what-to-do

Rewind a little,

The point being made was that a small number of pilots from the same country were let go recently. By all accounts their ability in the SIM did not match their experience (on paper). Further investigations revealed discrepancies in their paperwork and the pilots were terminated (not literally).

Now, apart from a post from Blue system, who posted something which was rather unkind, divisive and yes, even racist, the thread is just reflecting the issue I make reference to.

However, this is not the first time something like this has happened here at FZ. I am happy to be corrected on this, but a similar situation occurred 4-5 years ago, with pilots from the very same country.

A quick google search will reveal a plethora of articles relating to pilots in India with fake licenses. Most of these articles are written by Indian newspapers, is that racist? Now, if the Indian government and the DGCA admit that this is an issue, why is this subject taboo on a pilot forum?

Indian skies safe despite 'fake' pilots, says regulator

India may have 4000 'fake' pilots

dubaigong

MusingMonk


There is an interesting article in the Gulf News ( Tuesday March 31 , page A22 ) about cheating during exams in Indian schools.
It seems to be a national sport , maybe you should write to the Gulf News to point out how racist they are...

LostinT2DXB

Just to be fair, the company has also kicked at least one Serbian pilot to the curb for lying about his hours. In general the company avoids hiring Russians, and very few Austronaughts. Is it racism, bias, or just good business

masalama

Vortex thing, fair enough , a much more balanced post I must say.
As more indian pilots join the like of the big three and other smaller carriers in the ME , these issues will get sorted out I'm sure.
The lure of the money on offer and a chance to escape the bureaucracy and craziness that is India will always tempt pilots from here as can be seen from the recent roadshow EK had at delhi ....
Masalama 👍👍

Mr Boombastick

Hi,

Does anyone know if things are moving for Type Rated FO's?

Not been much said on this thread about it for a while.

Thanks

cccc

Hi,
I don't know about type-rated FO's...
I know that for the time being there are no start dates planned for non type-rated FO's, till further notice. Everybody is being put in the holding pool...
I know this, because I've been put in this holding pool.
But things can change quickly...

JACK14

Hello CCCC how long have you been in the holding pool ???

cccc

I've been swimming for a month in the holding pool

Skud Run

Last year, me and a few guys were held in the pool for almost 6 months with no word when to expect a start. Then BAM, you start in 3 weeks. So good luck.

Piloto2011

Hello there, I meet all their requirements save the 1,000 hours EFIS but am now building these hours. Has anyone intel on when is the earliest one can apply? I am asking because some carriers accept applications from applicants short of a few hundred hours so long those are flown while going through selection and possibly swiming in holding pool. Many thanks for help.

henriksch

Quick question for the FD pilots?
Knowing that it only happened twice, bit did FD ever share any of their profits like EK (sometimes) do?

Vortex Thing

Piloto
The system has a computer as a gate guardian. It has not been given any variables to my knowledge only aboslutes.

When you apply if you put that you have 800hrs and it requires 1000 hrs you will simply be rejected. However you will have an application number, you can update that application and therefore though some carriers encourage you to apply when you are close the reality is that your CV wont pop up at CTC or any form of human filter until you reach the number that the firm has set.

Trust me I know how frustrating it is to be 1/2 or 3 hundred hours short of something and have seemingly no way to get the hours you need to get the interview. I also know that it is catch 22 if you don't have the hours you can't apply, the airline is desperate for hours and you just want the job. The even more harsh reality being that you will likely not be a different pilot at 1001 hrs than you were at 999hrs.

The facts however are simple, the world is not fair, life is not fair and fdb mirrors the world and life combined. Get the hours, apply and get in the queue. You'll be surprised how quickly you get them. It took some of us 10 yrs to get a job like this you will get your chance whenyour number comes up.

Henriksch
We don't do financial motivation here. If you're coming as an FO the be prepared to save nothing but live an okay life, in fact better than home okay but wiht its drawbacks. If you're coming as a captain then expect to make enough to live a nice life and deal with the future from the small remaining surplus( if you have children) If you are single and or have no kids then welcome to Cash Cow Airlines. Re profit share, really sore point along with pay rises this year.

Next thign you will be asking if we can park in a car park at work?


Good Luck
VT

Horntail

Henriksch,

Two years ago the company awarded three weeks of basic pay as a bonus based on the results of the fiscal year 2012. Since then a profit share scheme has been established but the company hasn't met the targets for the last couple of years. Are the targets realistic? Well, there are different opinions on that.

Furthermore and in all fairness: You will be able to live a good life and also put away money. Even if you are an F/O. Myself: Four bed house, two kids in school, two cars, traveling abroad at least 2-3 times a year and putting away money.

