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Gulf Air: More A330 Direct Entry FO !?

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Gulf Air: More A330 Direct Entry FO !?

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Old 26th May 2006, 08:03
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Gulf Air: More A330 Direct Entry FO !?

The new A330 Direct Entry FO are in Bahrain. A group of 6 is now under training, more will follow in the next weeks and months. I have nothing against these individuals, but more against our management.

As a reminder, here is our VPO point of view:
"Recruitment of Direct Entry First Officers on the A330: In the last year, we recruited 16 First Officers directly onto the A330 to facilitate the release of A330/340 First Officers to the A320 for Command. This year we shall have to take a similar path in order to adhere to our previously stated goals of upgrading to Captain from within and of movement onto the A330/340 from the A320 and B767. In fact, without this entry stream, all command upgrade and any other fleet movement would be impossible."

Can't you fill these position by transfering A320 FO? Not only your are pissing your 320 crews off, but you will soon see some of these A330 DE FO jumping ship, give them 500H or 1000H on A330 and they will go back to Europe or to Asia etc. That's a fact.

Should I remember you also that the A320 fleet is under continous (and especially the last weeks) great 'rostering' pressure? It is only the beginning of the summer... Even our chief pilot says so: "We all know there is a crew shortage on the A-320 fleet. It is critical we maintain fleet coverage as best as we can during these difficult times. This is hopefully changing soon, but you are all asked to help the company as best as you can with your continued hard work, dedication, and dealing with the constant changes to all of our rosters.(I LOVE THIS LAST SENTENCE-CAPT NASSER IT HAS BEEN ALWAYS DIFFICULT TIMES SINCE I JOINED 2 YEARS AGO...Do you remember DEC05/JAN06 and last summer and etc...)"

To the management: I give you a first hint: hire ONLY A320 FO, I know you are doing it, but you have to increase the numbers, make these guys progress in your company and then they will stay longer with you. (I have a question for you, how do you see the career progression of one of these A330 DE FO? you think they will stay 10 years on 330/340 to wait for a command on A320: NO, they will all go after few months / years for better conditions)

Second hint: transfer your FOs from within your fleets. It might reduce the number of people jumping ship, again by giving them a better career progression.

(Maybe you just dont care about career progression (and making your employees happy) - you are maybe just filling gaps so in that case dont call yourself management - because everybody is capable of this)

Last hint: don't tell things to people you can not do. There is a growing number of unhappy A320 FO: you promise them (as they joined) a quick A340 transfer (course dates and names published and presented to us), most of them are still waiting. You recently cancelled an A340 transfer course, even more recently you reduced the july transfer course from 6 to 2. Where are we going? FO will resign go back home (BA/AF/LH-US/Canada?) fly for Dragonair, Cathay, All Nippon Cargo, Virgin etc. Plenty of jobs everywhere...

Not to mention that we are working very hard for less/same money than our colleagues on the long haul fleet (compare a 12hours duty on 320 and on 330/340). It is a fact since Gulf Air closed the AUH base. Too many sectors a day and not enough time away, so the salary is not good enough. Ok I have to be fair: thanks for the 3% but dont forget the 5% in July! By the way I am still waiting for the review of our housing/schooling allowances...

I am also aware that's not the only "problem" we have in Gulf Air. See the 767 upgrade of A330/340 FOs ...

So what is the next step if management continues this way ? I have an idea, but will you follow? Or am I the only one feeling this way ?!

If I am really the only one, I might have to go and get chill pills,foot massage, and call sick !

Last edited by goufair; 26th May 2006 at 08:15.
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Old 26th May 2006, 10:04
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Devil

Spot on Goufair

The exodus process is on his way. Already 5 a320 f/o jumped ship and many more to come...

chief pilot says so: "We all know there is a crew shortage on the A-320 fleet. It is critical we maintain fleet coverage as best as we can during these difficult times. This is hopefully changing soon, but you are all asked to help the company as best as you can with your continued hard work, dedication, and dealing with the constant changes to all of our rosters
Ok cpt Nasser for changes in rosters but please apply and follow strictly OM A regulations. I had enough to fight for my right with rostering! enough is enough

Can't you fill these position by transfering A320 FO? Not only your are pissing your 320 crews off, but you will soon see some of these A330 DE FO jumping ship, give them 500H or 1000H on A330 and they will go back to Europe or to Asia etc. That's a fact.
All 330 canadians will leave in a very short time. They just wait the first opportunity.(harmony will get A330 in 2007) A swiss guy who is sick for more then 2 months is also looking for a new job in Europe. Many more to come...

Ok I have to be fair: thanks for the 3% but dont forget the 5% in July! By the way I am still waiting for the review of our housing/schooling allowances...
We are all waiting a massive improvement. Not only the july 5%.


my last word: Management don't play with the fire because one day you will get burned

fly high
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Old 26th May 2006, 13:38
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So why don't you guys just leave and call their bluff. Sounds like you are very unhappy and don't trust management, maybe it's time to move on. Bye!!!
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Old 26th May 2006, 13:50
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???

