EK Pay Review
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AC if you are here less than 10 years zip it, if you are here less than 8 shut up cos everybody knew then how EK treats its staff and that conditions are in decline, if you are here less than 6, I rest my case then you are just an idiot
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GMC1500. WRT your post #53. This pilot from sq, who joined ek. Are we talking fo or capt. Just that you jingled my curiosity. Me with a whole bunch of friends in the far east.
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I'm wondering if AC was the young foul-mouthed American F/O I flew with about 3 years ago. Guy had a gob and an attitude that was vile! He was told to can it...
Apologies AC if I've mistaken you from someone else! But he was from Michigan too
Apologies AC if I've mistaken you from someone else! But he was from Michigan too
Definitely at least one ex-SQ on A380. When I flew with him he was F/O, but I don't know if he was one in SQ as well, if that's what you're asking? He didn't seem 'old enough' to be a capt in SQ but maybe he just looks young for his age... not, of course, that there is any specific age for a captain... 
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What about setting up a pilot council perhaps through Epc? At least we would then be able to talk with one voice rather than just moaning. It's in all our interest for the company to do well so maybe we could contribute it doesn't have to be a negative thing for ek. Even If they don't listen it would give us a platform.
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Originally Posted by seat99k
What about setting up a pilot council perhaps through Epc? At least we would then be able to talk with one voice rather than just moaning. It's in all our interest for the company to do well so maybe we could contribute it doesn't have to be a negative thing for ek. Even If they don't listen it would give us a platform.
Don't even tar EPC with such a brush - the guys had enough difficulty setting it up originally; having to persuade 'management' that it was not in fact a u****.
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@King on a Wing,
I've heard at least two guys that came from the 380. And both are supposedly nationals, at least the one I met.
As for SQ mainline expats didn't they all get fired a while back and the only expats left are the ones on the cargo fleet. If not so sureley they won't be hireing any DEC expats any time soon to the mainline
@AC, even if Delta/Northwest would start hireng long haual DECs there's only about 300(US citizens) at EK who would be eligible to apply. That's why I try to compare with jobs I have a realistic chance of getting. SQ cargo might be one of them. EY, QR, KE, FR, TK and a bunch of F/O jobs in Eouro-zone. In that comparison EK's contract, for one like me with two children is one of the best...
I've heard at least two guys that came from the 380. And both are supposedly nationals, at least the one I met.
As for SQ mainline expats didn't they all get fired a while back and the only expats left are the ones on the cargo fleet. If not so sureley they won't be hireing any DEC expats any time soon to the mainline
@AC, even if Delta/Northwest would start hireng long haual DECs there's only about 300(US citizens) at EK who would be eligible to apply. That's why I try to compare with jobs I have a realistic chance of getting. SQ cargo might be one of them. EY, QR, KE, FR, TK and a bunch of F/O jobs in Eouro-zone. In that comparison EK's contract, for one like me with two children is one of the best...
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wet vee two
No, not at all. I just can't comprehend why people have such an obvious axe to grind against the Company yet still remain here. ac is a classic example. In fact, I too know exactly who he is having had the displeasure of sharing a car into work some time ago. He stood out for all the wrong reasons. 20 minutes of constant whinging and moaning from start to finish and several times a referral to all EK pilots as 'pussies'. Thank god I wasn't flying with him that day or else I would have off loaded myself.
ac
The fact that you consider yourself as an entirely separate entity from your EK colleagues merely confirms what a sad and bitter individual you are. Whilst you knock the majority pilot group for working here and being generally content, the irony is completely lost on you that you continue to endure such 'oppressive conditions' despite the ability to leave at your free will.
And no, I would not 'still be happy' if I received 30% less pay. If the pay had been that much less, I would not have come in the first place. For the record, my overall remuneration package is still greater than my peers at my previous airline although, unlike you, money is not my sole motivator.
Whilst we can choose to ignore your posts on these forums, the poor F/O's who have to endure your constant bitching in the cockpit can't. I pity them, almost as much as I pity you.
No, not at all. I just can't comprehend why people have such an obvious axe to grind against the Company yet still remain here. ac is a classic example. In fact, I too know exactly who he is having had the displeasure of sharing a car into work some time ago. He stood out for all the wrong reasons. 20 minutes of constant whinging and moaning from start to finish and several times a referral to all EK pilots as 'pussies'. Thank god I wasn't flying with him that day or else I would have off loaded myself.
ac
The fact that you consider yourself as an entirely separate entity from your EK colleagues merely confirms what a sad and bitter individual you are. Whilst you knock the majority pilot group for working here and being generally content, the irony is completely lost on you that you continue to endure such 'oppressive conditions' despite the ability to leave at your free will.
And no, I would not 'still be happy' if I received 30% less pay. If the pay had been that much less, I would not have come in the first place. For the record, my overall remuneration package is still greater than my peers at my previous airline although, unlike you, money is not my sole motivator.
