Jack330

Unfortunately today they cancelled all the appointments they gave for the DEC positions. They say is only temporary... Nobody knows exactly what is going on, they are very short of pilots and Captains, they cannot upgrade as quick as they want because they have no pilots to replace the F/O upgrading to CPT. The thing is that who joins now as F/O will stay in the right seat for at least 6 years (if everything goes well) because they will (maybe)upgrade all those young guys that will stay for a long time...Who knows !! Anybody with fresh news about? I'll have some (serious source EK HR)info soon and I'll share with you

Jack330

Some DEC (the ones already flying on 777 for example) are sometime more experienced than EK FO first officers, second they are not recruiting many F/O but just a few, the pilots with an acceptable experience to replace the "upgrading" f/o are finished.... They hired everybody around and one year ago, to find the last ones they even lowered the minimum requirements !! There's nothing to babysit... DEC is a normal patch that usually they avoid but soon they will need them again, that's normal procedure.... DEC are not delaying anybody, if you read the email that HR wrote to the pilots you will understand....

ExDubai

ROFL

speedbirdhopeful1

Jack, do you actually work for EK? I can assure you the numbers of experienced 777 DEC's they recruited last time was tiny, single digits. Bar a couple of re-joiners and a couple of wide body operators, many were narrow body captains. The exodus of vastly experienced, wide body captains from legacy companies to EK didn't happen for some reason..

dubaigong

Look Guys,

It is not a problem at all to hire B737 and A320 captains to fly your B777 or A330/340.
This has been done and is still done at many european Airlines like ( KLM , Lufthansa , Air France , British Airways etc... )
What really matters is the level of skills and the quality of the traning given to the pilots.
Today , in my company I can say that I would not board a flight as a passenger with some of our 10000+ Hrs "experienced" captains while I will be very happy to seat behind with some of the recently upgraded First Officers and "in-house made" Second Officers.
It is also a question of discipline , following procedures , avoiding complacency and too much self confidence.
When in a previous life I have upgraded as an F/O from a small business jet to a B737 then from a B737 to a MD-11 I have not had any problem at all.
When later I have upgraded to the left seat of a B737 , everything went very smoothly ( thanks ONLY to my very good previous training and my self discipline )
Today , with 15000+ hours I still do my full take off briefing on the first flight of the day , do all my checklist according to procedures and brief in detail all my approaches , even back to home base.
But I can tell you that some very experienced and some new upgraded captain just skip too many things as they feel so good that they , wrongly , think that those SOPs and procedures are designed for the weak pilots , not for them.
Being a B737 captain , I have no doubt that I will not have any problem to upgrade on one of your wide body and perform with a good standard from the day one ( assuming that I have received a proper training )
Even some trainers ( TRE/TRi/LTC ) have made the worse mistakes reported in our ASRs so , experience a must ???

Jack330

Dubaigong, I agree with you 110% on everything.. I come from a major company where training and discipline was paramount and I know exactly what you're talking about.
I think about this when I send my family with other airlines ( the few that I trust) and I think that I could perfectly fit in, I'm very flexible and low profile.. You never stop learning even after 14000 hrs of flying.
All I was saying was that selecting people, calling them on the phone to arrange the screenings then cancelling everything in one day shows the seriousness of the management of Emirates... Everybody knows that in 2017/18 they will be even more short of Captains and pilots and they will open again.. All the First Officers will be upgraded but they will need copilots for the rest of time so, what happens when the pilots are no longer available ? They will fly the airplanes with only one captain ?
I'd really would like to know who's opening for DEC's then closing then opening.. Is ridicolous !!!!

ExDubai

Amen! When I'm looking to the reduced requirements and the number of pilots needed I do have some doubts regarding the amount of training needed. If you lower the bar you need to enhance the training capabilities. A lot of experience left during the last years....

tomuchwork

Talking/Writing about the last 3 posts here.

What are you guys talking about? Of course SOP's have to be followed, a briefing should be given on EACH sector(how full it has to be is another cup of tea, we have guys in our company briefing for 30 mins and then I want to see what the other guy remembers if the sh** hits the fan).
Strict adherence to checklists should be normal like brushing your teeth in the morning and evening.

Normally you just find this type of people(have by themself this good attitude or being forced by company culture is a diiferent discussion) in any reasonable airline. Simply because the company does not want to see one of their more or less shiny planes sitting upside down at or around some airport making very negative publicity.

I do not think(believe) that someone WITHOUT that mindset even would make it past any serious airline interview(there are always this special companies that never have enough pilots even without expanding), especially EK or some of the other ME big players. I rememeber QR - you could be ****tiest pilot on earth(most likely still the case if you look into some incidents/accidents) BUT you had to know the SOP's and the OM-A even I waked up from your deepest dreams at night. Even with lousy flying skills you would get "Qatari Standard"(lol) at the end of your Sim Check(does this grade still exist?). That's another extreme that is not helping to ensure safety.

