EK Triple7 AOG Mumbai
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If it did I hope it was not for the same reason as a KAC B707 did in the late 70's as the F/E had been busy loading his large chairs in the hold at BKK during refuelling and after getting airborne it was realised they did not have enough to get to Kuwait so had to land in Bombay as it was then to get some extra gas.
The five stages of loss and greith for JAARule
1. Denial and Isolation
The first reaction to learning of terminal illness or death of a cherished loved one, or seeing all the prize destinations being handed to the A380 is to deny the reality of the situation. It is a normal reaction to rationalize overwhelming emotions. It is a defense mechanism that buffers the immediate shock. We block out the words and hide from the facts. This is a temporary response that carries us through the first wave of pain.
2. Anger
As the masking effects of denial and isolation begin to wear, reality and its pain re-emerge. We are not ready. The intense emotion is deflected from our vulnerable core, redirected and expressed instead as anger. The anger may be aimed at inanimate objects, complete strangers, friends, family or an aircraft type you know nothing of. Anger may be directed at our dying or deceased loved one. Rationally, we know the person is not to be blamed. Emotionally, however, we may resent the person for causing us pain or for leaving us. We feel guilty for being angry, and this makes us more angry.
Remember, grieving is a personal process that has no time limit, nor one “right” way to do it.
The doctor who diagnosed the illness and was unable to cure the disease might become a convenient target. Health professionals deal with death and dying every day. That does not make them immune to the suffering of their patients or to those who grieve for them.
Do not hesitate to ask your doctor to give you extra time or to explain just once more the details of your loved one’s illness. Arrange a special appointment or ask that he telephone you at the end of his day. Ask for clear answers to your questions regarding medical diagnosis and treatment. Understand the options available to you. Take your time.
3. Bargaining
The normal reaction to feelings of helplessness and vulnerability is often a need to regain control–
4. Depression
Two types of depression are associated with mourning. The first one is a reaction to practical implications relating to the loss. Sadness and regret predominate this type of depression. We worry about the costs and burial. We worry that, in our grief, we have spent less time with others that depend on us. This phase may be eased by simple clarification and reassurance. We may need a bit of helpful cooperation and a few kind words. The second type of depression is more subtle and, in a sense, perhaps more private. It is our quiet preparation to separate and to bid our loved one farewell. Sometimes all we really need is a hug.
5. Acceptance
Reaching this stage of mourning is a gift not afforded to everyone. Death may be sudden and unexpected or we may never see beyond our anger or denial. It is not necessarily a mark of bravery to resist the inevitable and to deny ourselves the opportunity to make our peace. This phase is marked by withdrawal and calm. This is not a period of happiness and must be distinguished from depression.
Loved ones that are terminally ill or aging appear to go through a final period of withdrawal. This is by no means a suggestion that they are aware of their own impending death or such, only that physical decline may be sufficient to produce a similar response. Their behavior implies that it is natural to reach a stage at which social interaction is limited. The dignity and grace shown by our dying loved ones may well be their last gift to us.
Coping with loss is a ultimately a deeply personal and singular experience — nobody can help you go through it more easily or understand all the emotions that you’re going through. But others can be there for you and help comfort you through this process. The best thing you can do is to allow yourself to feel the grief as it comes over you. Resisting it only will prolong the natural process of healing.
JAARule its only normal and human to feel a loss when you see the future of your fleet being decimated by another. I hope the above gives you some hope for the future.
The Don
The first reaction to learning of terminal illness or death of a cherished loved one, or seeing all the prize destinations being handed to the A380 is to deny the reality of the situation. It is a normal reaction to rationalize overwhelming emotions. It is a defense mechanism that buffers the immediate shock. We block out the words and hide from the facts. This is a temporary response that carries us through the first wave of pain.
2. Anger
As the masking effects of denial and isolation begin to wear, reality and its pain re-emerge. We are not ready. The intense emotion is deflected from our vulnerable core, redirected and expressed instead as anger. The anger may be aimed at inanimate objects, complete strangers, friends, family or an aircraft type you know nothing of. Anger may be directed at our dying or deceased loved one. Rationally, we know the person is not to be blamed. Emotionally, however, we may resent the person for causing us pain or for leaving us. We feel guilty for being angry, and this makes us more angry.
