How many real flying hours per month at EK

[JammedStab]

I keep hearing 92 but if I understand correctly, this is 92 in the flight deck. How many actual flying hours are you doing including crew rest?

[fatbus]

92 is the OT threshold , most will not go over due to cost to the company. Some pilots do 92 in the seat( by choice) others do 92 not all in the seat ( by choice) . Not many are hitting the 900 (seat limit), but close.

[TransitCheck]

92.5 for me. Scheduled seat time. That doesn't include the 2 lengthy holds that I have had due to fog and more recently due to rain which are not paid as overtime.

[jack schidt]

EK pays parking brake off to parking brake on. Preparation for the flight and post flight duties, groundschool and simulators are not rewarded, they are your gift to the company on a daily basis. Fairly often the brakes off to on is more than the flight plan block time. The pay given is the flight plan block time as a maximum payment, ie if you spend time in the hold and extend over the flight plan time = less pay as per the flightplan time (hrs).

I could go on but......


Jack

[Neptune Spear]

Wait until the Jepp system comes online. It will be far more efficient for the company and the pilots will suffer even more.
The company will schedule us with less layover time by utilizing creative pairing where you don't fly out on the flight you brought in.
A lot more Avilable Days where the company can utilize you more.
The big deal is pilots can now only ask for 5 items in the bid.
Of course they will fully use the Factoring concept. 900 hours? Most pilots will be well above that threshold.
Is there anyone out there that still wants to join this circus?

[SOPS]

I have been doing 92 hours a month for years now, 92.5 this month.

[Al Murdoch]

63.5 hours a month average over the last twelve months. That's logbook time so brakes off to on (and not factored for ULR, so actual flight time).

[SOPS]

Wish I could get your roster!

[halas]

65 hour average for me per month.

halas

[Al Murdoch]

Well I don't know if it has anything to do with the way I bid... But I almost never bid for days off, just the trips I want. And I spend a fair bit of time on the freighter. I'm a 2yr+ FO

[sheikhmahandy]

How many hours?

The short answer is tooooooo many with the mix and timing of flight duties.

I see it in colleagues.

They are past caring about this job and the pax they

carry unfortunately.

If you hit the horse more often to make it work harder, it cares less about the task.

I'm Knackered!!!

[SOPS]

Oh Al, I see, your an FO. I think makes the difference. You guys do seem to have been flying less than captains up to recently.

[The Guru]

JS,

The way it was explained to me was that at EK you get paid a salary, and then a bit more for scheduled block time. Your 92hrs are therefore block hours, and above the 92hrs overtime threshold your hourly flight pay is increased, but your base salary remains constant.

The 92 is the current number set by the company, and has been raised ‘temporarily’ over the company’s history due to operational reasons, and without any consultation with the pilot group. Base salary was not raised resulting in an increase to productivity, only the overtime threshold. To my knowledge it has never been reduced ‘temporarily’. You are invited to bid monthly, and then you are rostered at the company’s discretion for any combination of trips/duties that will bring you up to the maximum of 92hrs.

In a bygone era, all trips/duties were credited towards the company’s quota, and we were paid for them.

Currently however, simulator support duties generate credit, but duties such as your own proficiency simulator, safety and emergency procedures, ground training or online courses and exams are all mandatory but are not included in the 92hrs quota. Company transport will collect you between 2 hours and 2.5 hours before departure, although pre-flight duties before departure and post flight duties 30 minutes after are not part of the quota, nor is any turnaround time.

• You could do 2 x ULR (Ultra Long Range) returns, and 1 x LR (Long Range) return, across multiple time zones and meet the threshold. This would involve typically 24-28hrs crew rest in the bunk, 3 trips to work in company transport, and 3 trips back to the airport from the various hotels.
  
  
• Alternatively you could do 15 x Middle East/India/North Africa turnarounds and remain essentially on DXB local time but still not meet the threshold. This would all be seat time, 15 trips to work in company transport and typically 1.5hrs between each sector during the turnaround.

It varies greatly between the fleets, and the type of roster the company generates, which explains why Al Murdoch has averaged less than SOPS.

There is also a complex factoring process associated with crew rest, but the company makes no distinction between fatigue generated by various time zones, multi-sectors flights or night flights, or a combination of all three factors when they coincide – so essentially all block hours are credited towards the 92 quota equally.

Your question therefore does not have a simple answer, as at EK you need to distinguish between your ‘real flying’ block hours, duty hours, and just the other hours associated with attending, preparing and completing operational duties.

The G

[CATI]

Very detailed explanation, The Guru, thanks.

How many flight duty hours do you have in general per month?

[Desert Camel]

Let's not moan about not being paid for post flight duties, SEP, etc.... After all, we get a salary and as the G said, it has always been very clear that we are getting an extra for scheduled block hours (Flight Pay).


IMHO, what is worth moaning about, for example, is that our FDP starts 1 hour before departure, but we get picked up in general 2 hours 15 minutes before and we are in HQ way before the FDP actually starts....That way, the company can make us fly longer (not to the benefit of our physical well being).

[SOPS]

Now, flight duty hours. Here is an interesting fact. They used to publish our duty hours on our roster, next to our flight hours. And then they removed the duty hours....want to guess why?

[montencee]

Let's not moan about not being paid for post flight duties, SEP, etc.... After all, we get a salary...

There was a time when there was a credit for SEP, CRM, Sim Duties, in fact pretty much everything we did including leave attracted an hourly credit that would sometimes become a payment depending on how much else was done in the month. At that time nothing was paid until 84+ hours of credit was reached and at that point productivity kicked in.

The payment for non-flying duties disappeared around the same time as the first 'cost neutral' salary adjustment but the credit remained in the background so as to build balanced rosters. It wasn't cost neutral but at least what they had done was 'visible' and rosters were still constructed sensibly.

More recently they removed the credit part completely, this was unannounced and remains unannounced. This means that crew can and often will fly a full 92 hour roster and on top of that might spend two days in the simulator and have a day or two of ground school too. Another scheduling favourite is to have 10+ days of leave and still be assigned work close to the 92 hours cap. The 92 flight hours is a target regardless of any other duties.

But let's not moan.

[troff]

59.9 hours/ month average for the last 100+ months.

[SOPS]

You are effectively punished for having leave. You used to have 3 weeks leave and come back and fly maybe 15 to 29 hours for the rest of the month. Now you could find yourself rostered for 40 to 50 hours if not more. It is full stop wrong, but Emirates thinks it's great.

[falconeasydriver]

You are effectively punished for having leave. You used to have 3 weeks leave and come back and fly maybe 15 to 29 hours for the rest of the month. Now you could find yourself rostered for 40 to 50 hours if not more. It is full stop wrong, but Emirates thinks it's great.

A tactical use of "2" is the most effective method of roster management, it's merely our version of a manual insert