New rostering rules at EK
Join Date: Mar 2005
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Can we still call it a bonus or Profit share?
if the company makes $1 Billion then we get two weeks. If the profit is greater, then 25% of the surplus.
Depending of your position as Captain or F/O you will have reduction of your bonus this year. If we get 4.5 weeks like last year. Take your basic + your flight pay salary for the year divided by 52 weeks X 4.5 and this should be the bonus for your work for the year. So depending on how much you've worked dictates your bonus. If your worked a lot you get a smaller bonus. If you worked less and be unproductive you get more. Why? Because you don't get the bonus applied to your flight hours. What a funny way to reward your employees for their work... probably a manager idea. Work less get more. Work more get less. Can you be more
then that? Greed greed greed... Thinking about it, let's start a thread about this subject.Keep discorering
Last edited by ekpilot; 16th Feb 2008 at 08:01. Reason: missing text
Join Date: Jul 2006
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My point is that if everyone who threatened this on Pprune actually did leave, EK would be in trouble.
Dude there is like 20 of you?? What difference would it make?
Dude there is like 20 of you?? What difference would it make?
Join Date: Sep 2003
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cadidalhopper - dude (if that's the term to use) you have way missed the point. All these little things and not so little things add up. Yes guys will threaten to leave, a few will, many are looking for other jobs at this moment. Eventually everyone gets to the point where they have had enough of the back stabbing, decreasing pay (in real terms with spiralling inflation - 36% at last look), changes in rostering, increasing levels of fatigue, lack of management support, bonus not reflecting profit made by company, lack of leave, pitiful pay rises no matching inflation, lack of communication between managment and pilots, decreasing morale etc etc. The list grows by the day.
As for the bonus I have almost reached the point of apathy, unfortunately as much as I would like it to be a good bonus and be followed by a good pay rise I know that it will not be what we expect, it will not be what we want, it will be considerably lower, lots of cabin crew will leave, flight crew morale wil drop further, more guys will get the 'who gives a sh*t' attitude, more guys will call sick. The spiral downwards will contuinue, managment will keep their heads firmly stuck in the sand believing we are the best.
PS Why have I not left - I am waiting until my kids leave school then I'm off, I stay purely for stability for them, no other reason - I get job offers regularly. However this rostering change is getting me very close to leaving, I will have to see how it works out for me!!!
As for the bonus I have almost reached the point of apathy, unfortunately as much as I would like it to be a good bonus and be followed by a good pay rise I know that it will not be what we expect, it will not be what we want, it will be considerably lower, lots of cabin crew will leave, flight crew morale wil drop further, more guys will get the 'who gives a sh*t' attitude, more guys will call sick. The spiral downwards will contuinue, managment will keep their heads firmly stuck in the sand believing we are the best.
PS Why have I not left - I am waiting until my kids leave school then I'm off, I stay purely for stability for them, no other reason - I get job offers regularly. However this rostering change is getting me very close to leaving, I will have to see how it works out for me!!!
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Mini
You reflect very accurately the greatest part of EKs workforce. I think a lot of FAs and groundhogs will leave after the "bonus", feeling that these idiots can now shove it up their own other "#nus". Those stuck with kids or other obligtions will adopt eklawyers attitude and compensate with sickies or at least the "i don't give a s#*t" work attitude.
Someone finally has to look after your health, the company declared war on your body, so there is only yourself left.
It will be interesting to see what happens after the first generation of major graduations ..... My kids done ... i'm gone.
You reflect very accurately the greatest part of EKs workforce. I think a lot of FAs and groundhogs will leave after the "bonus", feeling that these idiots can now shove it up their own other "#nus". Those stuck with kids or other obligtions will adopt eklawyers attitude and compensate with sickies or at least the "i don't give a s#*t" work attitude.
Someone finally has to look after your health, the company declared war on your body, so there is only yourself left.
It will be interesting to see what happens after the first generation of major graduations ..... My kids done ... i'm gone.
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Take take take, that's the new EK way
In the past 2-3 years, they took away our credits for leave (making it now guaranteed days off, not paid leave), took away the credits for reserve and simulator, the ground school is replaced by CBT on your own time, and now they limit the days off to increase productivity, what's next? The airline wants to increase it's pilots work force by 25% this year. It took them over 20 years to achieve the 2000 pilots status and want to grow by that much in a single year when they are cutting and cutting and cutting while achieving record profits....Good luck. The inflation is a record high with a currency at record low, so bad that the government employees get a 70% pay increase to compensate, we get a net salary decrease year after year.
Keep on discovering (or recruiting! would be a better word)
Keep on discovering (or recruiting! would be a better word)
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Of course. They had to get them out on Thursday. That in itself is proof that they have been tampering and know that many will be very annoyed at what they see. They always publish bad news for Terms and Conditions on a Thursday so everyone has the weekend to digest it and accept it.
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Got my March roster also....
Being in second bottom group all I can say is that I am pleasantly surprised with my March roster
(Feb was not toooo bad either....)
Told my wife it were my superior bidding skills at work...
Honestly after 2 months I'm quite happy with the new bidding rules.
Being in second bottom group all I can say is that I am pleasantly surprised with my March roster
(Feb was not toooo bad either....)
Told my wife it were my superior bidding skills at work...
Honestly after 2 months I'm quite happy with the new bidding rules.
Join Date: Mar 2005
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Poor us, just got optimized again and some are happy...
