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Going from EK widebody Capt to LCC in Europe. Opinions?

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

Going from EK widebody Capt to LCC in Europe. Opinions?

Old 19th Mar 2018, 12:33
  #21 (permalink)  
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Thanks guys for the input, for sure I won't really know until I experience it. The one thing I am sure is that it is hard to keep doing this job in EK so I need a change.....Cheers
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 16:27
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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The good contracts in easyJet are on the continent, not in the UK, in terms of net pay.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 16:47
  #23 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
 
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Originally Posted by NineInchSnail View Post
Thanks guys for the input, for sure I won't really know until I experience it. The one thing I am sure is that it is hard to keep doing this job in EK so I need a change.....Cheers
Check your PM
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 17:04
  #24 (permalink)  
box
 
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Go to Germany, France or Italy and the pay is quite decent. Consider Italy, if you have kids. Very good parental part time rules
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 17:16
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NineInchSnail View Post
Thanks guys for the input, for sure I won't really know until I experience it. The one thing I am sure is that it is hard to keep doing this job in EK so I need a change.....Cheers
Same same...and Amen!
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 23:35
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by midnight cruiser View Post
Well, the UK net pay is good if you're already type rated, but very poor if not.
Compared to the eurocontracts itís bad with or without rating.
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Old 21st Mar 2018, 00:38
  #27 (permalink)  
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Some things to consider.....
Picked up and dropped off vs driving round a car park looking for a spot(summer or winter)and waiting for a bus/walking to the crew room

Being handed a menu and asked what you want to eat vs being given a brown bag with a mars bar and sandwich in it/running to boots for the meal deal.

Ironing shirts vs being given a freshly laundered shirt

First class suit on staff travel vs an economy seat

Working 5 days on the trot vs 1 out, 1 back with a day off in between

The choice of whatever is in the first class galley vs a tea or coffee(Nescafťís brown dirt with sort of warm water)

All Iím saying is low cost short haul is a different beast to EK life. If you havenít experienced it before it will be a shock. If youíve done it before then you know what youíre getting.
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Old 21st Mar 2018, 12:14
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by PPPPPP View Post
Some things to consider.....
Picked up and dropped off vs driving round a car park looking for a spot(summer or winter)and waiting for a bus/walking to the crew room

Being handed a menu and asked what you want to eat vs being given a brown bag with a mars bar and sandwich in it/running to boots for the meal deal.

Ironing shirts vs being given a freshly laundered shirt

First class suit on staff travel vs an economy seat

Working 5 days on the trot vs 1 out, 1 back with a day off in between

The choice of whatever is in the first class galley vs a tea or coffee(Nescafťís brown dirt with sort of warm water)

All Iím saying is low cost short haul is a different beast to EK life. If you havenít experienced it before it will be a shock. If youíve done it before then you know what youíre getting.
1. Picked up and dropped off vs driving round a car park looking for a spot(summer or winter)and waiting for a bus/walking to the crew room - I rather drive myself than have to babysit an under qualified stink ball while he tries to kill me.
2. Being handed a menu and asked what you want to eat vs being given a brown bag with a mars bar and sandwich in it/running to boots for the meal deal. - The quality of food, even in F is poor and indigestion inducing to say the least. The reality of which is actually trying to pry any leftovers out of less than helpful Crew. Give me the meal deal any day.
3. Ironing shirts vs being given a freshly laundered shirt - I'd rather take the 3 minutes it takes to iron one myself in front of Richard and Judy than stand in a queue at 8 am for 5 minutes when I've been up all night, all for the privilege of wearing a polyester Chinese special.
4. First class suit on staff travel vs an economy seat - Travel is highly over rated on ones days off.
5. Working 5 days on the trot vs 1 out, 1 back with a day off in between - Reality of which is 2 night flights and an attempted sleep in a hotel on the back of a clock, against 5 local nights in your own bed with a squidgy warm wife.
6. The choice of whatever is in the first class galley vs a tea or coffee(Nescafťís brown dirt with sort of warm water) - Have you tried that Sri Lankan stuff they serve on board? I'd still rather make my own lukewarm beverage choices.

It appears all the above is still blinding people to the reality of a very carefully polished T**d.
Oh the green green grass of home.......
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Old 21st Mar 2018, 14:07
  #29 (permalink)  
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Nedul

Has a good point re Gatwick staff carparks.

When I was based at LGW I was in Carpark H which was next to Hilton and a few minutes walk to company office.

Always felt sorry for those parked miles away that needed a bus to/from in middle of night.

Plus driving to LGW can be a nightmare now depending on time of day.
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Old 21st Mar 2018, 14:31
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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Nedul

Serious question for perspective. Do you commute? I assume you do based on how you answered question four.

Harry
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Old 21st Mar 2018, 14:36
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by harry the cod View Post
Nedul

Serious question for perspective. Do you commute? I assume you do based on how you answered question four.

