking more along he lines of an entry FO position.

Does this change things?

Cheers :O

Donpizzy - real shame mate, real shame but I can tell the difference between the balanced view and MOANING !!!!!
There is nothing about the vicars view that is balanced - or am I the only thick bastard to see it that way??
Also I would like to point out Doug that there is absolutely nothing about my decision to come here that makes me feel insecure - my wife and my children and I LOVE being here. Tough luck if that goes against your view.
If you are unhappy then I am sure another airline may employ you - or then again probably not because virtually no-one else is hiring. Is that your sole decision for staying ?

White Knight I think that the Rev's remarks are well balanced and just giving the other side of the story so that people do not think that everything in EK is a bed of roses.

I think therefore that you are indeed 'the only thick bastard to see it that way' as you so well put it.

You have made your bed with EK and you wax lyrical about it and that is good for you, though as a new boy it is early days still.

Most pilots have no choice but to stay where they are once they have chucked in the old job.That applies even more so given the current employment situation. Who would employ you as an ex 146 Captain and now a F/O on a A330/B777 presumably if you were to leave EK. Answer probably no one at the present time so it is just as well you like it so much there!

Mr Knight, I'm with the Don, gyspy and the Rev. They, I believe, give a balanced view even from the perspective of someone from the UK. I don't think they're thick bastards.

Can someone tell me where most of the villas are located?
Are they on the Diera side of the creek?
Are they all in one area or spread out?
Thank You
rwelch

Spread out.

Thats not you Bernie, is it ?

Typhoonpilot

No, Do not know anyone named Bernie.
So, the villas are spread out all over the city?

Hey there everyone...... I know this question is not really related to this topic but , I think its close enough....

"Has any pilot ever moved from CX to EK , or Vice Versa ?? "....

I hope this isnt a dum question.... :D :\ :ok:

Just from a hearsay point of view, i believe there are a few guys with applications in at the moment. I understand the position you guys are in at CX and wish you well. Bear in mind from a financial point of view, a CX F/O earns more than a EK Captain. A CX Captain earns more than twice as much as an EK Capt. Before i get the howls from the masses, I know that money is not the main issue; lifestyle, command, education, management etc are all factors. It just seems that many people believe that lifestyle comes as a product of how many fun tickets you have. At EK you dont have as many as at CX. It can be argued that they probably go a little further here though.

DMF

Just wondering if there are many guys at EK who decided not to live in Dubai and take the utilities allowance instead. In order to accomodate the commute, can you usually request a block of days flying then a block of days off?

Hello, EK boys

With the recent Emirates mega-order is it reasonable to suppose time to command would be significantly reduced, at least for the
"accelerated command" pilots?

Don't know if this is the right place, but...

I have an interview for a ground instructional job with Emirates in the near future and one part of the selection procedure is a "short technical test".

Has anyone out there had experience of this and could you give me a heads up as to what it may involve?

Thanks

PS - Interesting to note, in the light of some of the posts here, that they a) offered me an interview within 1 week of my application being submitted and b) they are paying for my ticket!

Hey there fellow aviatiors ??

Has anyone got in with just the minimum requirements posted on the website ?

Ie . 2000 hrs TT
ATPL
1000 hrs Multi crew Jet Experience


Thanks

kiron,
I met once a guy who got in with 3000 hours on 737's, but that was before the expansion, now it's rather unlikely because they have thousands of applications with more than the min. requirements.

rwelch,
Yes they are all over, you could be anywhere from next to the airport to as far away as Jebel Ali.

fullforward,
No, because by the time the aircraft arrive there will be a big list of people with the hours and time ready to do their upgrades.

I've just been reading through this thread and can't help but notice a bit of slanging going on. Just wanna go on record and add my insignificant two cents worth -

As a non EK bloke, I for one want to say that I appreciate the good Rev highlighting the other side of the coin. When decisions are to be made, you've gotta have all, or as much, info as poss. We all know EK is a good oufit, just that the whole deal suits some better than others. I really dont know why some of you have to get all antsy and suggest that one should leave the company just because he doesn't see things the way you do.

If 'real' info incites just one person to think twice about making a career decision that has huge family/lifestyle implications, then its good info in my books. As an expat, I've seen the results of individuals either finding out its not what they thought it would be, or the family not being happy - not good.

