EK crewing levels coming home to roost?
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Emirates will recruit around 400 pilots next year – roughly the same as 2014 – as it takes delivery of 16 Airbus A380s and 13 Boeing 777s. Although some A330s, A340s and older 777s will be retired and crews retrained for newer types, the intake will see overall pilot numbers increase by a tenth. With a low annual retirement rate – because its pilots tend to be younger – Emirates’ flightdeck attrition rate is just 2%, says divisional senior vice president of flight operations Capt Alan Stealey.
Despite a blip three years ago when it urgently needed experienced direct-entry captains, the Dubai airline sticks to its policy of only recruiting first officers. While this might mean experienced captains have to return to second-in-command for a while, Stealey insists it is the best way for Emirates to instill the airline’s values in all flightcrew, and ensure opportunities for rising in rank apply equally. “We prefer to promote internally and early,” he says.
This means that all first officers have a chance to apply for captains’ positions after a minium of three years with the carrier, although a four-and-half year wait is typical, says Stealey. Given that Emirates stresses the long-term nature of a career with the airline, this is not an unreasonable period, he suggests. It is also much shorter than most legacy carriers, where stagnant fleet sizes and strict seniority rules mean co-pilots “might have to spend 20 years in the right-hand seat”.
We offer everything a young pilot would want, including flying the latest technology
To apply for a job at Emirates, pilots need at least 4,000 flying hours in total in a commercial aircraft, or 2,500 on either an Airbus or Boeing. Those from a low-cost carrier background – who will fly around 800h a year – often get there fastest, and many applicants come from this sector, says Stealey. For a pilot flying several short-hop sectors a day, the *attraction of intercontinental routes and really seeing the world can be compelling, he adds.
But Emirates also gets applications from much more seasoned pilots. “We had a guy in yesterday with 8,000h of experience,” he says. In fact, Stealey maintains he is seeing a change in the sort of pilots coming to Emirates. For a while crisis-hit US airlines were a happy hunting ground, but now, as the North American market has picked up, Europe’s ailing carriers are providing a stream of recruits, says Stealey. “If you work for an airline that is downsizing, we can offer stability,” he adds.
Despite a blip three years ago when it urgently needed experienced direct-entry captains, the Dubai airline sticks to its policy of only recruiting first officers. While this might mean experienced captains have to return to second-in-command for a while, Stealey insists it is the best way for Emirates to instill the airline’s values in all flightcrew, and ensure opportunities for rising in rank apply equally. “We prefer to promote internally and early,” he says.
This means that all first officers have a chance to apply for captains’ positions after a minium of three years with the carrier, although a four-and-half year wait is typical, says Stealey. Given that Emirates stresses the long-term nature of a career with the airline, this is not an unreasonable period, he suggests. It is also much shorter than most legacy carriers, where stagnant fleet sizes and strict seniority rules mean co-pilots “might have to spend 20 years in the right-hand seat”.
We offer everything a young pilot would want, including flying the latest technology
To apply for a job at Emirates, pilots need at least 4,000 flying hours in total in a commercial aircraft, or 2,500 on either an Airbus or Boeing. Those from a low-cost carrier background – who will fly around 800h a year – often get there fastest, and many applicants come from this sector, says Stealey. For a pilot flying several short-hop sectors a day, the *attraction of intercontinental routes and really seeing the world can be compelling, he adds.
But Emirates also gets applications from much more seasoned pilots. “We had a guy in yesterday with 8,000h of experience,” he says. In fact, Stealey maintains he is seeing a change in the sort of pilots coming to Emirates. For a while crisis-hit US airlines were a happy hunting ground, but now, as the North American market has picked up, Europe’s ailing carriers are providing a stream of recruits, says Stealey. “If you work for an airline that is downsizing, we can offer stability,” he adds.
Last edited by Andy24; 12th Jan 2015 at 16:19. Reason: Today on Flightglobal
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Here is the article with the hidden bits showing
Emirates will recruit around 400 pilots next year – roughly the same as 2014 – as it takes delivery of 16 Airbus A380s and 13 Boeing 777s. Although some A330s, A340s and older 777s will be retired and crews retrained for newer types, the intake will see overall pilot numbers increase by a tenth. With a low annual retirement rate and our norm of overworking pilots to the tune of 92 hours a month– because its pilots tend to be younger – so they won't die as quickly from our abusive scheduling practices, Emirates’ flightdeck attrition rate is just 2%, says divisional senior vice president of flight operations Capt Alan Stealey with a crooked lying snaggle tooth smile akin to the crooked wheels on the famous Stealey wheelie bag that I force all our pilots to roll around.
