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EK Website has DEC 330

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EK Website has DEC 330

Old 20th Feb 2015, 07:17
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: is a point of view
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EK Website has DEC 330

Removed after reflection and concluded lack of interest.

Pointer

Last edited by Pointer; 22nd Feb 2015 at 08:59.
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 07:32
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
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They were not lying. "foreseeable future" in the airline industry is about a week.
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 10:06
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: charleroi
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Are you going to hire any DEC's in the foreseeable future? Answer: No!
You wouldn't have known this but the first time an EK manager announced there would be no more DECs was back in 1997 or thereabouts. The then HFO GJ said he would be EKs last DEC. Since then the 'last DEC' has turned up at least half a dozen times.

What you should have picked up on is that anything said here is only true until the start of the next working day or lunchtime if it's said in the morning.


Here's a quote from TCAS made back in 2009:

Emirates will not relax its strict rule that, no matter how many flying hours a recruit has notched up, everyone joining the flightdeck does so as a first officer.
The whole article is here: Middle East supplement: Emirates back in the hunt soon - 4/17/2009 - Flight Global
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 10:31
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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Montencee you conveniently left the fact he also went on to say


"We never rule these things out, but we don't anticipate taking anyone on directly as a captain," says Stealey. However, promotion to captain tends to be rapid for candidates with the experience and ability.


At the end of the day its a business solution, ground hundred of millions of dollars worth of aircraft or piss off a few staff we all know which solution they took.
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 10:55
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Yes, it's lucky I posted the link to the article so you could point that out.
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 11:16
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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Fliion, question.

A while back, there were a number of pilots that received an 'accelerated command'. Did they write an email to the FO's they'd bypassed explaining/apologising for being forced into the situation? No. So then I don't see why EK should write an email on behalf of DEC's that have yet to join the company just to make you feel better.

EK hires DEC's. Fact.

As to the guy that claimed he was told by recruitment, no DEC's in the foreseeable future. The recruiters most likely gave you an honest answer and besides, they usually find out policy about 3 hrs before you do . If you were gullible enough to interpret their words into a meaning that suited you, well what can I say.

Have your rant, it's not going to change anything we don't already know.
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 13:16
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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The same guys claim they were "promised an upgrade in 3 years", you only have to be here a short while and/ or talk to a pilot recruiter to know the truth
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 14:02
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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Guys, I think we are missing the point. Yes ek hires DEC, but the claim they do not want to. Yet it is the total mismanagement that leads to this. With proper planning it could have been averted. Instead, because of incompetence we have perfectly good colleagues who will suffer from this. Emirates is not a good company to work for.
For all those thinking of coming, look to our south first ! You would be crazy not to go there instead of here if you could .
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 20:07
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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An FO should not be having to babysit the Captain as in the case of the last batch of 777/330 DEC's
Cute... And a slightly arrogant comment!
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Old 21st Feb 2015, 03:26
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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Those would be the same FO's failing the upgrade.
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Old 21st Feb 2015, 09:04
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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TWC,

I think they are trying to tactically manage the drawdown of the 330 fleet in the face of reducing recruitment as fewer have been attracted and of those that have, fewer are succeeding. Add that to the loss of Trainers and the situation can quickly become critical and irretrievable. So there will be outsourced training on the cards to try and catch up as they try to find a way to attract more candidates.

We know this will cost a boat load of money and so the penny pinching attitude of the last couple of years will come back to bite them and cost even more money in the long run. Until they break the cycle of short-term gain leading to long-term pain nothing will improve. The company leadership prides itself on flexibility but then fails to notice when flexibility becomes knee-jerking.

The solution in the short term is to allow the talented managers to manage without interference from untrained wannabees. The situation in training apparently went downhill when the last purge happened and the personnel changes have directly led to retention issues. As far as recruitment is concerned, those in the team fully realise the issues but battle with the inertia of the process. Senior leadership want instant results but it takes months to recruit and train new pilots so it must be accepted that the company should have a small reserve of personnel to allow for growth and issues with recruitment. That would also have the added benefit of reducing the pressure on frontline staff. Over time this approach would save money but the short term cost increase would almost certainly lead to the unenlightened dismissing it.

Ultimately though a company stands or falls on its culture and whether or not the employees buy into it. 20 years ago they used to but now that is no longer the case. If this does not change in the longer term the business will be doomed to mediocrity. Emirates is a brilliant brand that now must adapt from exploitation of employees to empowering and trusting them if it is to flourish further. Bullying, fear and ridicule should not be tolerated at any level of the business.
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Old 21st Feb 2015, 10:47
  #32 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
 
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Ek blower what an excellent post!
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Old 21st Feb 2015, 18:07
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Emirates is a brilliant brand that now must adapt from exploitation of employees to empowering and trusting them

Well said EKWB.
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Old 21st Feb 2015, 19:14
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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EK Website has DEC 330

(Removed after reflection and concluded lack of interest, Pointer)


Very true post Ek Blower

(edited to include praise for ekblower)

Last edited by Pointer; 22nd Feb 2015 at 09:03.
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Old 23rd Feb 2015, 17:04
  #35 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
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Dont bother looking south. Its much worse. South is good for a quick command.
However south has the lowest pay in the region and the worst rosters. They hire DECs all the time and on the best fleets. Even the 330 roster in EK is better that 330/340 roster down south(min 8 days off a month mostly and a request system that doesn't work).
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Old 23rd Feb 2015, 19:27
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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Emirates is a brilliant brand that now must adapt from exploitation of employees to empowering and trusting them if it is to flourish further.

I will agree with the rest, an accurate and most dramatic statement about EK as I have ever read.
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Old 23rd Feb 2015, 23:03
  #37 (permalink)  
 
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The thing that will really screw over the A330 F/Os is not the DECs on that fleet. It is the fact that they will then go across to the A380 as Captains while the F/Os who have already suffered for the company bottom line will move across as F/Os (I doubt there will be any more upgrades on the A330 now) and then have to do another 2,500 hours before they can be considered for an upgrade on the A380! This will literally add years to their time in the right hand seat.
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Old 24th Feb 2015, 08:05
  #38 (permalink)  
Kapitanleutnant
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Ask the pointed questions…. you have nothing to lose

1. You advert 42 days vacation, but only give 30?
2. Won't the DEC's you're hiring slow my upgrade time considerably?

etc….

K
 
Old 24th Feb 2015, 09:55
  #39 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
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And ask about forced/allocated leave....
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Old 24th Feb 2015, 13:07
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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...and how the new FTL's will affect rosters, even for 380 crew, and how you will be lucky enough to live in any one of a number of company-provided houses that are smaller and built to far worse standards than the one you'd be leaving to move to Dubai...and how you'll not have that much extra cash at the end of the month because everything is proportionately expensive in relation to your salary...

IMO the next few months are very, very uncertain for EK flight crew, it might be wise to hold off (as nice as the cavalry of new guys would be) to see what the company looks like as an employer once any dust has settled in September or October...
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