Previous aircraft type size for sure does NOT matter - got my first widebody command with QR a long long time ago, flying before just medium jets(but talking about 7000hrs + jet). And I never had problems handling that boring bus. It's like driving a train, have your plan set up about the next couple of steps in advance and it will never bite you. I actually had in an application with EK, but honestly, the lack of any medium jet in their fleet made me reconsider what I want to do with the rest of my flying life, so I withdrew. Apart of course from the fact that I really like to have my good nights sleep ^^.

Still prefer flying my medium size jets again, much more fun, more challenge. But that's a personal choice. Still remember my young days sitting as FO on a medium jet flying into often a bit tricky airports(e.g. Innsbruck, depending on the weather as well Salzburg - circling at minimum wx,...). With our long time captains on that fleet it was easy, no issue at all. Then you had this guys, FO longrange, promoted Captain short/mediumrange - sometimes a disaster. I actually had to do the calls because our tiny(in comparison) jet was just way to fast for this guy(s) - not talking about the airport that then finally gave them the rest(but not all of them, but a good share had problems). Just another proof for me that size absolutely does NOT matter(well ok, in one case it matters ;-) ).

Using SOP's, Checklists and proper (but not toooooo proper) briefings are not a choice. My opinion as well of course.


So, everyone with decent jet time and interested in big airliners and still being young and having no trouble with continuous nightflying should clearly give it a try. Would be a win win situation for company and pilot.

migair54

Anyone can tell me how long does it take to get a joining date after doing the interview in Dubai?? With one month notice in present company.
Because in my case everything has been pretty quick, it seems they are in hurry to find people.

Jack330

They are in a hurry to find first officers to replace the upgrading FO...Who joins now will stay in the right seat for 7/8 years... If you're 25 then is ok !!

flareflyer

Jack
So hiring dec would be fair to those waiting 7/8 years??

migair54

if you think a bit about it 7 or 8 years is a bit long, but I know people in Iberia that join 11 or 12 years ago and they are still very far to become captain.

It's not fair to hire DEC but sometimes is necessary due to circumstances, but as someone as said before the number is very very low, so no much issue here.

AviatoR21

Questions isn't time to command, its how long you can stay or should I put it customise to living in Dubai? Good luck.

TypeIV

Business is business guys.

Join a LCC and get a quick upgrade with max annual hrs and then go as a DEC after a few years if being a captain is the important thing, however I do understand the frustration of being shafted for staying loyal.

It's a game where you have to think about yourself and remember that loyalty shown is forgotten the next morning and only is regarded as being naive by the bean counters.

120feet

I think this is an interesting time at EK. If you are joining now there may not be a command for you. Certainly on the 380 as they still need to take all the 330 Captains and FO's from there plus ALL the current FO's will still be in front of you. Command could easily be 15+ years away. On the 777, command time will be very far away also. However, if the current attrition rate continues on the 777 then it may be sooner. But if EK puts the pilot package where it should be +25% increase and more importantly change of rostering and credit hours then attrition may slow to a crawl. Remember cost of living goes up about 10% a year here that plus a 5% VAT means anything less then a 15% pay raise translates to a pay cut. Pay cuts for EK pilots have been going on for the past 8 years with no sign of that changing. You will read a lot of posters complaining about being able to survive on FO $ with a family. If you choose to go to EK it must be very seriously considered you may never see command at EK. IMHO

MikeHoncho

I was doing the online application. I know the min requirements for FO are 2000hrs with take off weight >20T or 3000 between 10 and 20T. I have 3100 total of which 2400 on the Boeing C17 as PIC. In the Job specific questions they ask you these;

To be considered for direct entry on the A380, please indicate if you have the following:
3000 hours or more on a multi-crew multi-engine jet above 50T
Current on a fly-by-wire Airbus aircraft with 1500 hours or more
None of the above

and

Please indicate which of the following aircraft types you currently fly:
Airbus 319/20/30/40/80 (any variant)
Boeing 737NG/747/757/767/777/787 (and EFIS variants)
CRJ or Embraer
Avro RJ EFIS
Turbo Prop > 20t/MTOW
None of the above

Basically in my case it's 2 times None of the above. Could this mean my application is not taken into consideration even though I have 2400 hrs of which 2000 PIC hrs on a Wide Body Jet. Or can I consider the C17 one of the Boeing EFIS variants?

Who can give me any insight in this?

Many Thanks!!

donpizmeov

Some years ago they stopped taking military only hours. May have changed, but I haven't seen any military fellas for a long time.

MikeHoncho

I know before it was indeed mentioned in the old requirements 4000 total hrs of which min 2500 on a modern commercial aircraft or something along that line.
But now it's just min 2000 hrs so I see no reason why I can't apply.

donpizmeov

I see your point. So just find where it says C17 and tick that.

MikeHoncho

Well I could add C17 in the beginning where you fill in Work Experience but these 2 questions were at the end of the application process. They have tick marks in front of them so those are the only options you have at that pount