Whilst we can choose to ignore your posts on these forums, the poor F/O's who have to endure your constant bitching in the cockpit can't. I pity them, almost as much as I pity you.
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Not to defend AC, but what he could be trying to say is, that the ENTIRE pay package and benefits fall way short of some of the legacy and other major airlines out there. To say that the EK is one of the top pilot packages in the world is off the mark. And AC will probably say that it was a huge mistake to leave DL/NWA when he did. Even with a full captain's monthly pay (say 12 yrs) and a full utilities allowance....it still falls short of being a leader in our industry. EK has made some of the top profits in the last few years in comparison, yet the package lags (including flying anywhere from 85-90 hrs/mo) with all leave not alocated and sick leave returned in ADs. Oh well.
Now what choice do we have? None, plain and simple. To call the EK pilots p*****s, is way off the mark.
What do you propose we do AC? It is a love or leave it situation we are all in. If we had a crystal ball, many would never have left from where we came. But we don't so we are here, and all we can do is grin and bear it. But please gents, don't think this is one of the better deals around. The problem is, for many of us, it is the best deal available because of senority, etc.
And finally, being from a European country just 5-8 hours away changes the game in comparison to those from N/S America and the Pacific islands. So it really is a perspective type of deal. A pilot from Zim., is going to have a different perspective of EK than if one is from the US. It really is apples and oranges.
So from my perspective, AC you're wrong in calling the EK pilots spineless and p*****s and I think you other guys are wrong in the love or leave it mentality and saying we have an industry leading deal. I'm the only one who is correct, in my perspective
of course.
Now what choice do we have? None, plain and simple. To call the EK pilots p*****s, is way off the mark.
What do you propose we do AC? It is a love or leave it situation we are all in. If we had a crystal ball, many would never have left from where we came. But we don't so we are here, and all we can do is grin and bear it. But please gents, don't think this is one of the better deals around. The problem is, for many of us, it is the best deal available because of senority, etc.And finally, being from a European country just 5-8 hours away changes the game in comparison to those from N/S America and the Pacific islands. So it really is a perspective type of deal. A pilot from Zim., is going to have a different perspective of EK than if one is from the US. It really is apples and oranges.
So from my perspective, AC you're wrong in calling the EK pilots spineless and p*****s and I think you other guys are wrong in the love or leave it mentality and saying we have an industry leading deal. I'm the only one who is correct, in my perspective
of course.
TU,
I don't actually see anyone here arguing that EK is a world leading gig. It has some huge advantages for a lot of us, and is better than is available in most of the world at the moment.
ACs idea that the reason we don't earn the same as a US lgacy major pilot is because we're spinless
Does he think US REGIONAL pilots are spinless whimps, when they work harder than us for a fraction of our pay?
I don't actually see anyone here arguing that EK is a world leading gig. It has some huge advantages for a lot of us, and is better than is available in most of the world at the moment.
ACs idea that the reason we don't earn the same as a US lgacy major pilot is because we're spinless
Does he think US REGIONAL pilots are spinless whimps, when they work harder than us for a fraction of our pay?
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US Legacy vs EK.
Just done upgrade training with some 30 something lads who have the potential of 20+ yrs in the left seat in EK, no direct taxation(yet!), free housing(if you want) etc etc.
Yes without doubt the headline salary figure for Legacy(read cp11 etc!) is higher but by the time a pilot achieves the Legacy mega bucks he will only have maybe 7 years on it maybe. minus tax , housing etc etc
So you take the money, you make your choice.
One thing is certain though, if you spend your life with anger and vitriol in your soul it will kill you early.
Keep it safe guys.
Just done upgrade training with some 30 something lads who have the potential of 20+ yrs in the left seat in EK, no direct taxation(yet!), free housing(if you want) etc etc.
Yes without doubt the headline salary figure for Legacy(read cp11 etc!) is higher but by the time a pilot achieves the Legacy mega bucks he will only have maybe 7 years on it maybe. minus tax , housing etc etc
So you take the money, you make your choice.
One thing is certain though, if you spend your life with anger and vitriol in your soul it will kill you early.
Keep it safe guys.
Last edited by alwayzinit; 19th May 2012 at 07:20.
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Originally Posted by alwayszinit
One thing is certain though, if you spend your life with anger and vitriol in your soul it will kill you early.
Keep it safe guys.
Keep it safe guys.
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Thanks for the thoughtful words TU. After staying up all night reflecting on another Red-Eye flight maybe the term of the female's atatomy describing the Emirates pilot group was harse or over the top. There is a preponerance of pilots that think Ek is a good deal and I in a frustrating way try to enlighten the Kool-Aid drinkers that there is a whole another world out there. Maybe my methods were not PC but I hope the message got through.
Wiz is a piece of work. I don't know why he keeps refering to the Regionals in the US. Maybe that is his skill set baseline or he is use to that kind of salary but there are just as many airlines in OZ similar to the US regionals however there are plenty more airlines in the US that pay far more than Wizo is use to. And yes the US regionals need to raise their game and demmands before that becomes the New Norm.