To the Rev, cheers. And to any potential posters, please tell it how it is, it's appreciated.

stormcloud,

Thanks for the reply.

rwelch

wandrinabout..
Well said. This thread will benefit those chaps like myself who considers EK as a great airline and viable option but unsure of how's the living conditions in Dubai since nightstopping Dubai in Intercontinental or Sheraton won't help much to experience local lifestyle as expat.
Many thanks to those who'd contributed..
Cheers.
Cpt744

Can anyone tell me if EK paid location meals and layover allowances? What is the average FO take home pay in the first year?

I would also like to reiterate, that I find Dr. Doug's posts very
balanced and why no-one would appreciate his input when
people are considering leaving SQ, Virgin Blue, Dragonair etc.,
they need to know all of the facts. The single or married with
no kids will be accommodated in apartments and the ones with
families will live either on the north or south side of the creek
subject to availability of villas. There is no bargaining entered into. If you take the allowance, you can find your own accommodation but be aware of the full costs of utilities etc.
before you go down this path.
Meal and overnight allowances are issued at the hotel in the
local currency, probably at about 75% of Qantas or B.A. You
would be foolish to use allowances when calculating your
potential salary, especially considering how much a beer costs
at China Jump. Only those who can refrain end up using it for
more sensible things like digital cameras and new computer parts
from Sim Lim. This is not the thread to go into pay and conditions.
This has been endlessly repeated over the last three years, and
has changed very little in the last ten years. Obviously cost of
living has increased markedly. I do believe, however, it is exciting times with regards to the expansion. I believe fast track will be around for another year and a half or so and hopefully all the boys who have been held back due to hours will not be inconvenienced any further. Good luck to all of you in your decisions.

Did he/she get the job?
 

Anyone know if the original poster - I think CRJ700 - interviewed and what the eventual outcome was? Did he get the job - if so, which aircraft type?


I wish he could follow-up with us....


Good luck

dunerider,
I think the 75% figure is a bit out ref BA. Not sure about Qantas.
In HKG, a BA purser gets about £800 for 2 nights. EK get about £220 for 3 nights:{ :{
If only eh!
Cheers.:ok:

Who's going to tell the guys from over the pond that EK don't arm their pilots?

Interesting thread guys.....

One question regarding "the Mrs"....!

Are there any problems with your wife working in DUbai, or is she destined to stay at home, play "wifey" and bring up the kids for the rest of her life?!

No problem with the wife working, a few of the the wives have also opened their own bussinesses.

Teaching the second oldest profession for women in the Middle East.


Lots of positions for Western women(teaching I mean).


For full forward below. There are few cultural restrictions on Western women teaching in the UAE. As a matter of fact they are usually in high demand.


If you haven't heard the expression refering to the world's oldest profession I can't help you. Which is the biggest employer of women in Dubai? The world's oldest or second oldest profession open to debate.

Gnadenburg,

I miss your point. What exactly you are talking about?
Could you clarify, please?

Oh dear Gnadenburg,
I do hope fullforward is not serious!!!:rolleyes:

boocs

Maybe he is Tony Lockett. Who copped a few wallopings on the back of the head playing full forward.

Thanks for the useful info chaps (chapettes!)

My own personal worry if I did move to Dubai, would be the apparent lack of choice/control over where you ended up living. Very nice of the company to provide the diggs, but if you don't like it for any reason, it sounds like you are a bit stuck....

with that said however, there doesn't seem to be many people saying that they join, but find their own place and use the allowance the company gives them to help finance the mortgage.

Am I missing something here, or is this a non-starter which is why you hear so little about it.

Personally, that would probably be the only real option for me if I was to seriously consider moving out there to LIVE !!

Any comments.....?!

Mondriver

You are basically right when you say the allowance is a non starter. This has been hashed out on other threads if you care to do a search. In a nutshell, the allowance is 85000dhs for an F/O, and it will cost you upwards of 120000 plus utilities to live in an equivalent villa in a preferred area. That is why few people do it.

The allowance goes a long way toward paying for a mortgage in one of the new expat estates, but there is a whole bunch of other issues to worry about there, that is why only a small percentage are taking up that offer.

There are rumors of the allowance being increased this year. For now we must wait and see.

Cop U Later

The Rev

Rev,

Could you elaborate on the "whole bunch of other issues"?

Regards,
Geordie.:confused:

Big Geordie

I can't elaborate too much as i haven't purchased one, so I don't want to give the impression that what I say is first hand. Having said that, here are a few of the uncertainties as I see it.