That's is how it will be. The guys in lower bids will get better rosters for a while of course. Since you can't get more then 14 days off in the upper bids you get more flights assigned. But wait a minute. What is going to happen in the long run? More planes, more flights, more hours. No problem there is now room to fit much more flights with much less pilots available and for cheaper. If we have to create rosters with more than the monthly hours no problem. Make them all do 100 hours and more. This way we pay them less for those hours, because after the monthly hours you don't get 12% or 15% in your provident fund, And if you are senior the money they give you doesn't cover your hourly rate... for those who can calculate it. So for now it looks like the bottom guys have nice schedule. I am top this month and can definitely see an flight extra that i never had to do before this change. You guys have no idea... they did not do this change for nothing i promise you. It will hurt in the long run that's for sure. There will be no planes grounded here as long as there are people. They will make us work 140 hours a month, and find a way to say we work less. Just before the pay review! You really have to be an idiot to think you will get more money. If you work 10 hours to get 100$ you don't get more if you get 120$ and work 12 hours. Wait and see the new changes that will come with the pay review. It's written all over the walls. Last year was the flight pay. This year? Some will still be "happy".
Keep Discovering
Keep Discovering
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If you are augmenting you only log the hours you are in the seat- if you are the operating crew you log the whole block time.
Flight duty starts one hour before departure, even for ULH flights, and finishes at the on blocks time. There is no allowance for post-flight duties.
Flight duty starts one hour before departure, even for ULH flights, and finishes at the on blocks time. There is no allowance for post-flight duties.
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EK Lawyer - Spot on.
Its all about more hours out of less pilots. "Productivity Pay" is another way to say you get paid at half the hourly rate you actually cost on a normal roster.
This change is simply setting the foundations to extract more hours in future.
We can all look forward to higher average hours per month.
As for the pay review, the idiots will all say "Its great, I'm happy" because they are too stupid to figure out that they are actually losing.
Its all about more hours out of less pilots. "Productivity Pay" is another way to say you get paid at half the hourly rate you actually cost on a normal roster.
This change is simply setting the foundations to extract more hours in future.
We can all look forward to higher average hours per month.
As for the pay review, the idiots will all say "Its great, I'm happy" because they are too stupid to figure out that they are actually losing.
Join Date: May 2001
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New rules mmmm I have no doubt that a big thanks should in large part go to the Prima Donna TREs and TRIs who would constantly whinge and moan at there regular little get togethers about how unfair it was that worthless line pilots could get 10 days off in a row but we can't
...... this amongst all the other sookie laa laas they carry on with.
So of course management respond to the only group they get to hear from in the only way they know how......bring everyone down to the same level.
Thanks a lot fellas.
...... this amongst all the other sookie laa laas they carry on with.So of course management respond to the only group they get to hear from in the only way they know how......bring everyone down to the same level.
Thanks a lot fellas.
Last edited by Bird On; 28th Feb 2008 at 09:27.
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Bird On, careful what you say. I heard the trainers fought the line pilots case at the last meeting, I think you ought to retract your statement. The Company want a crap roster for you so you join training !!!
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Bird On, You are wrong. I was present at our "last little meeting" as you put it.
Quite a few of us challenged Ed on his decision. The first question that was raised, over this particular issue; Why was the pilot group not included in this decision? And then we stepped up the debate on this issue and many others too, like profit share,general pay rise and inflation etc... So, wind your neck in sparrow!!
Check 'Six'
Quite a few of us challenged Ed on his decision. The first question that was raised, over this particular issue; Why was the pilot group not included in this decision? And then we stepped up the debate on this issue and many others too, like profit share,general pay rise and inflation etc... So, wind your neck in sparrow!!
Check 'Six'
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Know about the last trainers meeting thanks. Its nice you have a forum to discuss such issues, unlike the line scum. Thanks again for raising all those issues. Not much in the way of answers though was there!!!!!
For months and months now trainers have been bending the ear of management with all their woes. Scummy line pilots getting better trips, better rosters, more days off, more productivity pay(as if they hadn't worked for it) etc etc.To improve their own conditions trainers have continued to hold up what little perceived advantages the line pilots had as some kind of easy yardstick to springboard off.
In this case the complaining backfired. Instead of bowing to the trainers and saying "your right to be fair we're going to give all you guys 11 days off in a row too", management just took the option away from everyone. Of course their was some reaction by trainers after the event. Now when they go back to the line either forced or voluntarily(as many will end up doing) one of the few benefits of flying the line has gone. So please don't get all altruistic on me. Of the many trainers I have spoken to at Emirates, not one has ever said they decided to get into training because they actually want to help and contribute to the development of other pilots. ( I think we all now the usual answers by now)
Of course its not entirely the fault of trainers, but seeds get sown, watered and grow in the minds of endearing managements such as EK's, so one thing we don't need any of is white-anting, not even just a little bit.
Anyway enough....your an incredibly talented group and I really do Luv Ya's.
For months and months now trainers have been bending the ear of management with all their woes. Scummy line pilots getting better trips, better rosters, more days off, more productivity pay(as if they hadn't worked for it) etc etc.To improve their own conditions trainers have continued to hold up what little perceived advantages the line pilots had as some kind of easy yardstick to springboard off.
In this case the complaining backfired. Instead of bowing to the trainers and saying "your right to be fair we're going to give all you guys 11 days off in a row too", management just took the option away from everyone. Of course their was some reaction by trainers after the event. Now when they go back to the line either forced or voluntarily(as many will end up doing) one of the few benefits of flying the line has gone. So please don't get all altruistic on me. Of the many trainers I have spoken to at Emirates, not one has ever said they decided to get into training because they actually want to help and contribute to the development of other pilots. ( I think we all now the usual answers by now)
Of course its not entirely the fault of trainers, but seeds get sown, watered and grow in the minds of endearing managements such as EK's, so one thing we don't need any of is white-anting, not even just a little bit.
Anyway enough....your an incredibly talented group and I really do Luv Ya's.
