This is not a windup...EK
 

You find yourself stranded in the desert thousands of miles away from home. The environment id hostile, the weather most part of the year umbearable. You working for a company tha lured you here promising a exceptional lifestyle, a multiethnic environment but you soon realize that it was marketing.. a fraud.The beach are dirty, and you just get along with your buddies. You soon realize that the "management" is clueless on how to run it and mostof them being expat as you are they don't care. But you probably would in their place .
You see your contract unilaterally changed everyday without being given the chance to say a word.
You find your self flying with DEC's that most of the time, you have to admit not always, seems not to have a clue...On the other hand they wear their hat and ties most appropriately and they know by heart any small regulation concerning inconsistent matters.
They try to cover their below standard flying performances pleasing the company with a pedantic attitude, patronizing the pilots and cabin crew and administering pearl of wisdom deriving from the military career they migh have had in their ****** up countries and acritically accepting any bull**** that comes from the above clueless management to which they are so gratefull cause they got the job.
A sad bunch we must say..indeed.
Nevertheless they represent the ideal Emirates employee.. brainwashed.
Unfortunately mountains are consistently made of hard stone..and one day the inept management will make one of the clueless DEC fly with you.. unmotivated , demoralized FO, that just had is 7 days off screwed by an AD.You also had to forget the nice villa you were planning to buy fed up of living with the other let say four member of your family in a small two bedroom temporary accomodation in the middle of nowhere but mainly cause your wife was menacing to leave with your kids. But the same inhuman and inept management decided one day, with no notice to withdraw your allowance.. May be that day the weather will be extremely bad and only a VNAV approach will be available and terrain is around . Seen the confusion reigning supreme in training,the poor understanding of the aircraft by the DEC, and you distracted and worried by your personal problem but mainly pist .. the holes in the slices start to line up... one ..two ..three... four ...trap mitigate... mhh.. why is doing that... god...what the....!! It has happened and it will happen again..
A happy relaxed motivated employee is the key of the long term success of any company and, even more of an airline where passengers life are at risk. Stressed, worried, and unmotivated pilots constitutes a danger. The short sighted short term,profit driven, cost cutting, punishing, blatantly arrogant and inhuman attitude of EK "management" constitutes the biggest danger to his own future. And that's the bigger proof that most probably it will not have one.

salam aleikum

Spot on!
 

Lies piled upon half-truths. The downward spiral continues.

Our best recourse...

Fly professionally, and compartmentalize all this background noise being created by the immature and short sighted management actions we can continue to expect.

Furthermore, don't let this nonsense creep into our cockpits, because you are correct, it can degrade the safety of the operation.

Don't let the actions of others who have never flown an EK aircraft one nautical mile degrade your professionalism or your family's future.

We are professional aviators, they... obviously are not.

Stand Fast! Look out for each other and your crews.
There is no justice here.... just us:ok:

replace every Emirates by Etihad and any EK with EY and keep the rest of the previous post.
Same same but no different :ugh:

Recruitment will start again in EY with the same fake empty promises of nice villas, lifestyle
No mention of the minimum restsbetween night flights, of the ****hole accomodation in the middle of nowhere, the insane arrogant clueless management, poor standards that are only there for the sake of shining.

Hopefully employement is recovering quicly in Europe, legacy carriers in the JAR environment start recruiting again, even a few asian carriers hire again on Airbus types. These ME clowns will have difficulties in crewing again and our poor miserable roster-linked life will turn crazy again and again, hardly able to sleep at night or day, but who cares you hardly remember what time it is and which weekday it is.... You are only sure of 2 things, you are working like a modern slave, and sooner or later, you will do a critical mistake that will lead you to termination if you are lucky or into a free palmtree state of the art coffin.

Massalamah !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Habibi, your smelly sh1t filled bucket is overflowing me thinks. Did you not pay attention to Pprune when you were joining :=:= tut, tut....

Don't let the a holes get you down, really.

SyB :zzz:

It's hard to take any warnings on Pprune. We all saw what we wanted to see and then it was too late.

And then it's like coping with grief:

Denial: No, it can't be... they've made a mistake, it'll all be alright, a decent villa will come soon, they can't just change my contract like that, they won't get any more DECs... it's my go next.

Depression: Bugger, it is, they haven't made a mistake, it won't be alright, I won't get a decent villa, they've changed my contract, they've just hired another load of TCAS's mates.