HARMONY to get 330's in 2007? What are ya? A fortune teller? What makes you think that they are even gonna be in the running for a job there...? Remember how they got their first jet job? Most guys I know (those who hire pilots to decent jobs) back in Canada wouldn't go near em...
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Old 26th May 2006, 14:42
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goufair

Spot on but let me tell you something management don't give rats a## any of as long as they are holding on that big office the VPO, me and others have been here for 9 years and just got F###ed big time and now its just mater of time as soon as i get the job offer am out enough as you said lots of jobs out there.GOOD luck cos you will need it mate 2 years you got long way to go
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Old 26th May 2006, 15:14
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Angel

left coster
Yes Harmony is in serious talk with airbus to get a fleet change from boieng 757 to A330. A fortune teller? Not at all just fact in the latest Airbus newsletter. If you are talking about the ex jetsgo guys , let me tell you that almost all of them have applied to Air Transat... Of course I agree with you if they get hired this is unfair regarding of the policy "pay to fly jet "
jack bauer
No worries mate. If I leave i will invite you to my bash party I will also offer you a vaseline pot you will maybe need it one day This item is not provided by GF management
joe monsoon
9 years respect
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Old 26th May 2006, 15:18
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Somebody call the Guinness book of records, this nob can use 15 smilies AND the word vaseline in one post!!! Gotta be a record, and what a communicator eh! I almost understood some of it.
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Old 26th May 2006, 15:34
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good boy
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Old 26th May 2006, 17:47
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After a year in GF I realize the whole company is about crisis management. When GF start reassessing their HOUSING and SCHOOL FEES allowance and keep people here who want to stay then I will stick around longer. If not i have 2 years to go and wont stay a day longer. I heard the last time these 2 benefits were reviewed was 17 years ago.
If you are single living in BAH you can save some BD. If you are married and have 2 kids at school here then the best investment you can make is a rice cooker. I dont expect the earth but a standard which equates to the kind of profession aviation is.....
If you are from the banks of the Orinoco or an ex-Soviet state then GF perhaps is a real el-dorado. If you are from Europe,Oz or Canada then your flying career here will be charity work.
For the people who have joined this company on the A330 as an FO people resent you. You earn more lolly than people who have been with the company for over 2 years on the A320. Its not personnel of course as top brass make these informed descisions.

When i wake up for the mourning and look at myself in the mirror while having a shave its hard not to see MUG written on the forehead.
All spelling mistakes are entirely my own and deliberate.
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Old 27th May 2006, 02:09
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Pico Pico Pico...

What's the date on that Airbus newsletter? Old news I'm afraid...The main reason to look at wide body AC at HARMONY was to determine a fit for Asia. A fact Airbus seemed to omit was that HARMONY was looking at BOTH competitors...(!) And Boeing was pushing the B767 and it was ahead according to my sources! But to add to it all, Asia is on hold for a while (2years plus?) due the very fact that wide body prices (buy or lease) are WAY beyond what any small operator can afford and have ya seen the price of jet fuel these days? (just for you!) Why would anyone start a skinny route to anywhere with no guarantee of asses in seats, or cargo below (unless it's an ME carrier) So there you have it...better re-assess that plan to get out of there.
Cheers!
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Old 27th May 2006, 19:25
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if you referring to the ex jetsgo guys here pico-bello...you are full of "brown-25"...another fine product from the "uranus corporation"......
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Old 28th May 2006, 04:35
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DE policy and retiring age

Hi there!

Goufair, very nice post and I share exacly the same point of view as you do concerning the DEs.

1) no direct entries of any form. GF has enough qualified pilots to transfer from within its rank for upgrades.

2) GF changed its OM-A to suit this. When I joined it was clearly stated that new joiners would go to the 767 or 320 only! So, in the middle of the game, we're changing the rules. And the reasons are not strong enough.

Rostering is chaotic last few weeks, all back to normal! LMCs, illegal blocks and delaying flights to get your minimum rest after you fight with them. It's a lost cause, because our chief pilot won't do anything to solve this. He rathers squeeze his pilot corps then to adress rostering situation with his superiors. Or am I expeculating here? Maybe just a wild guess...


Retiring age

Some of our captains are about to be retired, or maybe not.
If they don't go pension now and fly for another 5 years, this will adversely affect our career progression. Contract pilots have been extended...
Maybe I should even follow the advice of the " very happy" bunch, maybe I'll pack and go. The door is open, isn't?

Just I think that changing a job is not like changing a shirt, gents. You have to build time to build senioriry.
But if seniority means nothing with GF, then I'm not losing anything, am I?

Safe flights and let us enjoy the 50°C cockpits with broken APUs!

LNB
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Old 28th May 2006, 05:00
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Maybe the Jetsgo guys aren't applying to Harmony, but sure as **** they're applying to Air Canada if they applied at Transat
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Old 29th May 2006, 07:20
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Well, as a former Jetsgo guy and one who knowa the others I can assure you we are not applying to Air Transat. There may be one but the rest of are not.