Remember, grieving is a personal process that has no time limit, nor one “right” way to do it.
The doctor who diagnosed the illness and was unable to cure the disease might become a convenient target. Health professionals deal with death and dying every day. That does not make them immune to the suffering of their patients or to those who grieve for them.
Do not hesitate to ask your doctor to give you extra time or to explain just once more the details of your loved one’s illness. Arrange a special appointment or ask that he telephone you at the end of his day. Ask for clear answers to your questions regarding medical diagnosis and treatment. Understand the options available to you. Take your time.
3. Bargaining
The normal reaction to feelings of helplessness and vulnerability is often a need to regain control–
- If only we had sought medical attention sooner…
- If only we got a second opinion from another doctor…
- If only we had tried to be a better person toward them…
- If only I was Airbus rated!!!!!!!
4. Depression
Two types of depression are associated with mourning. The first one is a reaction to practical implications relating to the loss. Sadness and regret predominate this type of depression. We worry about the costs and burial. We worry that, in our grief, we have spent less time with others that depend on us. This phase may be eased by simple clarification and reassurance. We may need a bit of helpful cooperation and a few kind words. The second type of depression is more subtle and, in a sense, perhaps more private. It is our quiet preparation to separate and to bid our loved one farewell. Sometimes all we really need is a hug.
5. Acceptance
Reaching this stage of mourning is a gift not afforded to everyone. Death may be sudden and unexpected or we may never see beyond our anger or denial. It is not necessarily a mark of bravery to resist the inevitable and to deny ourselves the opportunity to make our peace. This phase is marked by withdrawal and calm. This is not a period of happiness and must be distinguished from depression.
Loved ones that are terminally ill or aging appear to go through a final period of withdrawal. This is by no means a suggestion that they are aware of their own impending death or such, only that physical decline may be sufficient to produce a similar response. Their behavior implies that it is natural to reach a stage at which social interaction is limited. The dignity and grace shown by our dying loved ones may well be their last gift to us.
Coping with loss is a ultimately a deeply personal and singular experience — nobody can help you go through it more easily or understand all the emotions that you’re going through. But others can be there for you and help comfort you through this process. The best thing you can do is to allow yourself to feel the grief as it comes over you. Resisting it only will prolong the natural process of healing.
JAARule its only normal and human to feel a loss when you see the future of your fleet being decimated by another. I hope the above gives you some hope for the future.
The Don
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C'm on Ladies .... put your Dolce and Karamas aside, some facts instead, please!
1. Did a T7 divert? Yes or no.
2. As some enlightened soul seems to know why, may we kindly participate in your wisdom?
Then we can continue the MMQ ...
1. Did a T7 divert? Yes or no.
2. As some enlightened soul seems to know why, may we kindly participate in your wisdom?
Then we can continue the MMQ ...
17yrs.....how quickly time passes.
Might explain why PAX describe traveling in the B777 as the closest thing they can think of which equates to their perception of prison sex. Firstly its something that should be avoided. If you can't, be prepared for something quite unpleasant, and which is excessively noisy and rough.
But that freighter goes like the clappers...when its empty...and you work out how to get the gear up...and dispatch worked out how much fuel you need on board to keep it within limits
Yeah I know. Coat, Hat, Door.
The Don
Might explain why PAX describe traveling in the B777 as the closest thing they can think of which equates to their perception of prison sex. Firstly its something that should be avoided. If you can't, be prepared for something quite unpleasant, and which is excessively noisy and rough.
But that freighter goes like the clappers...when its empty...and you work out how to get the gear up...and dispatch worked out how much fuel you need on board to keep it within limits
Yeah I know. Coat, Hat, Door.
The Don
17 years , and who remembers the reliability of those days...... All three engine types had major issues for several years . The one 'new' engine had to have a complete oil system redesign because it used more oil than fuel ! AIMS problems !!! Pack shutdowns in flight due ice particles blocking sensors so causing routing problems over Iran . Took a good few years to sort out , although now is very good. But then 747-400 took longer , then turned into workhorse. To be fair 380 reliability wasnt brilliant for first couple of years but has now settled down pretty well for a new design . Think if every fault and diversion of every type was reported publically there might be a different impression of various types !
