Fake Log book Hours Blacklist
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[QUOTE=GillEx737;10002368]Wow ironbutt you're just desperate to share this news
They are sometimes difficult to spot. My company checks log books very carefully, but it appears even then they can get through. We had one pilot who got through the training system who was very full of himself, regaling everyone with tlaes of his experience - he seemed to have done a lot considering he was so young. But his ability didn't match his claims. I wasn't even happy with his taxiing! Eventually, he failed a recurrent sim once too often - and is now flying for one of our competitors. The problem is that although we suspected him of falsifying hours, it's very hard to prove without corroboration from aircraft logbooks etc.
But if someone does come across proof of a fraud, it's beholden of them to report. Ernest Gann in 'Fate is the Hunter' recounts a pilot who in many pilot's opinion was a fraud. When he subsequently crashed an aircraft in another company killing himself and all on board, Gann felt remorse for not 'outing' him at the time. These people are defrauding the majority of honest pilots, and put their passengers at risk. I would have no hesitation in shopping a fake pilot if I had proof.
And sometimes the truth is easy to find. This guy https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/51...is-flying-high falsified a RAF career including a fully signed up logbook. His fall came when applying for a command, one of the managers was surprised on checking his RAF logbook to see entries claiming to be on a Squadron that the manager was on at the time. But the manager couldn't remember him! Amazingly, he's back flying. If it were down to me, he would be barred from holding a licence due to a lack of integrity.
But if someone does come across proof of a fraud, it's beholden of them to report. Ernest Gann in 'Fate is the Hunter' recounts a pilot who in many pilot's opinion was a fraud. When he subsequently crashed an aircraft in another company killing himself and all on board, Gann felt remorse for not 'outing' him at the time. These people are defrauding the majority of honest pilots, and put their passengers at risk. I would have no hesitation in shopping a fake pilot if I had proof.
And sometimes the truth is easy to find. This guy https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/51...is-flying-high falsified a RAF career including a fully signed up logbook. His fall came when applying for a command, one of the managers was surprised on checking his RAF logbook to see entries claiming to be on a Squadron that the manager was on at the time. But the manager couldn't remember him! Amazingly, he's back flying. If it were down to me, he would be barred from holding a licence due to a lack of integrity.
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And sometimes the truth is easy to find. This guy https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/51...is-flying-high falsified a RAF career including a fully signed up logbook. His fall came when applying for a command, one of the managers was surprised on checking his RAF logbook to see entries claiming to be on a Squadron that the manager was on at the time. But the manager couldn't remember him! Amazingly, he's back flying. If it were down to me, he would be barred from holding a licence due to a lack of integrity.
SG is still flying high with Jet2
Sadly, the "parker pen hours" phenomenon has been around since time immemorial . One good thing about the military background was that it was somewhat difficult to fake these things .
Apart from the fact that , on fast jets you did relatively little flying each month, (and so easy to check errors), on each of those months you filled in a total summary that was verified and signed by the squadron boss and every three months (as I recall) , it went to the base commanders office for his stamp and signature. Of course, the minions did the verification but it would be a brave chap who risked his career/neck to help out a comrade .
A military logbook could be relied on.
Sadly, I could not report the same degree of rigour once I transitioned to civil flying . I continued the old habit of monthly summary, and each year went along to the fleet office with my logbook. The nice lady put a rubber stamp on it and, if you were lucky and he was around, got the fleet captain to put his thumbprint on it. Nobody actually checked the hours I had written in.
Later on, the computerised system came in and you could get a print out to present to your next employer. The best companies demanded it , but many less enlightened outfits did not , so some "Walter Mitty" types were able to sneak in under false pretences and go on to build up legitimate hours.
The good thing is that most of these characters ( and there have been quite a few) are eventually found out . Aviation is indeed a small world , and the system will eventually weed them out, thank goodness. Most of us have seen the movie-"Catch me if you can" ; the con artists are out there , but the old adage stands--"Truth will out".
In the cockpit, when it comes down to the professional stuff, you can't hide things from your colleagues ; and then the word slowly gets around.....
Apart from the fact that , on fast jets you did relatively little flying each month, (and so easy to check errors), on each of those months you filled in a total summary that was verified and signed by the squadron boss and every three months (as I recall) , it went to the base commanders office for his stamp and signature. Of course, the minions did the verification but it would be a brave chap who risked his career/neck to help out a comrade .
A military logbook could be relied on.
