Are all pilots @ EK so unhappy?
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VFEnext... Probably because the other 94-96% are too, buggered, tired, apathetic, frustrated, don't post on Internet forums, sleeping before another night flight... Delete as appropriate.
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"Whatever you do, do not take a job on the 340/340 fleet now. It is a dying fleet and every hour you spend is wasted toward command."
Why are these hours wasted? Can you only upgrade from right to left on the current type? A330/A340 FO can only get an upgrade on the A330/A340?
Thanks,
LW20
Why are these hours wasted? Can you only upgrade from right to left on the current type? A330/A340 FO can only get an upgrade on the A330/A340?
Thanks,
LW20
short flights long nights
You got it.
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Wow.
When the A330/A340 get's phased out, you will start on the last spot of the seniority list of your new fleet? So, on 1 fleet you could get an upgrade after e.g. 5 years. And your colleage on the other one after e.g. 7 years, although you joined on the same date?:
When the A330/A340 get's phased out, you will start on the last spot of the seniority list of your new fleet? So, on 1 fleet you could get an upgrade after e.g. 5 years. And your colleage on the other one after e.g. 7 years, although you joined on the same date?:
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BINGO! You finally got it LW 20.
Can you see why so many pilots are upset with how Emirates treats it's employees? This is just one example of how pilots get screwed with no recourse but to leave the company or vent on pprune.
I don't claim to have a majority opinion because I have not commissioned a poll but just about every pilot at EK is disappointed to irate about the way things have transpired in the last few years.
Can you see why so many pilots are upset with how Emirates treats it's employees? This is just one example of how pilots get screwed with no recourse but to leave the company or vent on pprune.
I don't claim to have a majority opinion because I have not commissioned a poll but just about every pilot at EK is disappointed to irate about the way things have transpired in the last few years.
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T J,
why do you keep posting so positive about Dubai? You never lived here and the only thing i can see is, that you are as blinded as all the new joiners... please do us a favour and come over and live your dream.
Please also let us know after 3 years (thats how long it takes to loose the pink glasses) how your wife feels about the great future for herself.
You found your absolute dream destination apparently in Dubai...
I've never seen anybody trying so aggressively to find positive points to all the negative comments of those who've been living here long enough to tell you what it is about.
why do you keep posting so positive about Dubai? You never lived here and the only thing i can see is, that you are as blinded as all the new joiners... please do us a favour and come over and live your dream.
Please also let us know after 3 years (thats how long it takes to loose the pink glasses) how your wife feels about the great future for herself.
You found your absolute dream destination apparently in Dubai...
I've never seen anybody trying so aggressively to find positive points to all the negative comments of those who've been living here long enough to tell you what it is about.
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LW20, I'll try explain it very clearly since the upgrade policy at EK is somewhat convoluted. If you were to join on the 330, you would stay on the fleet until it is phased out and you woud never upgrade on it. That will be about 2 years as of right now, but that plan seems to change with the wind. The last upgrades on that fleet start class in November and then that's it for upgrades. Also no more CCQ classes meaning you will not get the 340 type. Once transferred to the 380 (777 is no longer an option for transfer) you will need to accure 2500 hours on the 380 for upgrade, regardless of how much time you spent on the 330. Thats what many FOs are dealing with right now. Some have been on the 330 for 3 years and are now moving to the 380. Their counterparts who were hired after them and directly onto the 380 or 777 have been building time to command and will upgrade before them despite their junior status. Basically, if you took a job on the 330 now, you woud be looking at 7-9 year upgrade if not longer.
Anyone please correct me if anything I have said is incorrect, exagerated, or biased.
But as I said before, Dubai is what you make of it and most people are having a good time outside of work. However, people are fed up with the ambiguity and continual erosion of the total package.
Anyone please correct me if anything I have said is incorrect, exagerated, or biased.
But as I said before, Dubai is what you make of it and most people are having a good time outside of work. However, people are fed up with the ambiguity and continual erosion of the total package.
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Glofish
How right you are. Just did my CRM and the day was interesting. Very, very negative comments, some justified but most not so. Once one had started, the floodgates opened. Most subjects were hijacked by a group intent on proving how pissed off they were. Great at spreading malicious rumours and idle gossip too but, when pushed, it was obvious that they had little or no facts of the real events. Then I did a little research.
Of the group, 2 were permanent F/O's, another had been a Captain but was demoted, 1 Captain had been removed as a trainer, 1 F/O (who thought he knew it all and was god's gift to aviation) had failed his command course last year and another was a Captain after succeeding second time round. His wife though had moved back to Europe with the kids and he's trying to commute, as was another guy. So, out of about 13 guys, over half had 'history' and 'issues'. It was the 'perfect storm'.
Seeing how they conducted themselves in class, I can now see why the Company acted as it did!
Harry
How right you are. Just did my CRM and the day was interesting. Very, very negative comments, some justified but most not so. Once one had started, the floodgates opened. Most subjects were hijacked by a group intent on proving how pissed off they were. Great at spreading malicious rumours and idle gossip too but, when pushed, it was obvious that they had little or no facts of the real events. Then I did a little research.