Despite a blip three years ago when it urgently needed experienced direct-entry captains, the Dubai airline sticks to its policy of only recruiting first officers. We will then cherry pick the first officers who were hired "as future captains" for captain positions only after our checking department have repeatedly raped them in our turkish prison like checking setting. While this might mean experienced captains have to return to second-in-command for a while, Stealey insists it is the best way for Emirates to instill the airline’s values by using the stockholm syndrome technique of floggings, beatings, warning letters, and an active reporting culture in all flightcrew just to ensure opportunities for rising in rank apply equally. “We prefer to promote internally and early if you do everything perfectly and you are of the right nationality,” he says.
This means that all first officers have a chance to apply for captains’ positions when our management tells them they can after a minium of three years with the carrier, although a four-and-half year wait is typical, says Stealey. Given that Emirates stresses the long-term nature of a career with the airline, this is not an unreasonable period, he suggests. If our pilots have an issue or a complaint as we erode away their terms and conditions that were agreed to when they were hired and we decide to work them harder and harder, we just tell them that if they don't like it they can leave. It is also much shorter than most legacy carriers, where stagnant fleet sizes and strict seniority rules mean co-pilots “might have to spend 20 years in the right-hand seat” all while having great work rules, no threat of being terminated for stupid reasons, regular raises and bonuses, and not having to put up with idiot management and their policies.
We offer everything a young pilot would want, including flying the latest technology, harassing you through multiple bulletins, over-interpretation of company manuals, and an apartment in the desert, or if you are lucky, a villa in which you will be fined if you flush paper from the 2nd level.
To apply for a job at Emirates, pilots need at least 4,000 flying hours in total in a commercial aircraft, or 2,500 on either an Airbus or Boeing. Those from a low-cost carrier background – who will fly around 800h a year – often get there fastest, and many applicants come from this sector, says Stealey. For a pilot flying several short-hop sectors a day, the *attraction of intercontinental routes and really seeing the world can be compelling, he adds. In addition, you won't have the sun in your eyes while flying at Emirates as most of our flights occur during the night time hours. We will fly you across multiple time zones to many beautiful destinations in mainland China, the Indian subcontinent, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Saudi, and Africa including a tour of baku-haram land and Ebola-ville. You will be challenged to learn to sleep at anytime of the day or night from one day to the next with no consistency. After all that, we will send you for your yearly medical and they will recommend a sleep study in addition to finding a host of other medical problems because of our scheduling practices so that we can ground you and jeopardize your whole career. We will test you for alcohol as our company and work rules would NEVER drive you to drink. You will be subject to arbitrary scheduling rules limiting you to no more than 7 days off in a row and the inability to swap trips when we purposely schedule you into overtime, although you can't voluntarily swap to a desirable trip that pushes you into the same overtime
But Emirates also gets applications from much more seasoned pilots. “We had a guy in yesterday with 8,000h of experience from a defunct Indian carrier. He couldn't feed his family anymore so he had to come for the job,” he says. In fact, Stealey maintains he is seeing a change in the sort of pilots coming to Emirates. For a while crisis-hit US airlines were a happy hunting ground, but now, as the North American market has picked up, Europe’s ailing carriers are providing a stream of recruits, says Stealey. “If you work for an airline that is downsizing and you are desperate for a job, our bull****, and our abuse, we can offer stability,” he adds.
Despite a blip three years ago when it urgently needed experienced direct-entry captains, the Dubai airline sticks to its policy of only recruiting first officers. We will then cherry pick the first officers who were hired "as future captains" for captain positions only after our checking department have repeatedly raped them in our turkish prison like checking setting. While this might mean experienced captains have to return to second-in-command for a while, Stealey insists it is the best way for Emirates to instill the airline’s values by using the stockholm syndrome technique of floggings, beatings, warning letters, and an active reporting culture in all flightcrew just to ensure opportunities for rising in rank apply equally. “We prefer to promote internally and early if you do everything perfectly and you are of the right nationality,” he says.
This means that all first officers have a chance to apply for captains’ positions when our management tells them they can after a minium of three years with the carrier, although a four-and-half year wait is typical, says Stealey. Given that Emirates stresses the long-term nature of a career with the airline, this is not an unreasonable period, he suggests. If our pilots have an issue or a complaint as we erode away their terms and conditions that were agreed to when they were hired and we decide to work them harder and harder, we just tell them that if they don't like it they can leave. It is also much shorter than most legacy carriers, where stagnant fleet sizes and strict seniority rules mean co-pilots “might have to spend 20 years in the right-hand seat” all while having great work rules, no threat of being terminated for stupid reasons, regular raises and bonuses, and not having to put up with idiot management and their policies.
We offer everything a young pilot would want, including flying the latest technology, harassing you through multiple bulletins, over-interpretation of company manuals, and an apartment in the desert, or if you are lucky, a villa in which you will be fined if you flush paper from the 2nd level.
