Soap Box Cowboy

Anyone know when they are doing the next round of recruiting?

sandman2009

Dear colleagues. It’s time to bring some reality to this conversation. We from FZ work for an Arabic Company, in the Middle East. It’s owned by Arabs. And most managed by Indians, in the daily operations. So tell me what did you expect when you joined it? The same conditions that you had in Europe or US? Come on! If someone decides to go to Kandahar or Kabul, do you think this is a call from David Ray, James Vial or even Ken Guile? Of course not...It comes from upstairs...way upstairs.
The only thing our bosses can do is try to minimize the impact on the pilot and cabin crew group,but not because they are nice or because they care about us.Just to avoid more headaches to them, that’s all.
And for those that are saying that won’t go to Kandahar or Kabul or Erbil, what about your colleague who is going to be called in your place? Do you think this is fair? And in case your insurance company does not cover the places we fly to, sorry my friend, it’s time to change the insurance company or your job.

StuckinFZ

All for changing job my friend. But we happen to have a bond. All i said was that the guys should be compensaten by mean of more flight pay, and there would be enough bend over backwards leeches to cover the route!

I joined fz because of american management in leading flight ops positions hoping they would be good to work with! The famous Southwest of the Middle East is looking more and more like the aviation joke of the millenium!

Our dear CP have seem fit to start personal vendettas against crew because of trivial stuff and there is no Arabic "reason" for this. It is BAD management. Not "arabic" management.

sandman2009

Sorry but that’s the reality we’re living, didn’t say I agree with it. And sincerely I don’t think that’s much we can do to change it... people will come, people will go, and life goes on...
But I completely agree with stuckinFZ about payment increase. But this time for everyone and not only for part of the group.

StuckinFZ

Starving children in africa, pollution killing the planet etc etc. These things are happening. Not comparable with fz management but one ting in common. Giving up and say, this is life deal with it it, is the most dangerous thing to do. If we bend over and accept anything thing will be bad. For sure we can not directly impact the crap. As long as the said leeches of the industry let it happen. To plead ignorance is as bad though.

dubaigong

Sandman,

I don't fully agree with your statement "I don't think that's much we can do to change it"
There is always something we can do about it , it is more do we really want to do something ?
Tell me what will or can they do if we ALL say we are not going to Kandahar ?
Fire everybody ?
They will have to start talking with us and find a solution BUT of course we need to ALL agree on what we want and that's where the problem start.
Some pilots does not see the problem to go there and even said to the chief pilot that they have done it before and it was not a problem.
So I don't find it unfair to let them go and stay home if I have a problem going there because I find it totally unsafe...
When the security is as good as they can not avoid the president's brother to be killed another to blow himself during the funeral , how can I trust the company saying to me that it is safe to fly there ?
Just to remind you also that when we joined we have been told that our main market would be India and the subcontinent BUT never say anything about Kabul , Kandahar etc...

StuckinFZ

dubaigoing is totally on the money. I do not see why the company can not even have the decency to ASK us, or communicate this in a more respectful way.

I have never felt less respected by any person or company than now with flydubai. Just because you pay someone a salary mean you have the right to their life.......

Constant roster changes etc. is in a bit the same problem. When you on STBY finishing at 3PM you suddenly find yourself with a nightflight signing in at 7 pm!!!!!! So how can you plan a life?

How can you even say that the problem is with the insurance companies?????? Some of these companies are world leading. And the Premium to cover us in Kandahar is HUGE!!!! Same as getting coverage for a climb to mount everest etc......!!! Who is paying for the added COST of the insurance then?

And that JOKE of a medical insurance will not even cover me if I go back home to the USA.........

skysod

Purely on the life insurance aspect, called my company (Legal & General) today and was amazed to be informed that I am covered in Khandaha at no extra charge!! Not sure if this applies only to existing policies though!

jonbj

hi dear colleagues,
actually iam fo in a leading airline in north africa but unfortunatly with no career perspective. I have almost 5000h on B737. I have been invited for an interview end of august in dubai. i will really appreciate if someone could give me some infos about the process in dxb because i dont know what to expect there. do you have an idea of how long is to be upgraded?
thank you very much. Fly safe.

jonbj

thanks for the reply! i ve read all the posts but no information about the process in dubai (is it different of ctc process?) If you have some infos please PM. My choice is already done if i am successful at FD. I am fed up of being considerated as "foreigner" by local captain and flying more almost 100h/month without career perspective.
Fly safe

StuckinFZ

Just because you are tired of you current job dont mean you have to come to fz. There are plenty of options. Ey, ek, qr. Etc etc. Unless you failed all of those airline screenings. As they do it properly. The only reason to join fz should be that it it the last job on earth. Look up pprune tread about kandahar

Diz

Hi All,
Just got an email from FZ .They want me to choose UK or DXB for the assessment for Aug.
But after hearing about all the excitement and perills that Fz crew have to go through I'm a bit unsure about having a career over there.Think I'll just stay where I am. Eventhough the pay I earn now is half of what FZ pay...not willing to fly to a danger zone .
And another thing is all the expenses for going to DXB is on our own..No thanks.

All the best.

dubaigong

Dear Diz,

I would not be too disappointed if I was you about the difference in salary...
You say that you get around half of what FZ is offering , are you sure ?
The basic for a captain per month is around 4600 Euros , the housing and transport allowances around 3000 Euros and the sector pay is roughly 28 Euros/Hrs.
You will need at least 2/3 of you allowances if you want to live in a European standard house or apartment and don't forget that if you need to go to the doctor or loose your medical etc... the coverage here is a lot less than what we are used to in Europe.
So I don't really think that you would be able to get twice your European salary after all is paid...
Lot of guys realize now that they have made a mistake and are looking to move to another company.

