EK207 Jfk
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: uae
Posts: 2,777
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Infreedom I think you need to check the details . Unfortunately rosters and rostering is legal . As it has been pointed out EK operate in accordance with gcaa ftl’s which are approved by CAA’s they operate into .
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: not in Dubai anymore
Age: 94
Posts: 713
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
They are also illegal on several levels:
- at company level for reporting false check-in times. Do you think they changed the India nightturns into layovers for nothing after the WSJ article? Try fitting 544/545 etc into the regulations even with the new check in times (not saying they reflect the truth). That's a simple example.
- at company level for the farce of a Fatigue Management system. Try your rosters with a standard Western ruleset for Fatigue Management. At DHL they couldn't believe the difference that made on top of legal requirements.
- at company level for bullying Captains into discretion as a default
- at GCAA level for covering up the false check-in times
- at GCAA level for granting all the Annex exceptions
- at GCAA level for factoring the Augmenting Hours
- at GCAA level for disclosing confidential crew reports to the employer
- at Aeromedical level for following Employer wishes versus independent medical judgment
...
All of that is violating quite a few laws.
- at company level for reporting false check-in times. Do you think they changed the India nightturns into layovers for nothing after the WSJ article? Try fitting 544/545 etc into the regulations even with the new check in times (not saying they reflect the truth). That's a simple example.
- at company level for the farce of a Fatigue Management system. Try your rosters with a standard Western ruleset for Fatigue Management. At DHL they couldn't believe the difference that made on top of legal requirements.
- at company level for bullying Captains into discretion as a default
- at GCAA level for covering up the false check-in times
- at GCAA level for granting all the Annex exceptions
- at GCAA level for factoring the Augmenting Hours
- at GCAA level for disclosing confidential crew reports to the employer
- at Aeromedical level for following Employer wishes versus independent medical judgment
...
All of that is violating quite a few laws.
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: free Europe
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Where EK deviates from what's written, the company breaks the rules.
As far as the GCAA goes, they didn't disclose those practices before they received FAA IASA approval as a Class 1 country in 2003.
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: uae
Posts: 2,777
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mate you are so far off the mark !
You have stated nil factual data and I will add FAA was here doing an audit long after 2003 . 2003 was the initial approval to operat the 345 to jfk .
You have stated nil factual data and I will add FAA was here doing an audit long after 2003 . 2003 was the initial approval to operat the 345 to jfk .
Last edited by fatbus; 8th Jan 2018 at 01:56.
Ok I'll bite.
But what about when the head of one and the head of the other are the same guy??
Isn't that a massive conflict of interest anywhere else?
Yet most regulators don't $eem to have any problem$ with it. But maybe I'm just a cynic...
But what about when the head of one and the head of the other are the same guy??
Isn't that a massive conflict of interest anywhere else?
Yet most regulators don't $eem to have any problem$ with it. But maybe I'm just a cynic...
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: free Europe
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There's a big difference between not getting caught versus acting legally. That's true for both the company and the GCAA.
On the topic of independent supervision: HH is a Board Member of the GCAA and Director of the Dubai CAA. That's like the CEO of Delta being the Head of the Georgia Aviation Authority and sitting on the Board of the FAA. If you read the ICAO and IASA rules around that you will find that it's not illegal but seen as a big concern.
On the topic of independent supervision: HH is a Board Member of the GCAA and Director of the Dubai CAA. That's like the CEO of Delta being the Head of the Georgia Aviation Authority and sitting on the Board of the FAA. If you read the ICAO and IASA rules around that you will find that it's not illegal but seen as a big concern.
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Austria
Posts: 348
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
and you believe an audit will show all the problems? Especially at an Airline which is specialised in spinning and hiding the truth!?
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: free Europe
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The FAA IASA rules come in the following hierarchy:
IASA
--ICAO Doc. 9734
----Inspector Checklists
Take a closer look at ICAO Doc. 9734:
2.3.4.2 State responsibility
2.3.5 Operator responsibility
2.4.6 & 2.4.7 combined responsibility
2.4.9 SEPARATION requirement if State is both Regulatory Authority and Air Operator
3.2.2, 3.2.3, 3.2.5 State Legislation
3.3.5.1 Air Operator Surveillance
3.4.2.4 again reference to separation requirement for State Oversight
3.4.2.6 State Inspections
3.5.1.4 Independence of Medical Staff
3.7.3.2, 3.7.3.3 c) Supervision of Flight Ops
3.7.3.9 Commencement of Service
3.8 Surveillance Obligations
3.9 Resolution of Safety Concerns
All good in the 'hood? I don't think so.
IASA
--ICAO Doc. 9734
----Inspector Checklists
Take a closer look at ICAO Doc. 9734:
2.3.4.2 State responsibility
2.3.5 Operator responsibility
2.4.6 & 2.4.7 combined responsibility
2.4.9 SEPARATION requirement if State is both Regulatory Authority and Air Operator
3.2.2, 3.2.3, 3.2.5 State Legislation
3.3.5.1 Air Operator Surveillance
3.4.2.4 again reference to separation requirement for State Oversight
3.4.2.6 State Inspections
3.5.1.4 Independence of Medical Staff
3.7.3.2, 3.7.3.3 c) Supervision of Flight Ops
3.7.3.9 Commencement of Service
3.8 Surveillance Obligations
3.9 Resolution of Safety Concerns
All good in the 'hood? I don't think so.
Would that mean the requirement to have sickness verified by a company doctor rather than any licensed doctor is illegal then?
In most countries the sick note us accepted so long as it is written by a licensed registered doctor.
In most countries the sick note us accepted so long as it is written by a licensed registered doctor.
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Posts: 5,898
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Is the final warning letter basically 'double secret probation' while you look for another job?
Are the crewmembers being punished for making a mistake or for not responding more quickly to the controller's low altitude alert?
Are the crewmembers being punished for making a mistake or for not responding more quickly to the controller's low altitude alert?
FW letter also means loss of perks like no profit share, (like it mattered the last few years lol) and in some cases they may restrict or remove staff travel, it depends on the position of the employee and in some cases their manager but in general it means one more fcukup or you piss off the wrong person and you are donezo.
IIRC minimum one year but I seem to recall some had them for two. Suppose it depends on what the warning was for.
IIRC minimum one year but I seem to recall some had them for two. Suppose it depends on what the warning was for.
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Earth, where else?
Posts: 229
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Miami
Age: 59
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Midlands
Posts: 161
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Right on the other side of Manhattan across the Hudson is a very easy approach at Newark. Yet some airlines choose not to go there. If JFK is deemed dangerous why doesn’t the airline just fly into Newark instead. If they choose to fly to JFK they should prepare their pilots properly.
The pilots of most airlines don’t find JFK a big issue as they have the confidence to do what is necessary within the bounds of the safety margins without worrying about getting fired for minor issues. Unless you’ve been a skipper of a certain operator discussed on these forums you can’t appreciate how fear of punishment affects decision making, no matter how experienced or thick-skinned the pilot is.
