Are all pilots @ EK so unhappy?
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Not at EK :)
Posts: 526
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A few points that come to mind having read the previous posts:
1.) Dubai is a very expensive place to live. Everything has sky-rocketed in price.
2.) The EK package isn't keeping up with inflation.
3.) Very few people believe we will receive a bonus again.
4.) Lots of people talking about leaving. But stay because it is the best option re family being settled etc.
5.) A culture of arrogance from the management.
6.) Longer time to command.
7.) Nice shiny jets and some great people to work with.
8.) Good schooling.
Some great posts re the difference between the fleets.
EK is a good job for Captains. FO with family is a tough one. Single and young FOs could see this as a great gig.
1.) Dubai is a very expensive place to live. Everything has sky-rocketed in price.
2.) The EK package isn't keeping up with inflation.
3.) Very few people believe we will receive a bonus again.
4.) Lots of people talking about leaving. But stay because it is the best option re family being settled etc.
5.) A culture of arrogance from the management.
6.) Longer time to command.
7.) Nice shiny jets and some great people to work with.
8.) Good schooling.
Some great posts re the difference between the fleets.
EK is a good job for Captains. FO with family is a tough one. Single and young FOs could see this as a great gig.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
it is about the life-style at the end...
There are two major areas that need to improve for Pilots to be happy here...
Those are ACCOMMODATION AND ROSTERING...I guess the rest is more manageable...
This two issues will take your health and family life away....
1- The 92 hours target... There is no life with this rosters. You nearly recover for the next night shift with minimum allowances outstations. They changed TC for the productivity threshold from 78 to 92 hours. This days with the previous scheme, Captains would make 30 % higher salary. That means, any paid rise in the last 8 years has been taken away with this move. But more important than the pay, your family quality time got depreciated big time, more frequent health issues and no incentive. Depression, fatigue, divorces, alcohol consumption and other health issues it all went up drastically. Of course Medical benefits degraded so You pay the bill for it, just in case...
2- The new policy of taking people away from the city... Moving them to live in an unprepared hostile environment, like MH and Jebel Ali. Degrading your life quality and your family's. They give no answers to major issues and they treat You as if You are disturbing them. But, they send You to live there before it is even ready.
So to come here today, will accelerate your health degradation, your divorce and better don't forget your hat at home...!!
Those are ACCOMMODATION AND ROSTERING...I guess the rest is more manageable...
This two issues will take your health and family life away....
1- The 92 hours target... There is no life with this rosters. You nearly recover for the next night shift with minimum allowances outstations. They changed TC for the productivity threshold from 78 to 92 hours. This days with the previous scheme, Captains would make 30 % higher salary. That means, any paid rise in the last 8 years has been taken away with this move. But more important than the pay, your family quality time got depreciated big time, more frequent health issues and no incentive. Depression, fatigue, divorces, alcohol consumption and other health issues it all went up drastically. Of course Medical benefits degraded so You pay the bill for it, just in case...
2- The new policy of taking people away from the city... Moving them to live in an unprepared hostile environment, like MH and Jebel Ali. Degrading your life quality and your family's. They give no answers to major issues and they treat You as if You are disturbing them. But, they send You to live there before it is even ready.
So to come here today, will accelerate your health degradation, your divorce and better don't forget your hat at home...!!
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Doctor's waiting room
Posts: 769
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Many of my colleagues have eloquently summed up how many of us feel but another feeling that is very common amongst us is frustration. I would say that there are not that many that would say that they are genuinely unhappy as such but a number would say that they do feel frustration more than anything else.
In Emirates, a little change could create a big difference and it is this that many find frustrating. Many of these changes would bear no extra cost to the company which adds to the feeling of frustration.
How we are perceived by EK management was something that I saw first hand at my last gig, as I was involved in the office in my previous life. The degree of contempt that I witnessed at my last company was quite off putting at first before I got used to it but I see the exact same traits here in EK. Management still view us as doing the same job as long haul pilots did in the days of when 707s were in the skies. The nice destinations and the leading brand name hotels that we often stay in, create a false impression that masks the real issues that that we face both in and out of work due to the way that we are managed.
For those reading who are not EK employees, the key thing to this job is making it work for yourself. It is now really only a single mans game now for those joining, since it is still financially lucrative enough to offset the negatives, if you only have yourself to worry about. Plus if you are on your own, then you really have the flexibility needed to make the most of the limited time off that we now have.
I would sum up that I am not happy here nor am I unhappy but I would say that I am generally satisfied with occasionally bouts of frustration thrown in from time to time. I don't get paid enough to care nor worry about EK in between leaving EGHQ and next reporting for my next duty. My time off is too valuable for that.
In Emirates, a little change could create a big difference and it is this that many find frustrating. Many of these changes would bear no extra cost to the company which adds to the feeling of frustration.
How we are perceived by EK management was something that I saw first hand at my last gig, as I was involved in the office in my previous life. The degree of contempt that I witnessed at my last company was quite off putting at first before I got used to it but I see the exact same traits here in EK. Management still view us as doing the same job as long haul pilots did in the days of when 707s were in the skies. The nice destinations and the leading brand name hotels that we often stay in, create a false impression that masks the real issues that that we face both in and out of work due to the way that we are managed.