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Might explain why PAX describe traveling in the B777 as the closest thing they can think of which equates to their perception of prison sex. Firstly its something that should be avoided. If you can't, be prepared for something quite unpleasant, and which is excessively noisy and rough.
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Tim Clark wants another 100 T7's.......
A relatively unbiased view in my opinion:
"Emirates’ experience with aircraft in this class has led it to prefer Boeing,” said Richard Aboulafia, vice president of Fairfax, Virginia-based Teal Group, an aviation consulting firm. "The A340 was a disaster, and the A380 is only useful as a way of maximising scarce slots. The 777 has been a very big success for Emirates, and they’ve become the biggest customer. In other words, even though the A350-1000 looks promising, it’s very much in Emirates’ interest to motivate Boeing with the prospect of large numbers.”
Emirates uses the versatile 777-300ER to fly long haul flights to South America, the US, Asia and Australia.
Boeing's reluctance or delay to go forward with the 777-8x and 777-9x stems from a fear that the new models may stunt demand for the 747-8, analysts say. If the larger 777 comes online Emirates would most likely be its launch customer. The Dubai-based carrier's fleet strategy would also change.
A relatively unbiased view in my opinion:
"Emirates’ experience with aircraft in this class has led it to prefer Boeing,” said Richard Aboulafia, vice president of Fairfax, Virginia-based Teal Group, an aviation consulting firm. "The A340 was a disaster, and the A380 is only useful as a way of maximising scarce slots. The 777 has been a very big success for Emirates, and they’ve become the biggest customer. In other words, even though the A350-1000 looks promising, it’s very much in Emirates’ interest to motivate Boeing with the prospect of large numbers.”
Emirates uses the versatile 777-300ER to fly long haul flights to South America, the US, Asia and Australia.
Boeing's reluctance or delay to go forward with the 777-8x and 777-9x stems from a fear that the new models may stunt demand for the 747-8, analysts say. If the larger 777 comes online Emirates would most likely be its launch customer. The Dubai-based carrier's fleet strategy would also change.
What a journey this has been JAA. First denial and anger, and now just a few short posts later on, acceptance. Good on you. I hope in some small way we were able to help.
Too bloody right about the Profit Cher (Peace be upon it).
Bypass,
Office dwellers say that once EK moves to the new airport (2025?) TC wants to ramp up to a 460 aircraft fleet. It would make sense that the majority would be 777s. Seems the first ER gets replaced in 2015/16 after the classics are gone, so Boeing should be kept in work for a long time yet.
The Don
Too bloody right about the Profit Cher (Peace be upon it).
Bypass,
Office dwellers say that once EK moves to the new airport (2025?) TC wants to ramp up to a 460 aircraft fleet. It would make sense that the majority would be 777s. Seems the first ER gets replaced in 2015/16 after the classics are gone, so Boeing should be kept in work for a long time yet.
The Don
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JAARule
Just a technical clarification to your post, you mention Airbus pilots affair with "...Gaelic automation..." and the resultant "...withering..." skills
I think you mean Gallic....as the Gaelic contribution to aviation excellence was in fact the Irish Concorde (aka Shorts 360) whose automation, I can assure you, was far superior to anything that came out of Toulouse!
; >
f.
Just a technical clarification to your post, you mention Airbus pilots affair with "...Gaelic automation..." and the resultant "...withering..." skills
I think you mean Gallic....as the Gaelic contribution to aviation excellence was in fact the Irish Concorde (aka Shorts 360) whose automation, I can assure you, was far superior to anything that came out of Toulouse!
; >
f.
Last edited by fliion; 10th Nov 2012 at 06:16.
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Mine is almost better than yours!
On a side note, departing yesterday we hear the a certain east coast Oz bound 380 request to hold....this followed on our Flightdeck (heavy crew) several wagers as to if it was going to do a 180 back to stand? anyone know anymore so that I can collect my winnings?
On a side note, departing yesterday we hear the a certain east coast Oz bound 380 request to hold....this followed on our Flightdeck (heavy crew) several wagers as to if it was going to do a 180 back to stand? anyone know anymore so that I can collect my winnings?
Think if every fault and diversion of every type was reported publically there might be a different impression of various types !