Anger: B*stards!!!

Acceptance: What can I do? There's nowhere else to go at the moment, but it will get better one day, and when it does a chance will come to get out of here... keep the faith.

Good advice ANFA. G-EAOU.

sheikmyarse - you MUST go to one of the Thursday meetings and tell Mr Ed and Squeely what you think. It is the only way you will get it off your chest, you will feel better, they will have to listen and will get the full extent of how you feel. It is also a wonderful sight seeing them unable to give you a straight answer, to watch them squirm!!

Nothing will change in the short term, but if enough of us keep going along and telling them what and how we feel, eventually they will have to do something.

Unfortunately the old EK saying still works: 'everyone gets screwed at some point at Emirates, the only variable is when it happens!'

PS If out of all the pilots at EK, disregarding the management guys and the trainers, say 2000 go to the Thursday meetings, each meeting takes 10 pilots, they do meetings for 50 weeks a year = we should keep them busy for 4 years!!!
Even they might get the feeling that something is wrong after 4 years of hearing the same complaints...................:D

The next time your company-emancipating DEC decides to cut corners on SOPs or regs in order to save the company a few bucks, just tell him "NO." Too many F/Os feel there is nothing they can do in situations like this. There is plenty you can do.

All that said, I hate to say this, since you EK F/Os are seemingly already beaten down, but what did you expect? I know more than a dozen of my buddies back home who left decent jobs (even jobs with Legacy carriers) for the pursuit of the EK/ Dubai dream. Having been there many times before, I warned them it wasn't all it's cracked up to be. Their reply to me was that all commentary on prune was from whiners and that life in Dubai was/ is great. They pretty much maintain this same rap to this day.

For those who come from countries with limited aviation options, EK is a great alternative to what is offered back home. But for those of use with better options, I wonder why they gave it all up to come to EK. No legal rights, no union, DECs, the wx, the M.E., etc. It was pretty obvious to us outsiders that this sort of stuff was coming eventually. It should come as no surprise to you all. But now is not the time to go anywhere, sorry to say. Suck it up for the moment, be glad you have a job (a good job) and vote with your feet when the industry improves. Low morale will certanly cancel out any savings derived from this latest EK stunt but you'll have to remain put until the global economy improves (though I'm sure there will be another industry crisis once that happens as well... always a crisis in this business).

Honey moon is over

sheikmyarse..

is just another flunkie that can't manage his personal or professional life.

This guy has been turned down by EK and his posts are a lame attempt at revenge.

put the cheese balls away and go back to watching cartoons while the world passes you by.

Well that sums it up nicely...
Indeed : for the moment there is nothing you can do. Hmm on second thought: I refuse to SE taxi on old equipment, I streamline my roster with the odd (even) days SK and I refuse to do the company any favours.

I will put my mounting frustration on pprune, and although I do not share the same DEC experience as mentioned above, a do admit the holes are aligning... it was soo close in MEL.
Will they learn anything? No. Instead more leashes are on the way. Because you and I know that we turn back the time by >200 years the moment we leave the Mediterranean Sea behind us and fly SE to Desdi....

Concentrate on the family, it's the only thing they cannot take away from you.

I have worked for a number of airlines in my career. Some I felt considerable loyalty towards. As an employee I felt valued. I wanted the airline to succeed.

With the airlines in the Gulf it's different. I take my money and do a decent job, but I feel absolutely no loyalty. I know they can sc**w you as soon as look at you and probably will given half a chance. The only way to get any employment protection is to work for them in somewhere like Europe with a European employment contract.

Bottom line is, if they offer you a job and that's all there is, then fine. But if there's something equal or better somewhere else then go for it.

C'mon girls. Look back 10 years or so and did you say to yourself, Gee, I really want to work in the M.E. for Emirates.....We are all here because (insert the reason). Ask your friends if they plan to stay here for a 25 year career. Failed carriers, furloughs (redundacies), loss of pensions, politically unstable countries, zero upgrade opportunities, etc. Not to defend the inane polices coming from the perfumed princes, but anyone want to name an airline that isn't FUBAR in some way or another and that includes FedEx, Delta, BA, AirFrance, KAL, SQ and any carrier in the ME. Find a United pilot and ask him how he is enjoying his little job. Sure those others have union protection, but the polices coming from their perfumed princes can be as F.U. as it is here. They just have a "legal" recourse. And sure they don't have the wonderful opportunity to live here in this man made "paradise". And that, EK has no control over (basings? Yeah right). I'm serious, please name me one management team (take a look at Southwest's web boards, they ain't happy either) that really cares about the well being of its pilots and employees.

