EK407 - Tailstrike YMML 20 March
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EK has 327 aircraft? Exceptionally well researched - like the rest of the article. The second laptop has been installed for how long?
Concerning the second laptop, I wouldn't go there Machi. Most 777-300ERs/200LRs were nicely equipped with two ECBs, so individual computing and handy crosschecking (trsf button) were a dream and as safe as it can get.
WHO TOOK THEM OUT ON THE LATEST MODELS? Yes, you guessed right: EK. Because some chart provider was some dirhams cheaper, it got the job over the other that was collaborating with Boeing. Now the new system is not fully compatible with the onboard one and, magic, due to greed we are back with the two loose, cheap and unsafer laptops.
"Always best practice and safety for passengers and crew is our utmost concern...." My a$$
Now go back to the cosy office chair and close to ED, dear Machi ......
Join Date: Jul 2000
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ok eklawyer - I see that you're specifying the trans-Tasman portion of those rotations... Yes - Bl00dy tiring, especially that 2nd day.. I find a couple of cold cokes helps although it shouldn't be that way!!!!!
Rascott - no, the crew doing the heavy sectors are just DXB-MEL-DXB.
Rascott - no, the crew doing the heavy sectors are just DXB-MEL-DXB.
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
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Fatbus said
A reference to fatigue as a factor came from the answer to a question at the press conference given by the ATSB.
Go to
http://www.atsb.gov.au/newsroom/2009..._AO2009012.mp3
Listening to the actual answer, it was along the lines that at the stage of the investigation it appeared unlikely that fatique was an issue for a number of reasons, which were outlined
EKpilot,
I did not say fatigue was not as issue, just pointed out that no one seems to complain about that rotation.
let the ATSB determine if fatigue was a factor
I did not say fatigue was not as issue, just pointed out that no one seems to complain about that rotation.
let the ATSB determine if fatigue was a factor
A reference to fatigue as a factor came from the answer to a question at the press conference given by the ATSB.
Go to
http://www.atsb.gov.au/newsroom/2009..._AO2009012.mp3
Listening to the actual answer, it was along the lines that at the stage of the investigation it appeared unlikely that fatique was an issue for a number of reasons, which were outlined
Join Date: Apr 2008
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hi all!
at first, sorry for my totally outsiderhood, i'm "just" an aviation-fan - knowing a very little in flight deck-things.
after reading posts in this thread and the various news, press releases about this incident, some questions raised within my head.
1. why is this computer used / and all this weight-input into computers prior take-off? am i correct if i say that the aircraft takes off "automatically", with the help of all these computers? (of course said in a very vulgar-amateur way)
2. if yes, so it means that it's not the pilots who handle the throttle and so the performance of the engines? or am i wrong?
4. wouldn't be nice to remove some of the computers from the flight deck and let pilots fly the birds?
thanks in advance, i'm eager to answers!
at first, sorry for my totally outsiderhood, i'm "just" an aviation-fan - knowing a very little in flight deck-things.
after reading posts in this thread and the various news, press releases about this incident, some questions raised within my head.
1. why is this computer used / and all this weight-input into computers prior take-off? am i correct if i say that the aircraft takes off "automatically", with the help of all these computers? (of course said in a very vulgar-amateur way)
2. if yes, so it means that it's not the pilots who handle the throttle and so the performance of the engines? or am i wrong?
4. wouldn't be nice to remove some of the computers from the flight deck and let pilots fly the birds?
thanks in advance, i'm eager to answers!
Join Date: Apr 2008
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SNAM,
hey, thanks for the answer! great!
yep, the idea of fuel saving was in my head as well.
there are some points wich are totally dark for me, but i'm really eager to understand what happened in the cockpit during these seconds! apart from the fact that is mentioned everywhere, called "fatigue", wich i understand and feel with you all, totally.
so, the pilots are controlling the acceleration, okey.
my other question is what happened during acceleration?
i found this: "The first officer flying the aircraft unsuccessfully tried to rotate in accordance with the calculations and, when the aircraft did not respond, the captain applied take-off/go-around (TOGA) power to lift off (...)" (flightglobal.com)
the throttle wasn't responding, or the first officer just tried to rotate with the yoke without adding more throttle?
did they realize that aircraft is too slow, not accelerating as "usual"? i mean before doing TOGA?
isn't it possible to intervene anytime, anywhere with throttle arm, to give more power to engines?
thanks in advance!
z
hey, thanks for the answer! great!
yep, the idea of fuel saving was in my head as well.
there are some points wich are totally dark for me, but i'm really eager to understand what happened in the cockpit during these seconds! apart from the fact that is mentioned everywhere, called "fatigue", wich i understand and feel with you all, totally.
so, the pilots are controlling the acceleration, okey.
my other question is what happened during acceleration?
i found this: "The first officer flying the aircraft unsuccessfully tried to rotate in accordance with the calculations and, when the aircraft did not respond, the captain applied take-off/go-around (TOGA) power to lift off (...)" (flightglobal.com)
the throttle wasn't responding, or the first officer just tried to rotate with the yoke without adding more throttle?
did they realize that aircraft is too slow, not accelerating as "usual"? i mean before doing TOGA?
isn't it possible to intervene anytime, anywhere with throttle arm, to give more power to engines?
thanks in advance!
z
Join Date: Apr 1999
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OK--too make it simple......pilot applies power to a set amount. This amount may be less then max/TOGA, if the aircraft is lighter than maximum. Pilots calculated take off speeds and power setting (below max) with the wrong weight (lower than actual).
So the speeds were set for a very much LOWER weight than the aircraft actually was. AT rotation time the aircraft did not fly because it was too heavy for the weights being used.
At some point pilots realized there was a problem and applied TOGO/MAX power.
So the speeds were set for a very much LOWER weight than the aircraft actually was. AT rotation time the aircraft did not fly because it was too heavy for the weights being used.
At some point pilots realized there was a problem and applied TOGO/MAX power.
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Sorry if this has been covered already, I haven't read all 200+ posts. I heard a rumor last night that one of the pilots involved, once returning to his home country filed a wrongful dismissal lawsuit against EK. EK fearing all their dirty laundry would be exposed, settled. Any truth to this?