Sadly, I could not report the same degree of rigour once I transitioned to civil flying . I continued the old habit of monthly summary, and each year went along to the fleet office with my logbook. The nice lady put a rubber stamp on it and, if you were lucky and he was around, got the fleet captain to put his thumbprint on it. Nobody actually checked the hours I had written in.
Later on, the computerised system came in and you could get a print out to present to your next employer. The best companies demanded it , but many less enlightened outfits did not , so some "Walter Mitty" types were able to sneak in under false pretences and go on to build up legitimate hours.
The good thing is that most of these characters ( and there have been quite a few) are eventually found out . Aviation is indeed a small world , and the system will eventually weed them out, thank goodness. Most of us have seen the movie-"Catch me if you can" ; the con artists are out there , but the old adage stands--"Truth will out".
In the cockpit, when it comes down to the professional stuff, you can't hide things from your colleagues ; and then the word slowly gets around.....
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Sadly, the "parker pen hours" phenomenon has been around since time immemorial . One good thing about the military background was that it was somewhat difficult to fake these things .
Apart from the fact that , on fast jets you did relatively little flying each month, (and so easy to check errors), on each of those months you filled in a total summary that was verified and signed by the squadron boss and every three months (as I recall) , it went to the base commanders office for his stamp and signature. Of course, the minions did the verification but it would be a brave chap who risked his career/neck to help out a comrade .
A military logbook could be relied on.
Sadly, I could not report the same degree of rigour once I transitioned to civil flying . I continued the old habit of monthly summary, and each year went along to the fleet office with my logbook. The nice lady put a rubber stamp on it and, if you were lucky and he was around, got the fleet captain to put his thumbprint on it. Nobody actually checked the hours I had written in.
Later on, the computerised system came in and you could get a print out to present to your next employer. The best companies demanded it , but many less enlightened outfits did not , so some "Walter Mitty" types were able to sneak in under false pretences and go on to build up legitimate hours.
The good thing is that most of these characters ( and there have been quite a few) are eventually found out . Aviation is indeed a small world , and the system will eventually weed them out, thank goodness. Most of us have seen the movie-"Catch me if you can" ; the con artists are out there , but the old adage stands--"Truth will out".
In the cockpit, when it comes down to the professional stuff, you can't hide things from your colleagues ; and then the word slowly gets around.....
Apart from the fact that , on fast jets you did relatively little flying each month, (and so easy to check errors), on each of those months you filled in a total summary that was verified and signed by the squadron boss and every three months (as I recall) , it went to the base commanders office for his stamp and signature. Of course, the minions did the verification but it would be a brave chap who risked his career/neck to help out a comrade .
A military logbook could be relied on.
Sadly, I could not report the same degree of rigour once I transitioned to civil flying . I continued the old habit of monthly summary, and each year went along to the fleet office with my logbook. The nice lady put a rubber stamp on it and, if you were lucky and he was around, got the fleet captain to put his thumbprint on it. Nobody actually checked the hours I had written in.
Later on, the computerised system came in and you could get a print out to present to your next employer. The best companies demanded it , but many less enlightened outfits did not , so some "Walter Mitty" types were able to sneak in under false pretences and go on to build up legitimate hours.
The good thing is that most of these characters ( and there have been quite a few) are eventually found out . Aviation is indeed a small world , and the system will eventually weed them out, thank goodness. Most of us have seen the movie-"Catch me if you can" ; the con artists are out there , but the old adage stands--"Truth will out".
In the cockpit, when it comes down to the professional stuff, you can't hide things from your colleagues ; and then the word slowly gets around.....
He became magically Captain after a change of EASA licence from one country to another passing to a nord African ( Mediterranean) Company were he left as copilot and arrived in the new Company as very experienced 👩*✈️ Captain
As you said , eventually they get cought for a reason or another
Happy new year Folks
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For what it's worth, within the period of the last 15 months, I had to fire two Captains (both holding EASA licences, issued by Germany & France, respectively), wherein both were downright bloody dangerous and very evidently never previously in the LHS (i.e. fakers), though the really worrying bit is "where are they now?!".
Imho, there's something very wrong with the recruitment selection & vetting process (and also with initial OCC sim) that such people keep slipping through the net and are only being appropriately questioned (and caught out) when they're into the Line Training (which is when both of the ones that I'm referring to got binned).... but they're still out there, somewhere?!
Imho, there's something very wrong with the recruitment selection & vetting process (and also with initial OCC sim) that such people keep slipping through the net and are only being appropriately questioned (and caught out) when they're into the Line Training (which is when both of the ones that I'm referring to got binned).... but they're still out there, somewhere?!