Harry
Not possible at EK.......Not if you want more than 4 days off a month......
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Old 21st Mar 2018, 15:59
  #32 (permalink)  
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I know I shouldnít take the bait, but why not.

That felt like a fairly aggressive response.

I choose to see the positives in life. I like the car service they provide. I like having my laundry done for me. I like the food onboard. I always find the cabin crew to really nice and generous with food and drink. The staff travel perks are good and Iíve never had a problem with availability.

If you look at the world in the hope of finding negatives you will only find negatives. A driver who is trying to kill you vs the reality of accident statistics. ĎLess than helpfulí crew against the friendliness I come across. Spending 3 mins per shirt ironing them yourself against the (usually less than) 5 mins to pick up 4 shirts and a pair of trousers(you do the math).
Working 5 consecutive days of 6am to 2pm or a trip to cape town to eat a steak and drink a glass of wine(not all flights are night turn arounds).

If you look for the bad, you will find bad. If you place your expectations at a place where they will never be met you will always be disappointed.

For me Iím picked up by a friendly chap in a new bmw. I drop my laundry off 20yards from check in. Iíll fly over to somewhere nice for a day. On the way the cabin crew will make me a nice salad, and some minty green tea. On the way home Iíll pick up the laundry and be driven home.

Life is nice. Itís all about how you choose to see it.
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Old 21st Mar 2018, 19:18
  #33 (permalink)  

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If you are going from wide-body, you simply have to lose weight.
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Old 21st Mar 2018, 20:00
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by PPPPPP View Post
I know I shouldn’t take the bait, but why not.

That felt like a fairly aggressive response.

I choose to see the positives in life. I like the car service they provide. I like having my laundry done for me. I like the food onboard. I always find the cabin crew to really nice and generous with food and drink. The staff travel perks are good and I’ve never had a problem with availability.

If you look at the world in the hope of finding negatives you will only find negatives. A driver who is trying to kill you vs the reality of accident statistics. ‘Less than helpful’ crew against the friendliness I come across. Spending 3 mins per shirt ironing them yourself against the (usually less than) 5 mins to pick up 4 shirts and a pair of trousers(you do the math).
Working 5 consecutive days of 6am to 2pm or a trip to cape town to eat a steak and drink a glass of wine(not all flights are night turn arounds).

If you look for the bad, you will find bad. If you place your expectations at a place where they will never be met you will always be disappointed.

For me I’m picked up by a friendly chap in a new bmw. I drop my laundry off 20yards from check in. I’ll fly over to somewhere nice for a day. On the way the cabin crew will make me a nice salad, and some minty green tea. On the way home I’ll pick up the laundry and be driven home.

Life is nice. It’s all about how you choose to see it.
And the Costa Coffee tastes really nice in the Atrium between 0800 and 1500 doesn't it PPPPP?

Originally Posted by PPPPPP View Post
My rosters are always great, get what I ask for.
Keep the comments coming - you provide great amusement. I always loved 'The Muppets.' Glad to see they're still around.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 07:20
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Nedul

Being picked up and dropped off door to door in a new BMW is an incredible benefit that no other airline offers afaik.

For you to describe this as "having to babysit an under qualified stink ball who's trying to kill you" is disgusting on so many levels, let alone completely inaccurate. Almost exclusively friendly, professional and clean....

Laundry is also another incredible benefit that makes working life easier. You seem to think that washing and ironing your entire uniform at home is quicker than spending 2 minutes in a line for Laundry. How can you ever be happy in the face of such logic?

Without fail, the guys with this attitude are horrific pilots, and ironically have to be babysat in the flight deck or the sim by the unfortunate soul that has to listen to their bs ranting. The same ones who shout at the crew over their cappuccino not being made to their taste, and then complain that no one came to visit them in the flight deck.

You are making everyone's life around you miserable. Please leave.

Edit: I would love to see these types work a summer at EZY. Getting up at 3am is hard, but 5 days in a row is soul destroying (and for your squidgy wife) - only to then have to iron your shirt, deice the car, drive around their car park, catch a bus, buy your boots sandwich, print your flight plans, eat their horrendous crew meals, drink their instant coffee, and yes get on your hands and knees to clean up the cabin in between each of your four daily sectors. It will be a humbling experience. Whilst your yearly hours might be ~750-800, your duty hours are >1200.

At EK you are put on a pedestal at work. This leads to current princess attitudes. I assure you, the EZY cabin crew will eat you alive.

Other reality checks: NHS vs EK clinic, sitting in economy between Sharon and Tracy for your November leave to Malaga, standing at the front of the cabin to make a PA, numerous >hour long slots, warming up a freezing aircraft, 25 min turns - rushing and stressing to keep to schedule throughout the day, only to wait 4 hours for an engineer to drive to the outstation to sign a tech log entry, and then 20 mins for stairs to get attached after landing etc etc.