HT

flyingcamel

Mr Boombastic,

When I started, we were 4 non TR and 4 TR. One of the TR applicants was called at a weeks notice (ish) as they had a drop out. I believe this is fairly common so it will depend on your current notice period as to whether you may get a short notice call. If you have no notice period or a very short one give them a call regularly, you may be in luck!

As an aside, two of the TR'd guys were SJ LHS. Both are extremely switched on guys and I for one am looking forward to flying the line with the both of them.

Piloto2011

Vortex,

Thank you very much.

Like the ones you already pointed out, I am also closing in on ten years working towards meeting FD's requirement to get a shot at an interview. I am also aware that the 1,000 hours on plus 10 tons is an absolute in the application. What I would like to know is, if one, say puts 1,000 in the application but is sitting at 800, regularly flying and can expect to have reached the 1,000 in say four months, will that be frowned upon, or worse, disqualify the applicant?

I am aware from previous companies I worked for that they considered applications from pilots short a couple hundred hours and if successful at the interview just asked them to fly the remaining hours and get back in touch with them as soon as they had them done.

What do you think?

NGFellow

Do not put hours or any qualification on ANY application that you don't currently possess. This is for any job, and yes it will disqualify you. You are certifying the submitted application at some point in the process and this would be considered fraud.

tuti

Hey guys has anybody had first interview in Dubai?
I have been invited for the interview trough CTC wondering they going to do same test as in UK?

Vortex Thing

NG Fellow

Harsh word fraud! Let's look at that here is a defenition I found I am sure there are others as the jurisdiction would determine the interpretation of what fraud actually is in any give time and place. For now however we have:-

The term 'fraud' is generally defined in the law as an intentional misrepresentation of material existing fact made by one person to another with knowledge of its falsity and for the purpose of inducing the other person to act, and upon which the other person relies with resulting injury or damage.

If Piloto2011 were to put that he had 1000hrs in order to progress the application. There has to be a differentiation between what the firm needs him/her to have when they sit in the seat of one of our planes (which is likely driven by an insurance and/or GCAA requirement) AND the requirement laid out by the recruiter who likely hasn't really put much thought into the fact that opening some form of leeway i.e 10% or so will actually help them by getting pilots in at 1001hrs as opposed to sitting there saying there are no applicants.

Just take a look at the unifying clause in the definition. The fact of saying one has 1000hrs knowing it to be materially untrue is not fraudulent. However inducing someone to rely on that fact i.e letting you start employment knowing it to be false is a different matter.

If the clear and honest intention of what you are doing here is that you fly for an airline where you fly 80hrs a month and are 160hrs short and you are simply saying that I will have your requirements when I start that is very different from saying that you have it right now knowing that you are unemployed and will not have any more hours when you arrive.

This is not to in any way condemn or suggest you do that merely saying that it is no more fraud then telling someone you consider their wife's cooking to be great than unreality it is nothing of the sort. The devil is in your motivation and the fact that there is no one you can approach who is not a computer who you can have a reasonable conversation with. This is why many airlines Emirates amongst them say apply and keep on doing so and when you get to the correct (or an acceptable number) they will call you.

Sadly flydubai do not have the ability to try and see the future and even though everyone here will tell you we are running short of pilots you will not find anyone sensible enough in recruitment to actually help you in your situation.

To be honest I don't know where you are now but there are airlines that will take you with 500hrs on type so why don't you go to Pegasus, THY etc for a year and then come here if you cannot easily get the hours you are after?

NinER fIveR

It's worth noting that when you apply to FZ they do not really check/verify your credentials until AFTER you pass the 1st day screening (the non-sim part). I know for a FACT that not having all the requirements at interview is not an automatic disqualifier, as long as you can explain to FZ/CTC that you are in the process of obtaining them and expect to have them within a reasonable timeframe that is acceptable to them. However, if you are successful do not expect a contract offer or a start date until you check all the boxes and are ready for FZ to verify them. Good luck

Piloto2011

By the time I expect to have built the 1,000 hours on heavier stuff, and therefore qualify for an interview, it will have taken me over ten years, from the time I went up in a glider on my first training flight, that is. Ten years of sacrifice and hard work during which I also learned about FZ. Following this thread and researching the Internet, FZ has become the company I want to work for after my current job. So, when I finally get to meeting their requirements, I would like to give it my very best shot and not jeopardize it over a couple hundred hours or a few months. Showing fraudulent behavior would be the very last thing I would like to do - as it's not me - and which is why I came on here first to hear from people in the know. If there is a way to do so, I think it's perfectly legitimate to want to speed up the process, no?

Vortex, Thank you. I guess you are referring to me with suggesting to join another 737 carrier first. The thing is, I am not rated on the 737 yet so unfortunately I have to stick with what I have right now. That said, don't get me wrong, I actually really like the plane and ops I am on right now. But: it's not a 737 which is what I would like to fly eventually.

Niner fiver, Sorry but a "reasonable timeframe" would be six months?