Of the group, 2 were permanent F/O's, another had been a Captain but was demoted, 1 Captain had been removed as a trainer, 1 F/O (who thought he knew it all and was god's gift to aviation) had failed his command course last year and another was a Captain after succeeding second time round. His wife though had moved back to Europe with the kids and he's trying to commute, as was another guy. So, out of about 13 guys, over half had 'history' and 'issues'. It was the 'perfect storm'.
Seeing how they conducted themselves in class, I can now see why the Company acted as it did!
Harry
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So if the last upgrades on 330 are this November, I assume there is limited recruitment onto the fleet to replace the guys being upgraded?
Are new airbus joiners almost guaranteed the 380?
Are new airbus joiners almost guaranteed the 380?
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Originally Posted by Harry the Cod
Seeing how they conducted themselves in class, I can now see why the Company acted as it did!
And yeah; for the record I'm happy here - as are most of the 380 F/Os I fly with. Then again I've been here long enough to A) earn the lifestyle with seniority and B) know how Dubai works and more importantly C) know how EK works....
Dubai and Emirates are a good gig IF you make them WORK FOR YOU
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Harry
I see what you mean, to a certain extent i consent. A small group poisons the lot.
But on the other hand your example just proves our point:
How come that so many are so pi$$ed? You certainly agree that in a class of 13 a group of 7 makes a huge percentage!
either EKs selection went terribly wrong, or its environment is wrong, sort of creating such ire. Everyones choice, but evidently Sum Thing Wong.
I see what you mean, to a certain extent i consent. A small group poisons the lot.
But on the other hand your example just proves our point:
How come that so many are so pi$$ed? You certainly agree that in a class of 13 a group of 7 makes a huge percentage!
either EKs selection went terribly wrong, or its environment is wrong, sort of creating such ire. Everyones choice, but evidently Sum Thing Wong.
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White Knight I do believe you are full of manure. You said everyone you come across is happy and you probably believe that. You also said you don't know any Americans that are leaving.
13 pilots left the company last month. I have moved up 36 positions this year alone and I don't know how many pilots left junior to me. Every American I have talked to have their applications in at US majors.
If you tell yourself you are happy over and over you will not notice how things have detoriated at Emirates and that might be a good thing for you. I prefer to be a realist.
13 pilots left the company last month. I have moved up 36 positions this year alone and I don't know how many pilots left junior to me. Every American I have talked to have their applications in at US majors.
If you tell yourself you are happy over and over you will not notice how things have detoriated at Emirates and that might be a good thing for you. I prefer to be a realist.
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either EKs selection went terribly wrong, or its environment is wrong, sort of creating such ire. Everyones choice, but evidently Sum Thing Wong
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I posted a question on here a while ago regarding how many of the septics are leaving, well, of the 12 I know, 9 are working their notice and 6 of those are 380 guys.
Its interesting to note that as predicted the lead time for resignations is about 12-18 months, I wonder where we will be with respect to manpower and policies in another 12 months from now?
Its interesting to note that as predicted the lead time for resignations is about 12-18 months, I wonder where we will be with respect to manpower and policies in another 12 months from now?
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Glofish
And that's the point. It was almost half the class and it did indeed prove poisonous. People often use these days as opportunities to vent and nothing wrong or unusual in that, providing it doesn't take over the subject. The perfect storm was that there were so many 'suspects' in the one class. One or two whiners perhaps, but 7? Regardless of the mainly negative posts on these forums, I do not believe this a true percentage representation of pilots opinion.
My frustration is spending a day listening to this garbage when I'm rostered to refresh CRM. I get no credit pay. I can work with that providing the day proves useful and I learn something. The biggest concern too is the few relatively new F/O's who didn't know what had hit them. When statements are made such as "any decision you make in this Company will be wrong", how the hell can guys enhance their professional abilities and have the confidence to make common sense decisions when they upgrade? That statement came from the F/O (ex RAF) who obviously felt Command was his right. The guy was a **** basically and was intent on using his own distorted bias to influence those less vocal. Because he'd failed his first attempt (no doubt more to do with attitude than ability), everyone else should be screwed too. What a jerk.
When you also have an 8 year Captain moaning that they had to go on leave two days late because we don't fly a daily service to Toronto, you kinda get the message where this day went!
Harry
And that's the point. It was almost half the class and it did indeed prove poisonous. People often use these days as opportunities to vent and nothing wrong or unusual in that, providing it doesn't take over the subject. The perfect storm was that there were so many 'suspects' in the one class. One or two whiners perhaps, but 7? Regardless of the mainly negative posts on these forums, I do not believe this a true percentage representation of pilots opinion.
My frustration is spending a day listening to this garbage when I'm rostered to refresh CRM. I get no credit pay. I can work with that providing the day proves useful and I learn something. The biggest concern too is the few relatively new F/O's who didn't know what had hit them. When statements are made such as "any decision you make in this Company will be wrong", how the hell can guys enhance their professional abilities and have the confidence to make common sense decisions when they upgrade? That statement came from the F/O (ex RAF) who obviously felt Command was his right. The guy was a **** basically and was intent on using his own distorted bias to influence those less vocal. Because he'd failed his first attempt (no doubt more to do with attitude than ability), everyone else should be screwed too. What a jerk.
When you also have an 8 year Captain moaning that they had to go on leave two days late because we don't fly a daily service to Toronto, you kinda get the message where this day went!
Harry
Last edited by harry the cod; 2nd Sep 2014 at 10:14.