To apply for a job at Emirates, pilots need at least 4,000 flying hours in total in a commercial aircraft, or 2,500 on either an Airbus or Boeing. Those from a low-cost carrier background – who will fly around 800h a year – often get there fastest, and many applicants come from this sector, says Stealey. For a pilot flying several short-hop sectors a day, the *attraction of intercontinental routes and really seeing the world can be compelling, he adds. In addition, you won't have the sun in your eyes while flying at Emirates as most of our flights occur during the night time hours. We will fly you across multiple time zones to many beautiful destinations in mainland China, the Indian subcontinent, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Saudi, and Africa including a tour of baku-haram land and Ebola-ville. You will be challenged to learn to sleep at anytime of the day or night from one day to the next with no consistency. After all that, we will send you for your yearly medical and they will recommend a sleep study in addition to finding a host of other medical problems because of our scheduling practices so that we can ground you and jeopardize your whole career. We will test you for alcohol as our company and work rules would NEVER drive you to drink. You will be subject to arbitrary scheduling rules limiting you to no more than 7 days off in a row and the inability to swap trips when we purposely schedule you into overtime, although you can't voluntarily swap to a desirable trip that pushes you into the same overtime
But Emirates also gets applications from much more seasoned pilots. “We had a guy in yesterday with 8,000h of experience from a defunct Indian carrier. He couldn't feed his family anymore so he had to come for the job,” he says. In fact, Stealey maintains he is seeing a change in the sort of pilots coming to Emirates. For a while crisis-hit US airlines were a happy hunting ground, but now, as the North American market has picked up, Europe’s ailing carriers are providing a stream of recruits, says Stealey. “If you work for an airline that is downsizing and you are desperate for a job, our bull****, and our abuse, we can offer stability,” he adds.
Last edited by TransitCheck; 12th Jan 2015 at 22:18.
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I couldn't find the above text on Flightglobal's postings from 12th January, however, the actual requirements listed on the Emirates website differ from those listed in the text:
Jet time isn't mentioned in the text above, which states:
First Officer
- A minimum of 4000 hours total flying time (may include 25% P3 or FEO time to a max of 500 hours)
- A minimum of 2000 hours multi-crew, multi-engine jet aircraft (P3 time cannot be used for this requirement).
OR
- A minimum of 2500 hours total flying time on a modern commercial multi-engine, multi-crew aircraft jet (P3 time cannot be used for this requirement)
- A minimum of 4000 hours total flying time (may include 25% P3 or FEO time to a max of 500 hours)
- A minimum of 2000 hours multi-crew, multi-engine jet aircraft (P3 time cannot be used for this requirement).
OR
- A minimum of 2500 hours total flying time on a modern commercial multi-engine, multi-crew aircraft jet (P3 time cannot be used for this requirement)
To apply for a job at Emirates, pilots need at least 4,000 flying hours in total in a commercial aircraft, or 2,500 on either an Airbus or Boeing.
short flights long nights
Road shows across Europe? Really? That's interesting...At a recent wash up the HR person said.. 'hundreds of applications no need for road shows'....
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Then why were the Recruitment team in MIA for 2 weeks, Aus late last year and all over S America trying to get anyone to come to EK?
I know no one on this forum trust Emirates and what they say and do but we as pilots have to start calling their lies.
I know no one on this forum trust Emirates and what they say and do but we as pilots have to start calling their lies.
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Cerbus
From what I understand - the MIA foray is a pre-Dubai invite (Sim & basic HR check) before final assessment in desert & not technically a "road show"
Open to correction.
f.
From what I understand - the MIA foray is a pre-Dubai invite (Sim & basic HR check) before final assessment in desert & not technically a "road show"
Open to correction.
f.
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TCAS needs a little remedial maths. Approx. 110 pilots resigned last year, January to end Of December, give or take a few. That's not 2%. But is in the vicinity of 8-10 pilots walking away every month. That is not insignificant when actual age 65 retirements are far and in between. Fleet growing and pilot numbers stagnate around 3800. Does anyone here believe that any "first tier" airline has that many resignations per month? That's what the branding says we are.
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The posted numbers matter not one jot.
What matters is the negative critical mass being reached? I seriously hope not.
Why? Because it would need a unbelievably talented management to survive the lip of the abyss.
EK IS the Golden Goose that not only lays for the 9th floor but for you and your families as well.
Lets not to cut off our noses to spite our faces, eh guys?
What matters is the negative critical mass being reached? I seriously hope not.
Why? Because it would need a unbelievably talented management to survive the lip of the abyss.
EK IS the Golden Goose that not only lays for the 9th floor but for you and your families as well.
Lets not to cut off our noses to spite our faces, eh guys?