The housing market here is restricted for expats. i.e there is only a few designated estates where expats can buy. These have all been developed by one or two companies and they set the price. There is no competition or free market, so there is no way of knowing what prices a free market would support. Hence there is no easy way of knowing whether you are getting a bargain or being ripped off. Discussions with UAE locals would indicate that they are a rip off. But that is yet to be proven.

The UAE government is against expats owning any land in the UAE. The Dubai government has chosen to go against that law. I don't really forsee a major problem here, but Sheikh Zayed is old, and when the ruler changes, anything could happen.

The quality of workmanship here is appalling, and I cant see why the villas for sale would be any different from the ones that we already live in. So the house that you pay 1m for, could well be worth Jack sh*t in 20 years.

When the first bunch of guys committed, they did so based on a 25 year mortgage. This meant that most, if not all the repayments could be covered by the allowance. Subsequent to the papers being signed, the mortgage terms were changed to 15 years. Thanks for coming!

As far as I know, and I am happy to stand corrected, there are few, if any, laws covering expat home ownership here. It is impossible to say with any certainty what the future will hold when trying to sell etc.

At the moment, it seems that each new release is cheaper than the previous. Each new project is also different, so it is very difficult to compare prices, but consider this. Prior to the estates being built the areas where they now stand were just sand. No different in anyway to any other bit of sand in the UAE. Given that we know the houses are going to depreciate (probably rapidly) because of the poor workmanship here, then the only way the property can increase in value is for the land prices to rise. Given that there is no end to available sand for future projects, I can't come up with a good reason as to what will drive up the price of land.

The only way I can see that second hand properties can maintain or increase their value, is if the developers coninually increase the cost of new housing. Remebering that they are already considered expensive when compared to most salaries, I cant see this happening to any significant degree.

That is just a few of the problems I see from a somewhat uninformed position. I know there are many more, but I do not know enough to comment.

This is not meant to be critical of those who have purchased, as many of them have sound reasons for doing so. These are just some of the reasons why I have chosen to sit back an wait for the dust to settle.

I am happy to be corrected on any of the above points by those that know more than I.

Thanks Rev, a balanced and reasonable argument as ever.
Geordie.

And not forgetting Madam Zelda.....

Each purchase of a property comes with a visa for the UAE (subject to future regulations).
So potential neighbours could be wealthy expats from worldly areas you may never have heard of, and carrying on with the profession discussed earlier in this thread at all hours of the day and night. You will never know until after the purchase.

And don't forget the utilities costs on top of mortgage repayments, and furnishing, and, and.......

Back to EK accomodation.....

No housing supplied by EK will make you happy. Every place has it's faults.
The reason many complain about the housing they are given is because they didn't get to choose it in the first place.

l know many who would live in equal to or less than what is given out here if they had chosen it and paid for it themselves, being what they could afford.

Another thing is jealousy. "Their Villa is better than ours, and we want one like it" syndrome.

If you can make it home for the time you are here, and spend the energy on something you enjoy doing, rather than complaining continualy, life can be enjoyable here.

It's up to you!

Hi,

I have just spent the last hour or so, reading the comments on this thread. My wife, child and I are giving strong consideration to moving to and working for Emirates - provided I progress from the interview pool to an actual interview and ultimate employment.

As information about Emirates is very limited, I have found this site to be a treasure trove of information.

For the men and women that have taken the time to post about working for the Emirates, thanks.

Having had the 'acknowledgement' email from Emirates Recruitment my Wife and I are weighing up the options should we be called to interview.

We like the idea of expat life for, say, a ten year period, until our child is of secondary school age.

The nagging questions concern housing.

Whilst we are neither greedy nor material a pleasant home would be important.

Could someone give a description of an an actual home that Emirates might supply to a small family?

It would really help us; thanks in advance.

from personal experience (i lived in Dubai from 1998-2001) i can say that i loved dubai. For pilots seeking a job at emirates, that wonder if their kids will get the right oppertunities, i can tell you most will love it. I was 14 when i moved there and the best teenages years i had were over in Dubai, its safe, clean, and a beautifull place to live. There are plenty of international schools (financed by emirates, i believe) which give wonderfull future oppertunities. Housing for emirates is wonderfull, they built compounds everywhere where you can live, and trust me compared to dutch houses, these houses are mansions. I knew many pilots there that work for emirates whom all love their job, and so do the children that i knew from school, etc.

I myself got fascinated for flying in dubai, and tried to get into emirates training school, which sadly only takes local students. I'm back in holland now and going to start KLM's aviation college, but my heart is in dubai..and i certainly wish to move back sometime!