EK Slip N Slide!
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EK Slip N Slide!
EK 029 which was diverted to BHX.
Wonder if the Pilot will get a lotta stick from our Managers for this incident!
BBC News - Emirates jet stuck in grass at Birmingham Airport
Wonder if the Pilot will get a lotta stick from our Managers for this incident!
BBC News - Emirates jet stuck in grass at Birmingham Airport
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Obviously too early to establish the facts yet, but I hope EK don't rush to apportion blame before assessing all the evidence. Especially bearing in mind the press are reporting that the crew took the turn too late... According to expert passengers anyway.
The thing is that snow covered taxiways and taxiway edges are very difficult to identify when using the gear cameras. The quality isn't quite high enough definition, and it is even apparent in bright sunlight when the taxiway Tarmac and the non-load-bearing part of the apron are similar colours and textures. It's difficult to identify both the centreline and the edge markings. Quite often the cleared snow is dumped across the edge lighting which then becomes buried and useless.
I really hope the Company take a common-sense approach to this incident if this is indeed what has happened. It's extremely unusual circumstances for crews who are mostly inexperienced in these sort of conditions. The extremely tight taxiways at UK regional airports don't help either, especially on such a long bird as the 300ER.
The thing is that snow covered taxiways and taxiway edges are very difficult to identify when using the gear cameras. The quality isn't quite high enough definition, and it is even apparent in bright sunlight when the taxiway Tarmac and the non-load-bearing part of the apron are similar colours and textures. It's difficult to identify both the centreline and the edge markings. Quite often the cleared snow is dumped across the edge lighting which then becomes buried and useless.
I really hope the Company take a common-sense approach to this incident if this is indeed what has happened. It's extremely unusual circumstances for crews who are mostly inexperienced in these sort of conditions. The extremely tight taxiways at UK regional airports don't help either, especially on such a long bird as the 300ER.
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Quote from one of the witnesses...classic!
I wonder what the 'rocking it loose' procedure is in the B777 checklist!?? Perhaps get all the pax on one wing and jump up and down!
One man told the broadcaster: "The plane was taxiing to the gate and the pilot appeared to cut the right hand turn a little too close and his main, right landing gear was off the tarmac in the mud, sinking.
"I looked out and it was about 8in (20cm) [deep]. They did appear to try to rock it loose."
"I looked out and it was about 8in (20cm) [deep]. They did appear to try to rock it loose."
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Originally Posted by F3S
I wonder what the 'rocking it loose' procedure is in the B777 checklist!??
Seriously though - let's hope our esteemed leaders act with common sense here and don't screw these fellahs over
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Let's hope that TCAS see's the human side (and remembers what support is and not what control does). Let us also hope that Clarke wasn't looking out of his window and wants to make another point or media score.
puts it back into context that the 300ER is a BIG aeroplane , and because they are now a regular visitor to some not so big airfields perhaps it gets forgotten when asking crews to take some non normal routing to get them to a stand[several?] that they werent expecting . As in GLA before one would assume you wouldnt be asked to do something there isnt space to do ?? how hard would it be in this day and age to put the info through a computer programme and show what can and cant be done on each intersection etc and highlight for the type. probably cost a lot lest than the cost of one of these incidents. By the way i dont know the cause of this incident so am only commenting based on rumours.
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bvcu - for your info EK operate the 777-300ER operates into BHX TWICE EVERY day anyway, so it's not like it's 'new'.....
Just cr@p conditions.... Heck - Virgin had a 346 slide off their very familiar runway at LHR a few winters back
Just cr@p conditions.... Heck - Virgin had a 346 slide off their very familiar runway at LHR a few winters back
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It's extremely unusual circumstances for crews who are mostly inexperienced in these sort of conditions.
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Quote:
It's extremely unusual circumstances for crews who are mostly inexperienced in these sort of conditions.
Really? Winter ops should be familiar territory for an airline with worldwide ops. It's a taxi incident, that's all. Well, being a ME carrier, there is no way to know how EK will react.
It's extremely unusual circumstances for crews who are mostly inexperienced in these sort of conditions.
Really? Winter ops should be familiar territory for an airline with worldwide ops. It's a taxi incident, that's all. Well, being a ME carrier, there is no way to know how EK will react.
EK may operate to all corners of the globe, but it's quite feasible that a pilot on the 777 who does 4-5 trips a month may not see true winter ops at all during his EK career... Especially bearing in mind that of the 90 or so destinations only maybe 10 are potential winter ops conditions and then only likely to be so on the odd occasion during the year.
Would be interesting to get some replies on this thread to estimate just how many people have taxied on snow covered taxiways during their time with EK.
What's your advice and technique for taxiing on very narrow, snow covered taxiways where the centreline and/or edge markings are not discernible? If you don't mind sharing.
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He's not gonna share anything since his posts are full of arrogance. Pretty sure he doesn't have many friends.
Mfan
Mfan
Last edited by Murrenfan; 22nd Dec 2010 at 22:27. Reason: Typing
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What's your advice and technique for taxiing on very narrow, snow covered taxiways where the centreline and/or edge markings are not discernible? If you don't mind sharing.
Most western EK (OK, not Gods gift to aviation from down under) expat crew must have seen snow before. You operate the 777 to Europe and the US, so winter should be something to expect.
Don't tell me you send guys into winter conditions without sound knowledge about HOT, BA, Type 1,2,4, engine runups and so on?
Last edited by ManaAdaSystem; 22nd Dec 2010 at 23:29.
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Doesn't seem to be much 'Slip N Slide' about it, looking at the wheel tracks in the photos.
Looks like it might be at the very tight turn from TWY E towards the usual gate - greater than 90°, and easy to be unsighted in the opposite seat. Viz in the photos looks OK. 20/20 hind sight says taking/requesting the longer route to the gate might have been a better option.
One point of note: the majority of FO's I have flown with on the 777 in recent years (many of whom are now or will soon be captains) demonstrated ignorance of the correct cues when taxiing and turning through 90° or more, with the potential end result exactly as seen here.
Standby for taxi practice at the next PPC.
TM
Looks like it might be at the very tight turn from TWY E towards the usual gate - greater than 90°, and easy to be unsighted in the opposite seat. Viz in the photos looks OK. 20/20 hind sight says taking/requesting the longer route to the gate might have been a better option.
One point of note: the majority of FO's I have flown with on the 777 in recent years (many of whom are now or will soon be captains) demonstrated ignorance of the correct cues when taxiing and turning through 90° or more, with the potential end result exactly as seen here.
Standby for taxi practice at the next PPC.
TM
Have a look at some pics in the photo news section of the BHX b log spot and judge for yourself.
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No protection.
No cross examination.
One day you are there, the next you are screwed at the discretion of habibi.
Emirates = a life of terror
No cross examination.
One day you are there, the next you are screwed at the discretion of habibi.
Emirates = a life of terror
Last edited by sheikmyarse; 23rd Dec 2010 at 07:31.