As for your comment that all the Canadian guys are leaving soon--plain false!!!!! If the housing and school allowance issues are not resolved then some guys may leave for more money elsewhere or a captain slot elsewhere but right now I don't know anyone who plans to leave.

I am not arguing that there are not problems at GF but please don't make blind posts about the 'Canadians/Jetsgo' guys leaving in what is a feeble attempt to make a point.
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Old 31st May 2006, 18:56
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Goufair, LDG.
Good well made comments and very true. Additionally to the new A330 hires being trained now CCQ’s to 340 will be going on for the batch that was taken on last year. In reality depending on resignations they could easily be up to capacity for the next 3-4 months at least, goodbye to fleet transfer. That’s a minimum of 24 transfers cancelled or deferred to take on direct widebody guys. I cannot understand the reasoning on this. I know there is only a certain amount of capacity on 320 training but this amount is unacceptable.

It’s as been mentioned before: crisis management, and until somebody in management {HOFO? CEO?} is spurred on by ‘peaceful protest’ by us, has the balls to confront the fleet planning and training departments, and stop the mal treatment of his workforce then things will continue to be the same. Once people realize there is no hope of things improving and we get 500-1000hrs 320 time we will leave. Regardless of what your contract says! I suggest you completely disregard Mr NA’s call to the troops and work to rule, take sickness when too tired, do not answer your fone to ops on any occasion unless an hour before check in. perhaps when productivity is at an all-time low they will really try to get to the root of the problem. Yes there will be warning letters for all sorts of crazy stuff, these are called chief pilot tantrums.

Older guys in the company say it will never change, but the world is changing guys! And job market prospects and aircraft purchases are at an all time high. True, but there will be a larger turnover of pilots; lost business opportunities; and ultimately a change in senior management, who will blame our current management on the state of the airline. It seems that only strong protest with a job offer in your hand has anybody taking notice.

Resigning before you contract ends and bonding issues are well travelled roads now. An unconcerned chief pilot who embellishes JB’s attitude and says ‘thanks and don’t forget to shut the door’ recently tried to scupper peoples job prospects by personally phoning HR departments and telling them that their new hires were effectively criminals in Bahrain and would not be allowed entry! This, after all reasonable attempts had been made to resolve the bond issues before they left, were then cleared by a Bahrain attorney, as there is no application in Bahrain law of a charge for training costs. Any loans or outstanding monetary debts are a civil issue and do not have any bearing on immigration. That’s not to say they may come up with another way to prevent there slaves running away. How about contacting the Mossad, they will track them down to the last, lets face it you don’t expect the GFA management to do the job do you?

Remember your interview boys? 2000+ BD’s a month, free GFA accommodation, improving rosters with bidding and requests, 8-12 months fleet transfer? Great standard of living!

…. We wish you success wherever you may go…….?

WB
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Old 1st Jun 2006, 06:30
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WB
looks like the chief pilot isn't the only one to do that!! A well known CEO from a foremost low cost carrier in the Far East has been doing that for sometime now. Absolutely scandalous! Brings new meaning to free movement of labour.
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Old 1st Jun 2006, 06:37
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It's their Airline

I don't get you guys sometimes..It's their airline, we're on contract....They can do whatever they want. It's the likes of you that p155es these guys of and spoil it for everone. When will pilots learn that they are GUESTS in another country when they're not in their own? Otherwise, go and fly some bug smasher in the Ozzie outback, you ungrateful people.
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Old 1st Jun 2006, 08:34
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Sal-e has it right guys. Don't want to sound like I'm a fan of management who do this kind of stuff, but if you don't like it move on. If it takes you more than 5 minutes here to realise that you CANT change the system then you are a fool. You come here and enjoy the lifestyle and take the money, if you are patient then command and widebody will definitely happen. If you are not patient then go away to one of the many jobs that are out there and stop pissing in the sandbox. Honestly nobody cares about the idle threats you make, you just end up sounding nieve and inexperienced. If you think things are bad in GF just take a look at the posts from the other Gulf Airlines and you will soon realise that things in Bahrain are a lot better.
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Old 1st Jun 2006, 08:45
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Jackbauer - hear hear!!

Been with the company a few months and in my opinion it's an awesome company to work for. SURE, the money is not the best and SURE there are problems with rostering and management. HOWEVER, we chose to be in this profession and to work for somebody else. Unless you are your own boss and in a position to call shots, best to accept the way things are being run. I have friends at Emirates and the problems we have seem mundane compared to that side of the sand dunes. Qatar sounds even worse from what Ive heard.

Where I come from command or transition to a wide body wont happen in less than 10 years so if I have to sit in a 320 for 3-5 years, I aint going to complain.

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Old 1st Jun 2006, 19:22
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I would say this:

You can complain--- just do it constructively!

Make an appointment with the VPO or HOFO (or Hogan for that matter) with a well thought out and complete arguement and see the response. Also be aware that the issues you think important are often large or difficult to handle/change at a management level. You might be suprised by some candid answers on why things are the way they are.

This is not to say that there are not issues at GF-- but whinning on a public forum is fruitless. I would go so far as to say the 'hiding' on a public forum is even worse- take it to management face to face.
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