Back to the aircraft vs aircraft topic...
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The following happened on the same day.
Incident: Emirates A388 near Kosice on Nov 7th 2012, engine shut down in flight
By Simon Hradecky, created Saturday, Nov 10th 2012 21:31Z, last updated Saturday, Nov 10th 2012 21:31Z
An Emirates Airbus A380-800, registration A6-EDO performing flight EK-201 from Dubai (United Arab Emirates) to New York JFK,NY (USA), was enroute at FL340 about 30nm northeast of Kosice (Slovakia) when the crew shut the #4 engine (GP7270, outboard right hand) down. The aircraft set course in direction of Frankfurt/Main (Germany) descending to FL100, about 85nm east of Frankfurt the aircraft changed course to fly south around Frankfurt and divert to Paris (France). The aircraft landed safely on Charles de Gaulle Airport's runway 26R about 140 minutes after the engine was shut down.
A replacement Airbus A380-800 registration A6-EDM was dispatched from Dubai to Paris as flight EK-3073 and resumed flight EK-201 reaching New York with a delay of 12 hours.
A passenger reported the crew announced engine #4 had been shut down.
The incident aircraft was able to position to Dubai on Nov 8th as flight EK-7002 and resumed service about 35 hours after landing in Paris.
Incident: Emirates A388 near Kosice on Nov 7th 2012, engine shut down in flight
By Simon Hradecky, created Saturday, Nov 10th 2012 21:31Z, last updated Saturday, Nov 10th 2012 21:31Z
An Emirates Airbus A380-800, registration A6-EDO performing flight EK-201 from Dubai (United Arab Emirates) to New York JFK,NY (USA), was enroute at FL340 about 30nm northeast of Kosice (Slovakia) when the crew shut the #4 engine (GP7270, outboard right hand) down. The aircraft set course in direction of Frankfurt/Main (Germany) descending to FL100, about 85nm east of Frankfurt the aircraft changed course to fly south around Frankfurt and divert to Paris (France). The aircraft landed safely on Charles de Gaulle Airport's runway 26R about 140 minutes after the engine was shut down.
A replacement Airbus A380-800 registration A6-EDM was dispatched from Dubai to Paris as flight EK-3073 and resumed flight EK-201 reaching New York with a delay of 12 hours.
A passenger reported the crew announced engine #4 had been shut down.
The incident aircraft was able to position to Dubai on Nov 8th as flight EK-7002 and resumed service about 35 hours after landing in Paris.
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Personally, I just find myself completely unsurprised that donpizmeof is able to offer prison sex as an analogy he's had experience with.
But don, are you even on the 380 fleet? I thought you were on those 330 beauties. Hence my puzzlement on your calling out another's supposed lack of knowledge on the type...? Or is it just an Airbus fraternal circle-jerk thing where you get together regularly and swap amusing anecdotes that leads you to claim the inside track?
But your remarks about the 777F are noted, I suppose it WOULD be more poetic of there were an AB variant slinging 380 engines around the globe. Or moving the stranded pax from the breakdown du jour.
C'est la vie, as they say in Toulouse.
All in good fun!
The bun fight will be decided long after I've set the brake for the last time, thank dog.
But don, are you even on the 380 fleet? I thought you were on those 330 beauties. Hence my puzzlement on your calling out another's supposed lack of knowledge on the type...? Or is it just an Airbus fraternal circle-jerk thing where you get together regularly and swap amusing anecdotes that leads you to claim the inside track?
But your remarks about the 777F are noted, I suppose it WOULD be more poetic of there were an AB variant slinging 380 engines around the globe. Or moving the stranded pax from the breakdown du jour.
C'est la vie, as they say in Toulouse.
All in good fun!
The bun fight will be decided long after I've set the brake for the last time, thank dog.
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As an outsider loving the homoerotic back and forth here, I must say that there is no comparison between paxing in the 380 vs the 777.
I feel extremely cheated when flying on what is supposed to be the most modern, largest thing since sliced bread. Might as well be in a 319. Sad but true. They have nice screens though.
I feel extremely cheated when flying on what is supposed to be the most modern, largest thing since sliced bread. Might as well be in a 319. Sad but true. They have nice screens though.