So just suck it up, help a guy out if he needs a trade for an extra day of leave, help the DEC out who has no idea what a FIR boundary is, set an example for the cabin crew somehow, enjoy your time off with the kids......There is a lot to do to mitigate the miserable policies that land on us. Just do your best and when the world economy turns, there will be jobs to head to. I would leave this place in a minute, if there were an equal opportunity almost anywhere. Take a look at who's hiring and tell me it's better there, please.

Now now Far-rider did you NOT read the title of the thread:ugh:...THIS IS NOT A WINDUP. Let it go!!!! There are guys/gals posting on here that have very valid points regardless of what YOU think. Professional pilots with a wealth of knowledge & experience have joined this operation(EK) in the belief that hard work & sacrifice will pay-off (old-world ethics:)) What is so wrong about that!!!!

far rider
 

Far rider

Your nick says it all.You ride far... but from truth.

Why does everybody who says something bad about EK everybody feels he/she has been rejected from the company ? I can admit it's not the best place to work but definitely not the worst. We here to do a job and maybe when things come up better for us in another part of the world or back home, it's pack the bags but for now nod and smile....

Got to agree with you Bin Liner - most of the DECs that I flew with were charming gents, polite, personable and capable (and the one or two that were NOT capable were still amiable and good company). The problem was the change in policy to start taking DECs when it happened.. If you join now - or indeed within the last 5 years or so YOU KNOW about the DEC policy:D So don't whine about it!!

As another poster said - just continue to do our job professionally. The pendulum will swing the other way again to our favour..

White knight
 

About the DEC's, please tell the whole story.
I have no problem having DECs joining when there are no suitable FO's. Well we all know since more than a year everyone is waiting >3 years and there are no accellerated slots. But in the mean time the a**h*l*s in the B*llsh*t castle continue to recruit DECs. Now don't tell me to follow the f8ckng company koran when EK is not following it themselves!!!

Indeed a mistake coming here, but who could have predicted the crap they came up with IN 2009. :yuk:

what is different in 2009? its been a down hill slide for alot longer than just 2009 and make no mistake 2010 is not going to be any better, I'm guessing 2011 (at the time) might see a bit of a change for the better based on 2010 conditons

I have been a vocal critic of the DEC policy but anyone now affected by it, should have known better. So to fast forward, anyone applying to EK should consider the negative affect that the DEC policy will have on their career. Aside from the countless alterations to our T&C's, which are always negative, the DEC policy should be a deal breaker for many pilots thinking of coming here.

Many policy changes are just annoying. But things like the max 5 days off, 12 max off in a month, OT only after 92 hours and the DEC policy are things that go beyond annoying. It does not matter how tolerant, keen, and thankful you are to have a relatively secure job flying great equipment, these policies will wear you down over time.

This is pure conjecture on my part, but in light of the worldwide economic crisis, (which blows SARS or 9/11 out of the water wrt their affects on EK) and the fact that most aircraft are leased, wouldn't it stand to reason that some aircraft will be returned to the Leasors in the near future?

For those in the hold pool, it is probably wise to consider the possibility of a stagnation in fleet size for the next period of time too. Yes we have a ****load of triple 7's coming, if that schedule is followed, but there is no guarantee that EK will keep all its present aircraft.


In other words, career progression will slow at EK, until two things happen. The economic crisis goes away and concurrently, pilots start leaving EK at the same rate as a couple of years ago. You might think this will be a good thing for F/O's already at the company, but EK will simply start hiring more DEC's to fill the slots that should be available to F/O's.

Since EK is hiring DEC's now, at a time when there is every reason not to hire DEC's, then when the supply and demand cycle reverses (hopefully), EK will hire DEC's even faster. This policy is engrained in EK now, in spite of the fact it contravenes the FOM. BEWARE is all I'm saying.

5* - I agree wholeheartedly that they should not employ DECs when good F/Os are here and ready to upgrade... I'm just telling you all that the DECs themselves ARE NOT the guys to aim your sniping at... Go bitch to the horse..