I fully realize that some of the pilots are stuck at Ek through either career decisions or false assumptions, I being the latter. But to defend a mediocre airline just because you have had nothing better or can't go anywhere is not in your profession's best interest. Who among us would not want $270 an hour plus the perks? I sincerely hope I can count on one hand how many EK pilots would not want to make that kind of coin. I try to make plain what the EK pilots are missing with terminology and contract itmes when compared to other international, wide body, legacy pilot's contracts.
Although I have been into TCAS' office more than the average EK pilot has ventured I am not optimistic about our chances of getting anything like a DL contract hence part of my frustration. Compound that with the usual suspects at Ek drinking the company Kool-Aid and not wanting to rock the boat and we will never get close to Industry Standard.
Wiz is a piece of work. I don't know why he keeps refering to the Regionals in the US. Maybe that is his skill set baseline or he is use to that kind of salary but there are just as many airlines in OZ similar to the US regionals however there are plenty more airlines in the US that pay far more than Wizo is use to. And yes the US regionals need to raise their game and demmands before that becomes the New Norm.
I fully realize that some of the pilots are stuck at Ek through either career decisions or false assumptions, I being the latter. But to defend a mediocre airline just because you have had nothing better or can't go anywhere is not in your profession's best interest. Who among us would not want $270 an hour plus the perks? I sincerely hope I can count on one hand how many EK pilots would not want to make that kind of coin. I try to make plain what the EK pilots are missing with terminology and contract itmes when compared to other international, wide body, legacy pilot's contracts.
Although I have been into TCAS' office more than the average EK pilot has ventured I am not optimistic about our chances of getting anything like a DL contract hence part of my frustration. Compound that with the usual suspects at Ek drinking the company Kool-Aid and not wanting to rock the boat and we will never get close to Industry Standard.
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AC,
With such a strong post ...we are all looking fwd to wishing you well @ your new gig at Delta...and good luck on the 777 upgrade in 2035...
The only way I am drinking your "kool- aid" and paying homage to the DAL pilots testiculos...
Is when they get the following..
...777 upgrade at 4 yr seniority
... 1st $100k tax free
...silver Chauffeur sedan to and from Atlanta airport from my house
... $50,000 per year to pay my mortgage
...a smile from the FG 1 more than once a decade
...cash per diem, envelope local currency on check in at hotel.
... Virtually free healthcare
How long have you been here? Lets say 4ish years...
YOU!(not us kool-aid drinkers) Signed a contract for 3% For three yrs
And in the last four yrs YOU have had a pay raise of 29% and bonuses of 29 weeks since May of 2008 which was not in YOUR contract (12% of pay raise was if we use 3% per year).
So grab your wheelbarrow, the one used by your Delta buddies, stick your nuts in it and enjoy the 1st class seat back...after all Nything less just wouldn't be ballsy ...now would it.
f.
With such a strong post ...we are all looking fwd to wishing you well @ your new gig at Delta...and good luck on the 777 upgrade in 2035...
The only way I am drinking your "kool- aid" and paying homage to the DAL pilots testiculos...
Is when they get the following..
...777 upgrade at 4 yr seniority
... 1st $100k tax free
...silver Chauffeur sedan to and from Atlanta airport from my house
... $50,000 per year to pay my mortgage
...a smile from the FG 1 more than once a decade
...cash per diem, envelope local currency on check in at hotel.
... Virtually free healthcare
How long have you been here? Lets say 4ish years...
YOU!(not us kool-aid drinkers) Signed a contract for 3% For three yrs
And in the last four yrs YOU have had a pay raise of 29% and bonuses of 29 weeks since May of 2008 which was not in YOUR contract (12% of pay raise was if we use 3% per year).
So grab your wheelbarrow, the one used by your Delta buddies, stick your nuts in it and enjoy the 1st class seat back...after all Nything less just wouldn't be ballsy ...now would it.
f.
Last edited by fliion; 19th May 2012 at 11:53.
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AC,
What would a year 1 FO at Delta make compared to a year 1 FO at EK if they both signed up today..?
Forget for a minute what a 30yr Delta 777 skipper makes. The world was a different place back then.
You can factor in the benefits that EK FO's get that the Delta FO's do not get, as per fliions' post, if you like.
Can someone also point me in the right direction of these great deals to be had..? because I just rang up Lufty and asked if I could join on their 380 fleet at year 20 seniority and they told me to kcuf off..!
What would a year 1 FO at Delta make compared to a year 1 FO at EK if they both signed up today..?
Forget for a minute what a 30yr Delta 777 skipper makes. The world was a different place back then.
You can factor in the benefits that EK FO's get that the Delta FO's do not get, as per fliions' post, if you like.
Can someone also point me in the right direction of these great deals to be had..? because I just rang up Lufty and asked if I could join on their 380 fleet at year 20 seniority and they told me to kcuf off..!
Last edited by Craggenmore; 19th May 2012 at 13:15.