Whilst EK has its problems, and we're all working too hard at the moment, I'm not so delusional to give it up for a Euro LCC. I can only imagine that you have never experienced it before, and have developed a romantic notion of 'manual flying, living in Europe, and sleeping in your own bed every night'.

Last edited by Xulu; 22nd Mar 2018 at 07:52.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 11:22
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Xulu View Post
Nedul

Being picked up and dropped off door to door in a new BMW is an incredible benefit that no other airline offers afaik.

For you to describe this as "having to babysit an under qualified stink ball who's trying to kill you" is disgusting on so many levels, let alone completely inaccurate. Almost exclusively friendly, professional and clean....

Laundry is also another incredible benefit that makes working life easier. You seem to think that washing and ironing your entire uniform at home is quicker than spending 2 minutes in a line for Laundry. How can you ever be happy in the face of such logic?

Without fail, the guys with this attitude are horrific pilots, and ironically have to be babysat in the flight deck or the sim by the unfortunate soul that has to listen to their bs ranting. The same ones who shout at the crew over their cappuccino not being made to their taste, and then complain that no one came to visit them in the flight deck.

You are making everyone's life around you miserable. Please leave.

Edit: I would love to see these types work a summer at EZY. Getting up at 3am is hard, but 5 days in a row is soul destroying (and for your squidgy wife) - only to then have to iron your shirt, deice the car, drive around their car park, catch a bus, buy your boots sandwich, print your flight plans, eat their horrendous crew meals, drink their instant coffee, and yes get on your hands and knees to clean up the cabin in between each of your four daily sectors. It will be a humbling experience. Whilst your yearly hours might be ~750-800, your duty hours are >1200.

At EK you are put on a pedestal at work. This leads to current princess attitudes. I assure you, the EZY cabin crew will eat you alive.

Other reality checks: NHS vs EK clinic, sitting in economy between Sharon and Tracy for your November leave to Malaga, standing at the front of the cabin to make a PA, numerous >hour long slots, warming up a freezing aircraft, 25 min turns - rushing and stressing to keep to schedule throughout the day, only to wait 4 hours for an engineer to drive to the outstation to sign a tech log entry, and then 20 mins for stairs to get attached after landing etc etc.

Whilst EK has its problems, and we're all working too hard at the moment, I'm not so delusional to give it up for a Euro LCC. I can only imagine that you have never experienced it before, and have developed a romantic notion of 'manual flying, living in Europe, and sleeping in your own bed every night'.
I retract the derogatory remark about the drivers (knew I would have to when I wrote it). I still stand by the fact I would rather drive myself both from a freedom of movement and safety aspect.
The thread is EU Lcc v ME and I felt the arguments from PPPPP were weak from my point of view.....it is after all Ďhorses for coursesí. So I responded.
There was no need to get personal, I did not! Although you felt my counter arguments were course to invent some kind of Ďranting unprofessional stereotypical life hating Captainí
who takes his problems to work. I do not, just because the onboard tea tastes bad, doesnít mean I upset my colleagues by telling them so....or the driver that is falling asleep on the SMBZR....I politely keep him, and myself, awake so we can get home in 1 piece.
I could go on.....
By the way, I have 12yrs experience working for an EU lcc and donít drink coffee........
Next time I wonít counter anyone elseís opinion and just let things slide.
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Old 22nd Mar 2018, 12:58
  #37 (permalink)  
 
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xulu and ppppp

How long have you 2 been at EK? I ask, because from the few posts I've read on EK it seems that most of the negativity comes from those that have been there for longer than 5 years. The positive posts are few and far between but seems to be more from guys n gals in their first few years there, I could be wrong, hence my post.

I'm really not intending to stir anything, I have some serious decisions to make and would love to put your take on the company into perspective.
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Old 23rd Mar 2018, 06:34
  #38 (permalink)  
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Been here a while, and still enjoying it.

While Iíll be shouted down for this, the view you get from PPRuNe is a distilled and somewhat extreme view. The majority of people I fly with are happy.

If youíre thinking of joining EK then come to Dubai on holiday. If you like Dubai, then youíll like working here.

For what itís worth for this thread.
Last job would be 9 days off and 21 working.
April is 14 days not working. 3 daytime turnarounds, 4 layovers. About 84hrs, 30 of which are taken up with the ULR. Easy.
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Old 23rd Mar 2018, 10:35
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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PPPPPP,

What you say is just not true...

Most of the pilot at EK don't get so many days off and they don't even get the 42 days of annual leave that their are entitle to so !!!!

How much are you paid to fool the potential pilot to join EK ?
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Old 23rd Mar 2018, 18:04
  #40 (permalink)  
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Dubaigong, what I said in my last post was accurate.

I get paid the same as everyone else.

As for leave, I think Iíve still got 11 days outstanding for next year that Iíve not used yet. Used all the days from last year. There is a point that Iíll happily concede. We donít have kids so all leave for us is ďcan I have a week in XXXXX month at some point? Donít really care whenĒ. If youíve got kids and want time off to match school holidays itís a lot harder.
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