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Okay Always In It we will just bend over and take all the crap and "hope" it gets better here. You might not have a better place to go or think Emirates is the place to be but I invite you to pull your head out of your arse and smell the coffee. I don't like taking it in the arse but maybe you do or are use to it with your Ryanair mentality.
The sooner the word gets out weather it is to the GCAA, Airbus, or prospective pilots the sooner things will change here. There is no reason to treat us like they do and when Soft C0ck$ like you defend the company and say it isn't so bad it only incourgages the management to continue with the floggings.
Emirates is not the only game in town. It is not even the best option in the Middle East anymore and prospective pilots are starting to,realize that. 10 year upgrade with the way mangement treats its pilots? Who is going to sign up for that?
The sooner the word gets out weather it is to the GCAA, Airbus, or prospective pilots the sooner things will change here. There is no reason to treat us like they do and when Soft C0ck$ like you defend the company and say it isn't so bad it only incourgages the management to continue with the floggings.
Emirates is not the only game in town. It is not even the best option in the Middle East anymore and prospective pilots are starting to,realize that. 10 year upgrade with the way mangement treats its pilots? Who is going to sign up for that?
Last edited by LHR Rain; 13th Jan 2015 at 18:26. Reason: Content
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Wow!
Sadly the expectation of an adult response was in vain.
From your spelling "Drizzle" I suggest less personal insults or assumptions and you take more water with it.
Moving on now from the "pigs table" and rejoining those in the real world.
Bless you.
Sadly the expectation of an adult response was in vain.
From your spelling "Drizzle" I suggest less personal insults or assumptions and you take more water with it.
Moving on now from the "pigs table" and rejoining those in the real world.
Bless you.
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When people under the convenience of anonymity feel empowered to accuse fellow colleagues of being 'soft cocks' or 'limped dicks', maybe, just maybe, they should stop for a minute and look at their own integrity. How many of the likes of LHR Rain and Algon'n crusader will still walk into a cabin crew brief 23 minutes before official report? How many of you will also report for a duty that departs at 0710 following a Day Off knowing full well it violates the OMA if the unofficial 'Timeline' is followed? How many of you have the balls to question these and other anomalies that we pilots 'ignore' to keep our heads down and do the job.
Before the next onslaught of mud slinging, just be honest with yourself. Hypocrisy is not a nice trait to behold!
Harry
Before the next onslaught of mud slinging, just be honest with yourself. Hypocrisy is not a nice trait to behold!
Harry
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All true Harry. But to defend the practices of a culture, re company, that "enforces" what all are talking about does get to people. I agree with what you say,but the fear factor is always there. And they know they can manipulate the pilots through fear and intimidation. Thus we see a bit of the Stolkhom Syndrome. Anger spews out when our own ilk buy into it.
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Something to consider for someone with computer tech knowledge would be to create a website so that EK guys/gals can keep in touch using their real names and network with those who have left EK for greener pastures. That way those of us who want to leave can have questions answered and maybe some advantage of an "in" at these companies to aid in a mass exodus. Just a thought. I would be more than happy to sign up WHEN (not IF) I finally get out of here.
I do my fair share of badmouthing the company in the areas that it is deserved but on the positive note they have hired a good group of pilots to work with for the most part.
I do my fair share of badmouthing the company in the areas that it is deserved but on the positive note they have hired a good group of pilots to work with for the most part.
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Gents, the point I was, obviously unsuccessfully, trying to get across was simply that a M.A.D. approach (mutually assured destruction) does not serve anyone at all.
Safe flying everyone.
Safe flying everyone.
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TransitCheck: brilliant post a few back. Absolutely the truth "between the lines".
harry: predictable. *yawn*
alwaysinit: I prefer the term "creative destruction" to "mutually assured destruction". EK is entering the part of the cycle where the sheer folly of much of it's "management", particularly in the area of actual PEOPLE management, is coming home to roost. If the dire situation in CC isn't an indication of a severe sickness, I don't know what is.
I say bring it on, the sooner the better. Firing a few HR managers is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
harry: predictable. *yawn*
alwaysinit: I prefer the term "creative destruction" to "mutually assured destruction". EK is entering the part of the cycle where the sheer folly of much of it's "management", particularly in the area of actual PEOPLE management, is coming home to roost. If the dire situation in CC isn't an indication of a severe sickness, I don't know what is.
I say bring it on, the sooner the better. Firing a few HR managers is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
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so sad
Waiting for my sim candidates in the lobby,I watch your crews assembling in the Arora Hotel at Gatwick, waiting for their coach and nervously thumbing their iphones, knees together, heads down and looking thoroughly miserable. Then the flight deck arrive, various nationalities and tones looking absolutely pissed off to the teeth. No one is smiling, no one looks happy with life in the slightest. Their is a look of real FEAR on their faces even, mahoneykins. Sheezus. What have you created out their, a fuxxin monster.