For those reading who are not EK employees, the key thing to this job is making it work for yourself. It is now really only a single mans game now for those joining, since it is still financially lucrative enough to offset the negatives, if you only have yourself to worry about. Plus if you are on your own, then you really have the flexibility needed to make the most of the limited time off that we now have.
I would sum up that I am not happy here nor am I unhappy but I would say that I am generally satisfied with occasionally bouts of frustration thrown in from time to time. I don't get paid enough to care nor worry about EK in between leaving EGHQ and next reporting for my next duty. My time off is too valuable for that.
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: usa
Posts: 1,005
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I also think that what goes to the core of the problem is the complete lack of appreciation from a co.optics perspective of the good job that we do.
We are one of the hardest working long haul pilots in the market...month in month out 90-92.
The tone at wash ups, in co. emails etc always seems to focus on the issues of what went wrong last week and how we need to improve our game...cue lost Comms.
They need some salesmen in there to focus on the 95% that do good ???
It really is low hanging fruit for a new manager wannabee because of the cost of that....zero.
But perhaps it's by design ... ie that would be seen as some sort of empowerment.
The tone issue is a real head scratcher as it's 101 in mgt school.
Ah well...what would we know...not allowed even open an aircraft door ...now there's some empowerment for the skipper .
f.
We are one of the hardest working long haul pilots in the market...month in month out 90-92.
The tone at wash ups, in co. emails etc always seems to focus on the issues of what went wrong last week and how we need to improve our game...cue lost Comms.
They need some salesmen in there to focus on the 95% that do good ???
It really is low hanging fruit for a new manager wannabee because of the cost of that....zero.
But perhaps it's by design ... ie that would be seen as some sort of empowerment.
The tone issue is a real head scratcher as it's 101 in mgt school.
Ah well...what would we know...not allowed even open an aircraft door ...now there's some empowerment for the skipper .
f.
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: DXB
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Heard from a friend on the CRS comity that if AAR gets his way the new Jepp Roster system will give us a maximum of 8 confirmed days off a month with the rest of the non flying days being AD's. (Available or can use days)
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Terra Firma
Posts: 441
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ADs on the roster are "Adel Days", you are his property, that's why he gave you a part number, much like the no smoking sticker on the inside of the door in the aircraft toilets.
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Attic
Age: 59
Posts: 107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Even the Ryanair pilots? I don't think so.
They have not only ruined the profession on a macro level they are ruining Emirates on a micro level. Thanks a lot guys.
Do you think Ryanair pilots should pay for their recurrent every 6 months at Emirates?
They have not only ruined the profession on a macro level they are ruining Emirates on a micro level. Thanks a lot guys.
Do you think Ryanair pilots should pay for their recurrent every 6 months at Emirates?
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 70
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Really? The Ryanair pilots have ruined your cosy little ex- pat deal eh? FYI quite a few have already seen Emirates and Dubai for what it is and moved on. It's spineless chumps like you who whine and continue to provide their services that allow your package to get eroded.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hostage to geographical fortune.
Posts: 89
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I had a handful of furloughed colleagues decamp to the sandpit and submit to the tender charms of EK - each heeded loud and clear the siren's call for the necessity of a paycheck - mortgage to service, wife and kids to feed.
All without exception, once their number came up for recall, paid a not insignificant sum to EK to make things whole and subsequently returned home. Their stories are interesting and illuminating and they would have been much happier without the sandpit intruding into their lives. It was simply an equation to be balanced: paycheck in lieu of QOL.
All without exception, once their number came up for recall, paid a not insignificant sum to EK to make things whole and subsequently returned home. Their stories are interesting and illuminating and they would have been much happier without the sandpit intruding into their lives. It was simply an equation to be balanced: paycheck in lieu of QOL.
Join Date: May 2011
Location: FL400
Posts: 398
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In my group of friends, everyone is very happy here, both with work and with living in Dubai. Yes, it's not perfect, there are issues. But on the whole it's a question of making it work for you.
Don't make an opinion based on PPRuNe would be my advice.
Don't make an opinion based on PPRuNe would be my advice.
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Desert
Posts: 363
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I can't believe you make a statement like that Al. Everyone one you know is happy at Emirates?
Just about everyone I know and fly with have varying degrees of dislike to outright hatred of Emirates. I have yet to come across anyone that is really and truly happy. Some ignore what is going on around them and bury their head in the sand but even they do not sing the praises of EK.
With all that has happened to our T&Cs, salary and the goings on with Dubai you would be hard pressed to find a happy camper.
Yes I think Ryanair pilots should pay for their PPCs every 6 months. After all they paid for their training.
Just about everyone I know and fly with have varying degrees of dislike to outright hatred of Emirates. I have yet to come across anyone that is really and truly happy. Some ignore what is going on around them and bury their head in the sand but even they do not sing the praises of EK.
With all that has happened to our T&Cs, salary and the goings on with Dubai you would be hard pressed to find a happy camper.
Yes I think Ryanair pilots should pay for their PPCs every 6 months. After all they paid for their training.