StuckinFZ

Fact is that it is getting more expensieve in Dubai and FZ is not ready to give us a proper pay rise. On A Scale we are doing ok, I admit, but the people on B-Scale is getting shafted. As for the rest of poor management and Kandahar flights etc....... Night and Day alternating rosters, that could be fixed for free.... But the airline is not willing to do anything about that either......

Spit The Dummie

It's been reported that a very senior member of flydubai 'Cabin Crew / In Flight Service Management' has been putting-it-about (in the purely 'oral' sense) that the impending exodus of flydubai pilots, towards Etihad in particular, could easily be thwarted through nothing more than a phone call from GAG to his opposite number down the road in Etihad,... much the same as the similar arrangement also put in place between Emirates and flydubai, wrt stymying the the movement of pilots between the airlines.

One doubts however that Abu Dhabi's airline would actually give a ****! Indeed they might actually relish the chance to procure a lot of very experienced & capable pilots, from one of their Dubai competitors and, as such, they are probably rubbing their hands with glee, remembering all the aircraft that Etihad have on order, plus their own present chronic shortage of pilots!

And just imagine the mayhem (wrt grounded aircraft & loss of face for 'Dubai' ) that Etihad / Abu Dhabi could cause if they 'coordinated' the resignations of those they've recruited from within flydubai?!

Alas, with an endemically poor management skills base, plus a correspondingly even worse attitude (certainly so within certain tiers of management) it's probably too late that the penny is finally dropping, wrt the plight that they have 'managed' to produce around themselves within flydubai. But, with their typical knee-jerk reaction (and 'jerk' is indeed the word to describe them!), their response is seemingly to resort to yet more 'spoiling' & 'bully-boy' tactics, in a no doubt desperate attempt to stop an impending pilot exodus?!

But here's a thought. Rather than trying to implement yet another ban on the movement of staff between various UAE airlines, maybe GAG should simply sack some of the muppets in Upper-Middle Management, Safety, Rostering & HR, who've induced this crisis?!

Guided accordingly

Wiz ( and wannabes)

Please read all of above and take note !

None of the pilots here are as thrilled about the recent exciting developments, (kandahr et al), as my friend dubaigong would have you believe. Many are re considering their longer term futures with flydubai. By that I mean they fall into a few catagories ; 1. Activley looking for other jobs, 2. Returning to old jobs ( ie furloughed ), 3. playing the waiting game and summing up leaving vs. Bonds, End of service benefit, vs Tennancy contacts, etc etc
.
There are of course many sitting on the fence, they will be the guys left in 6 to 12 months. Either way, be assured that many have changed their opinions recently and no longer view this as long term. Retention will be the bigger issue.

The fz business plan was based on flights to india and cheap expendable crew that would leave within 3 years due unsustainable schedules and low cost airline lifestyle. However the Indian govt blocked Indian flights so Fz cleverly found other destinations to make up the shortfall. Nothing wrong with this, in fact all credit to the commercial dept, except the crew were recruited to join a low cost airline and not military charter operator flying into war zones! The security dept and management have struggled to convince Pilots, Cabin Crew and in some cases themselves (CP meeting anyone?). The security brief is vague, incomplete ( almost funny !) and differs from the daily updates that can easily be found online. Confidence lost as many doubts, questions and fears go simply unanswered. The company advice is to check your insurance policy. It maybe the biggest aviation cock up ever !

On another note, interesting that EK recruitment was in the office today…

mmmmm ?

Diz

Dear dubaigong,
I'm not from Eu..and where I'm from I get less than 4500euros/month all in after tax..It's a big increase to get 5100AED..that's why I'm still considering..

What about this exodus to EY etc?do they hire non rated DECs?I've been told at one of their roadshow,EY at the moment are hiring Tri/e B777 only..for NG we don't have much choice.

So now I'll just wait and see.

GAITH AL GAITH

The other day there was a guy who was round like a football was seen in Gaiths office trying to blow him because he badly wanted the job so all you guys there be aware of him and one important thing is that his interview was conducted after office hours and loud bangs were heard .

StuckinFZ

This keeps getting better and better. Talk about crapping up something with real potential. COO that is as ball-less as the eunuchs in the old egypt. A CP that is like a hand puppy and a chief of security that is clueless, add to this a dyslectic chief of training. What a Team!!!!!!


Well. Let the second mayhem begin when these captains that can not fly properly in cavok is starting to land in blowing sand with that HUD.

dubaigong

Dear StuckinFZ,

I don't know what your position is at FZ but for sure you have a strong opinion about the capacity of some of us.
I hope for you that other pilots at FZ don't have the same opinion about you and your performance.
I don't know what gives you the right to make such statement about other captains who , according to you , are not able to fly in cavok conditions and also to be very rude about most of the management.
We may disagree with them and be very disappointed BUT this doesn't give us the right to insult them.
You should moderate your comments on a public site and if you really have the proof of what you are saying then you should report it as soon as possible to the company and these pilots should be re-trained.
The comment you made is also very serious as it means that not only the pilots concerned are targeted BUT also the recruitment team and process , the training team including CAE and CTC as these pilots should have been stopped or given more training IF YOU ARE RIGHT of course.
Now , my experience here , shows that some people frustrated not to be where they would like to be are really prompt to criticized others but they should look first at their own performance.